The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 12, 2013, 09:49 AM   #1
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
strange & crazy times... 22 lr, 22 mag, 25 auto, even 32 auto... really ???

does anyone else find it strange that so many mouse gun calibers are suffering from the same shortages as common stuff??? I mean, I get the 9's, & 223's.... but really don't get the 22's, & mouse gun calibers...

I'm finishing up my walk in gun safe, & displaying alot of guns that have been put away for a long time... among those, a bunch of vintage Czech 32 & 380 autos, as well as my several 25 acp's... been trying to put together some ammo for these guns, since they are now fresh in my mind, & can't believe that 25 acp bullets ( for example ) are out of stock for months, as are anything related to 32 acp ( who shoots 32 acp ??? why the demand ??? )

does anyone else find it strange that this stuff is out of stock... primers are bad enough, but when you can't buy 22's or brass for 25 & 32 acps... strange world we're living in
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 11:36 AM   #2
Dan Newberry
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 3, 2012
Location: Wytheville, VA
Posts: 215
The ammo makers are likely limiting the runs of less popular cartridges, to dedicate more line time to the more common stuff.

And here's a good read...

http://www.stevequayle.com/index.php?s=33&d=285
__________________
www.BANGSTEEL.com
Practical Long Range Rifle Courses...
Optimal Charge Weight handload consulting
Dan Newberry is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:21 PM   #3
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
In my opinion...
.22LR is scarce because everyone who shoots is afraid to use up their center fire ammo, so they are shooting a -LOT- more rimfire. Furthermore, folks ran out to buy ammo (all at the same time) and they keep finding empty shelves...yet they have money in their hands. So they are buying up any/all rimfire they find.

As for .25 and .32, I don't think it's a direct hit on these. This is stuff that is a horribly tiny percentage of the market. Nobody keeps a large stock of .25 cal component handgun bullets. Nobody. So the four guys on the planet who are actually handloading .25 ACP at the bench (like everyone else) simply added a slew of component .25cal handgun bullets to their most recent "panic!" supply order.

Something like, "Gimme primers! Gimme 9mm FMJ! Gimme once fired .45 brass! Gimme 16 pounds of W231!!!"

"Well, we only have 1k primers. 9mm slugs sold out last week. No brass in any size. W231, I've got a single 1-pound and it's $29.50"

"Okay, you got any .25 cal FMJ component slugs?"

"Yes, I've got 22,000 of them, had them since 1986."

"I'LL TAKE THEM!"

No component manufacturer is going to produce a single .25 cal handgun bullet in the next 24 months. They'll use their equipment, labor, time and materials to build 9mm, .40 and .45 cal slugs. It's not like the just press a different button to get those little pills. They have to shut down a machine and re-tool it. That's never going to happen for a round that almost nobody needs or wants.

I ran in to exactly the same problem in 08/09 with regards to 85-100 grain .312" component jacketed bullets for .327 Federal Magnum. I am certain that there wasn't a bunch of panic buying and runs on .32 cal component slugs and the entire American market most certainly did NOT jump on the extremely well marketed hot new .327 Federal round.

Instead...I went looking for an oddball component that NEVER had much of a supply and no manufacturer in their right mind was going to spend even 10 minutes producing that product for me and three other TFL Forum guys who realkly, really wanted to handload some screamin' hot .32's.

So whatever dusty stuff had been laying on shelves for the last 5 years was in the market...and not a single other slug was to be had. When those sold... the .312" component jacketed slugs simply no longer existed on the market.
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:25 PM   #4
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
To add to my story (for anyone still AWAKE)

A nice guy from our little forum here in Oklahoma saw my crying over the fact that I couldn't find any of these slugs and mentioned that me might have seen them in one of his haunts, and said he'd stop by to see if they had any. And they DID, four boxes of them! He bought them and shipped them to me and best I can tell, he tried his dangdest to charge me TOO little for them.

If that wasn't enough, he sent me a little package out of the blue with some .32cal slugs he had casted himself -- absolutely gorgeous bullets in three different flavors, one of them with gas checks on 'em!!!

Lemme tell you, if I ever get a hold of THAT guy, #$%#&$!

Thanks, Rusty, if you are still out there!

Heckuva guy.
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:34 PM   #5
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
so... I guess my timing sucks... woulda coulda shoulda bought this stuff 6 months ago... just wasn't ready to put together ammo for those old guns at that time...

