The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: General Handgun Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old February 10, 2013, 11:02 PM   #1
kylefuller
Junior Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2013
Posts: 4
9mm Ballistic Gel Tests

Check out my Ballistic gel tests. I have a few more on the way, any suggestions?

https://www.youtube.com/user/NinjaVa.../videos?view=0

Thanks,

Kyle
kylefuller is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 12:43 AM   #2
Dragline45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2010
Posts: 2,422
First off, welcome to TheFiringLine!

Good to see the 135gr hydra shock performed well since it has been my carry round for the past few months. I was also surprised at how well the .22 ammo performed, especially since it is bulk ammo. Since you asked for suggestions you could always try wrapping some of the ballistic gel with denim to mimic the effect of clothing.

By the way, what did you use for ballistic gel? I have been interested in doing a few tests myself.
Dragline45 is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 01:11 AM   #3
kylefuller
Junior Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2013
Posts: 4
Just mix up clear gelatin real thick, it takes ALOT. We plan on alot of defense rounds, and then we will start adding denim, and other obstacles.

Thanks for watching, and for your reply all suggestions, or requests are welcome

Thanks guys, look forward to talking to you guys on here great forum!

Kyle
kylefuller is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 01:43 AM   #4
mrbatchelor
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2010
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 237
To "really count" as ballistic gel - beyond your scope I realize - it needs to be within some specific temperature range. I don't know what temp specifically, but a pretty nippy winter day down south or fall/spring day farther north probably makes outside a reasonably good temperature regulator. But your snowy day looks good enough.

Last edited by mrbatchelor; February 11, 2013 at 02:40 AM.
mrbatchelor is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 09:07 AM   #5
Aguila Blanca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 6,319
The temperature is supposed to be 39 degrees F. But without the formula, there's no way of knowing how closely this home brew mix approximates real ballistic gel. The real stuff is available only from two sources and it's VERY expensive.
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 10:47 AM   #6
mrbatchelor
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2010
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 237
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aguila Blanca View Post
The temperature is supposed to be 39 degrees F. But without the formula, there's no way of knowing how closely this home brew mix approximates real ballistic gel. The real stuff is available only from two sources and it's VERY expensive.
Since "ballistic gel" must necessarily be made from protein gelatin, and it's almost a guarantee that's going to be animal protein gelatin, a whole bunch of boxes of Knox are going to be pretty darn close.

I suspect that the real stuff probably has a specific gravity spec that is published. And if so then it could be duplicated so the home made gel would truly duplicate it if you had the temperature right. But your mixing controls might be a little tough to get exactly right in the back yard.

What you're paying for from the real deal guys isn't so much higher quality dead cows, but higher quality process management in the formulation. You can do that yourself, just like you can reload your own ammo. And then we absorb that cost into our personal labor.

Last edited by mrbatchelor; February 11, 2013 at 06:19 PM.
mrbatchelor is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 02:30 PM   #7
Aguila Blanca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 6,319
Quote:
Since "ballistic gel" must necessarily be made from protein gelatin, and it's almost a guarantee that's going to be animal protein gelatin, a whole bunch of boxes of Knox are going to be pretty darn close.
There are many recipes on the Internet for using grocery store Knox gelatin to approximate ballistic gel, and some of them probably do come fairly close. But there is no indication of what the mix recipe was for the original post in this thread, so there's no way to know how close it might or might not be to the real thing.
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 06:12 PM   #8
Dragline45
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2010
Posts: 2,422
Beats the hell out of gallon water jugs.
Dragline45 is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 07:39 PM   #9
kylefuller
Junior Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2013
Posts: 4
The gallon jugs dont do some rounds justice, the hydrashok is one of those. Look a some of the jug tests and most of the time you'll see a huge difference. Mine is about the same consitency of the animal protein sim gels. I went through alot of work to make the ammount i did. They have all been remelted several times and each block is of the same density.

On a side note, at some point i will get some actual gel if we do well enough, if so that will warrant a re-test.
kylefuller is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 07:48 PM   #10
KyJim
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 26, 2005
Location: The Bluegrass
Posts: 7,543
I think the tests are interesting but I don't take them real seriously because of the lack of calibration, density, etc. They're a step above wetpacks and gallon jugs of water.

If I were going to do anything approaching serious terminal ballistic testing, I would use a chronograph and invest in Sim-Test ballistic gel. It's reusable and would be a lot easier on the pocketbook than the standard gelatin used by the FBI, etc.
__________________
Jim's Rules of Carry: 1. Any gun is better than no gun. 2. A gun that is reliable is better than a gun that is not. 3. A hole in the right place is better than a hole in the wrong place. 4. A bigger hole is a better hole.
KyJim is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 07:53 PM   #11
kylefuller
Junior Member
 
Join Date: February 10, 2013
Posts: 4
I'm getting results within a 1/4" of some who are using Sim-test, the thing i do not like about sim test is the lack of clarity, you see much more in this type of gel. These are mostly for fun, and as long as i am consistent in my controls I think you could still pull data.

Thanks,

Kyle
kylefuller is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 07:59 PM   #12
mrbatchelor
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2010
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 237
At minimum I suggest cutting about 10-20 1cm x 1 cm samples as close to cubical as you can get them, preferably measureed for size at the required 39 degrees, and weigh them on as decent a scale as you can get.

You can use US coins as scale calibration standards. To ensure reasonable consistancy weigh at least 10-20 coins as well to account for coin wear. Google coin weights for the standards.

The calipers sold at most hardware stores today are pretty darned good.

Known size and known weight gives specific gravity. That's density.

So what if this doesn't give any of us a "tracable standard" for the measurements. I don't have a traceable thermometer for my lead pot either, and the bullets come out the barrel. We're not selling to the FBI.


Kodak sold the gelatin plant in Peabody MA last year so they're probably hurting for customers. Might be willing to ship bulk stuff.

Last edited by mrbatchelor; February 11, 2013 at 08:35 PM.
mrbatchelor is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 08:06 PM   #13
kinoons
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 22, 2008
Location: las vegas, NV
Posts: 386
Another option to lend credibility is a calibration shot from a BB gun. I don't have the standard infront of me, but I know it's available. Specific FPS should equal a specifc penetration into your gel. Get close to than and you have some good gel.
kinoons is offline  
Old February 11, 2013, 11:57 PM   #14
michael t
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 17, 2004
Location: Out back Ky
Posts: 3,456
shooting thru 2 layers denim pretty much standard today. Add that to your test . Lot of HP fail when shot thru the denim.
__________________
Colt Defender ,Colt Mustang ,Dan Wesson CBOB, PPK/S, American Classic,
Bersa Thunder 380
http://bersachat.comHome of Bersa
American Classic new home www.americanclassic1911forum.com
michael t is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.08685 seconds with 9 queries