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Old February 7, 2013, 05:45 PM   #1
dwcollins
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How flat of primer is acceptable

I have been searching the forums and get am a little confused about what is acceptable due to lack of pictures. Here is what my primers look like in photo 582.
9mm Spartan 1911
147g fmj
3.3 g titegroup
oal 1.155
federal primers
various brass
velocity 910fps

The other photo has my reload fired on the left and on the right is factory 115g federal fired from the same gun.
I have no problems with ejection and both seem to fit in the chamber the same and drop out easily so I know oal is ok. (factory is 1.154) my crimp is .378. So my question is (at last) Is there overpressure? Please no guesses.
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File Type: jpg CIMG0584.jpg (240.5 KB, 142 views)
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Old February 7, 2013, 06:01 PM   #2
Unclenick
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Doesn't look bad. Federal primers are a bit softer than some others. CCI is harder. The pressures in that second photo could actually be the same, as a result. Typically, what you look for on the primer is cratering, which is a raised lip around the firing pin indentation that has flowed into the firing pin tunnel around the tip of the pin, and primer mushrooming, where the bottom of the primer flows out into the chamfer of the primer pocket so its fatter than the rest of the primer. Those are both signs you are at the limits for that particular primer. May still be fine for the gun, though.
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Old February 7, 2013, 07:08 PM   #3
oldpapps
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The primers in the photos look acceptable.

Attached photo is of two cases that I have collected. NO, I did not load or shoot them. I picked them out of range pick-ups.
The one on the left is an over load!
The one on the right is a 9MM that I think was fired in a glock 40 Cal.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/atta...1&d=1360282021

Be safe,

OSOK
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Old February 8, 2013, 09:39 AM   #4
Rifleman1776
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Any flattening is an indication you might be approaching excessive pressure. As long as you still get easy extraction I wouldn't worry. Well....actually I would. I would drop back the charge by .1 or .2 of a grain and continue testing. Rarely is anything worthwhile by pushing to max-max pressures and velocities.
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Old February 8, 2013, 09:54 AM   #5
Brian Pfleuger
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Federal primers flatten, crater, mushroom, even pierce, at and below starting load in my Glock 33 357sig. I've loaded Power Pistol down to starting 9mm loads in my Sig and they still flatten/pierce/crater.

Federal are probably just fine in "old school" rounds making 18 or 20,000psi but I'd consider them unsuitable for anything in the 30,000+ psi range.
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Old February 8, 2013, 04:45 PM   #6
oneoldsap
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oldpapps , those are some ugly cases you picked up . They illustrate the reason that I never shoot on public ranges . Or even club ranges , when there are others shooting , that I don't know , and some that I do know , for that matter
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Old February 8, 2013, 04:58 PM   #7
chris in va
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Quote:
.oldpapps , those are some ugly cases you picked up . They illustrate the reason that I never shoot on public ranges . Or even club ranges , when there are others shooting , that I don't know , and some that I do know , for that matter
Wow. You'd really hate shooting at Knob Creek then. That's too bad.
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Old February 8, 2013, 05:04 PM   #8
Kayser
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Those look ok to me. In my view, flattened primers are not enough to indicate too much pressure. Necessary, but not sufficient.

My example is : I've been loading 357 mag for quite a while now. I always get flattened primers with it. I have tried everything to make them go away, including an experiment with a way downloaded charge. But they're always there. I never get flattened primers in any other cartridge in any other gun. So my conclusion was that it's a combo of the primers I use (Winchester) and the gun (a python) and has nothing to do with overpressure.
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Old February 8, 2013, 07:16 PM   #9
oldpapps
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This photo is some what out of focus.
That is/was a 9MM case, the head stamp is "P-A 9MM LUGER". The primer is very flat. The typical glock rectangle with firing pin strike has flowed back. This glock must have been a newer one with a supported head.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/atta...1&d=1360368915

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OSOK
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Old February 8, 2013, 07:26 PM   #10
Brian Pfleuger
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That looks more like a 9mm fired in a 40SW.
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Old February 8, 2013, 09:18 PM   #11
oldpapps
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"That looks more like a 9mm fired in a 40SW. "

Yep, the body and mouth are expanded and split to the size of a 40S&W. The web and head are in tack. But the primer is smeared and flowed back. The tel tail glock rectangle firing pin cut out.
My brother picked up this case and several others at a range just west of Lake City, or so I understand.

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Old February 10, 2013, 04:03 AM   #12
dacaur
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To gauge if I have a problem, I always compare them to factory loads shot through the same gun. My S&W bodygurad flattens ANYTHING I shoot out of it, factory, or mid range reload, doesn't matter.... I had a kel-tec PF9 that would crater everything shot out of it, factory and reload alike.... (traded it for the bodyguard)
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