I do realize I'm sorely short of small pistol primers... I have 10 chamberings that expressly take small pistol primers... not counting the 32 & 357 magnums that I'd load with SPM primers, or 22 Hornet, 32-20 & like, Contenders & revolvers that I'd use small rifle primers in those anyway...

guess I'll just go back to polishing my brass
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:40 PM   #6
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
Naaa, if you have small rifle primers, you are in good shape. At least one company has stated in the past that their small rifle non-mag and their small pistol magnum -IS- the same primer.

As long as the firearm you are using has enough jam in the hammer/striker to slap that little puppy and you can re-work the load, small rifle primers can be used across the board.

There are some folks who no longer buy small pistol non-mag primers ever, and use small rifle for everything.
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:45 PM   #7
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
I know I'm better off than alot... I do have quite a few small rifle primers ( should use up that big huge box of Federals just to get rid of it anyway ) got several boxes of Remington, & CCI & another box of Winchesters as well as a couple boxes of Remington Bench Rest, that I've been saving...

BTW... anyone know or have a list of small rifle primer cup hardness ??? realistically I'm going to have to use some, may as well know which are the softest...
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:51 PM   #8
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
I don't believe there is a list...and it's probably drifted over time.

It's been the experience of many that Federal makes the softest cup on the market, bar none. CCI has always had a reputation of a very hard cup.
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 02:57 PM   #9
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
did a little searching & came across this... ( which does show the Federal SR primers with the thinnest of primer cup material )... also shows the Winchesters as having thinner cups... so I could probably move those two boxes over to the pistol primer section of the shelf...

http://www.jamescalhoon.com/primers_and_pressure.php
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 03:18 PM   #10
stu925
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 942
I've been known on occasion to shoot both .25ACP and .32ACP. A couple times a year I take out Dad's Walther and Ortgies and shoot them. As far as a shortage goes, it's only natural that it would carry over into other components/cartridges once the panic started. Seems like people bought up everything they could find once the supplies started drying up. I don't shoot enough of either caliber to warrant me reloading them though so you can have my share of the components for them.

Stu
stu925 is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 03:59 PM   #11
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
thanks STU... now if you could only let me know where they are...
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 04:39 PM   #12
454PB
Member
 
Join Date: February 23, 2005
Location: Helena, Mt.
Posts: 79
I'm feeling rather smug about my inventory, I learned my lesson back when Clinton was talking about forcing the primer manufacturers to develop primers with a limited (like one year) shelf life. I began to stock up.

Here's some info on primers that I found interesting:

http://www.shootingtimes.com/ammunit...909/index.html
454PB is offline  
Old February 12, 2013, 07:49 PM   #13
recon14
Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2013
Location: Northeast, Pennsylvania
Posts: 52
I too would like to reload for my wife's .25 ACP Baretta. It's a small, little in your face weapon but is sooo easy to stuff in your pocket. Thats probably the main reason I still have it. I just don't know if I can justify buying components and especially dies for something I shoot so infrequently. Anybody have any .25 dies they want to get rid of real cheap??
recon14 is offline  
Old February 13, 2013, 06:38 PM   #14
spacecoast
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Location: Sunshine and Keystone States
Posts: 4,054
Quote:
Nobody keeps a large stock of .25 cal component handgun bullets. Nobody.
Don't be too sure of that, I have 1500 such bullets (Magtech 50 gr. FMC), stockpiled over the last couple of years when I ran across deals.

Midway has .25ACP brass in stock by the way.

Last edited by spacecoast; February 13, 2013 at 08:28 PM.
spacecoast is offline  
Old February 14, 2013, 05:09 AM   #15
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
Ahem, we could quibble the terms... but in my world, 1,500 ain't no stockpile. That's a long weekend!
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

Last edited by Sevens; February 14, 2013 at 01:06 PM. Reason: came off snotty, no need for that.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 14, 2013, 06:50 AM   #16
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
yes... I have many, many 1000 - 45 caliber bullets both in weights & profiles for 45 Colt & 45 ACP... I don't shoot much 45 ACP any more, but am just finishing up a conversion on my old 30 carbine blackhawk to 45 auto / 45 Autorim, since I just bought a couple 1000 new old stock 45 Autorim cases... good thing these are older cases with LP primer pockets, since I have more of those primers than SP... guessing I'll be shooting this new build quite a bit this summer at least more than something requiring SP primers... at least till those loosen up...
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 14, 2013, 06:53 AM   #17
spacecoast
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Location: Sunshine and Keystone States
Posts: 4,054
Quote:
but in my world, 1,500 ain't no stockpile.
Maybe, but in my world (and many others I suspect), when the only .25 is a 100 year-old Colt that gets a box of ammo through it maybe once a year, that's a lifetime supply.
spacecoast is offline  
Old February 14, 2013, 07:03 AM   #18
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
agree 1500 is alot of bullets "normally" for the ol' 25 auto... I have 2 ( including a nice lil Colt & a Berdinelli ) & I think I found a source for a barrel, if in which case, I'll be switching my Ruger Single 10 over to an 8 shot 25 ACP ( machinist buddy has already checked the timing can be easily switched to 8 rounds, & he has no problem building custom single action cylinders, or adding a firing pin bushing moving it to center fire )... once that gun is completed, 1500 bullets for a gun I'll shoot alot, plus the other 2 lil autos, wouldn't seem like "too many"
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...

Last edited by Magnum Wheel Man; February 14, 2013 at 08:21 AM.
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 14, 2013, 07:58 AM   #19
YARDDOG(1)
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: GATOR COUNTRY HA HA HA!
Posts: 685
Don't shoot much of them cal. I have trouble loading .380s,, for my fat fingers ; )
Y/D
__________________
There's a GATOR in the bushes & She's Callin my name
>Molly Hatchett<
YARDDOG(1) is offline  
Old February 15, 2013, 11:12 AM   #20
Magnum Wheel Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2006
Location: Southern Minnesota
Posts: 8,121
Stopped by Cabela's the other day...

they had LP magnum primers on the shelf...

went up to one of the counter guys, & asked for "the straight dope on the primers" got a very rude reply ( guessing he's been asked 40-50 times a day or more since things got tight )

but...

yes, they are getting shipments...
no, they don't have a delivery schedule, they come when ever they come...
no, I can't put my name on a list... just check back everyday to see if they have them...

I found out E-bay is not the place to buy reloading stuff,,, dies are selling for twice what Midway typical prices are... I was looking at a primer pocket uniforming tool, Cabela's had a Lyman in stock, ( which will screw into my RCBS case prep center, & has a universal case mouth adaptor rather than a caliber specific type like RCBS uses ) for 1/2 what they were selling for on E - Bay

Hoping Midway is right on Lee die delivery date, & I can get my my 25 & 380 acp dies by the end of the month...

hmmm... wish I lived closer to Cabela's to check for primers

BTW... Midway is starting to get stuff in... just ordered 500 more 32 acp cases, & 500 bullets, mixed between XTP, s & FMJ... got my 32 acp dies a couple weeks ago, so I'm in business for the 32 acp... if I could get some replacement primers ( still not loading small pistol, until I can get replacement for what I'd use out of my stock )
__________________
In life you either make dust or eat dust...

Last edited by Magnum Wheel Man; February 15, 2013 at 11:25 AM.
Magnum Wheel Man is offline  
Old February 15, 2013, 03:09 PM   #21
spacecoast
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2009
Location: Sunshine and Keystone States
Posts: 4,054
Quote:
just ordered 500 more 32 acp cases, & 500 bullets
Sevens could go through those in about 6 minutes.
spacecoast is offline  
Old February 16, 2013, 04:49 AM   #22
Sevens
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 28, 2007
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 8,578
Those slugs -- absolutely!
That brass... wouldn't know what the heck to do with it!
__________________
Attention Brass rats and other reloaders: I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.
Sevens is offline  
Old February 16, 2013, 12:04 PM   #23
Arkmaker
Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 31
I was at the range yesterday and have never heard so many 22's going off in all time time I've been shooting.

I vote with the people are afraid to use the common calibers... So I proceeded to try out 2 New loads of 50 each in 38 spl. The guy in the next stall commented about how many rounds I shot. Gotta love reloading your own I replied
Arkmaker is offline  
Old February 16, 2013, 04:34 PM   #24
bbqncigars
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 1, 2009
Location: Iowa
Posts: 246
This latest panic should drive home a lesson to all reloaders. Buy the components for a favorite load in BULK. I'm talking enough to make a minimum of 1K loaded rounds. This does two things. The first is usually better prices. The second is standardization within one lot. The latter can be important for accuracy.
__________________
"Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most." A. Brilliant
bbqncigars is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:44 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.12601 seconds with 9 queries