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Old January 26, 2013, 12:50 AM   #51
hermannr
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IMHO: the house is waiting for the Senate to try something stupid so they can use it as ammo in 20014. "see, I told you so...look at what they did"
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Old January 26, 2013, 02:31 AM   #52
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@scrubcedar:

I would agree with you, but also add the 1st amendment. If they severely limited free speech and/or confiscated lots of firearms, things would get pimply. But I dont think that'll happen (in the near future)
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Old January 26, 2013, 11:43 AM   #53
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I couldn't figure out why they were pushing the agenda as hard as they are, considering how obvious it is where that pathway leads.

Then I read again Senator Feinstein's quote from 1995.
"If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them — Mr. & Mrs. America, turn them all in — I would have done it. I could not do that. The votes weren't here."

It finally hit me that they were that ignorant of the attitudes of the average citizen of the country they have been elected to serve.

What word covers this situation? Horrifying? Terrifying? I don't see those words as strong enough.
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Old January 26, 2013, 02:10 PM   #54
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Are there any pre-written letters online we can copy and send to our sheriffs about this? I never was much for book learnin.
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Old January 26, 2013, 07:27 PM   #55
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This letter from a Newtown resident was sent to The Newtown Bee editors. It expresses the mood of much of the country, this gungrab may backfire on the Gov, big time!

http://newtownbee.com/Opinions/Lette...ally+Dishonest

Quote:
Elected Officials Are Fundamentally Dishonest

MrDontPlay, search Sheriff Richard Mack. You'll find plenty of info for your local Sheriff. Good luck!
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Old January 26, 2013, 07:36 PM   #56
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Letters are good.

Financial support to the major organizations supporting our cause is also good. If you have not already, then now is the time to join the NRA, SAF, GOA, your local firearm association... Take your pick, but join and support one or more of these organizations before the time comes when you wish you had.
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Old January 27, 2013, 03:40 AM   #57
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This letter from a Newtown resident was sent to The Newtown Bee editors. It expresses the mood of much of the country, this gungrab may backfire on the Gov, big time!

http://newtownbee.com/Opinions/Lette...ally+Dishonest
That's a good one, I printed it out, I may want to use a few lines of it in my next batch of letters.
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Old January 28, 2013, 09:12 AM   #58
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The link,
http://newtownbee.com/Opinions/Lette...ally+Dishonest is no longer working.
I guess they didn't like the attention it was getting.
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Old January 28, 2013, 09:29 AM   #59
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CowTowner, the link it just fine.

http://newtownbee.com/Opinions/Lette...ally+Dishonest

What seems to happen is that some folks try to copy the text that is visible and paste that into their browser, when quoting from another post. When doing that, they are copying a truncated link. Most internet board software will shorten (truncate) long links to make it appear shorter than it actually is.

Looking at the above link, you will see a set of dots (...). That is the part that is hidden from view. Look at the link, below:

http://newtownbee.com/Opinions/Letters_to_the_Editor/2013/01-January/2013-01-10__13-58-39/Elected+Officials+Are+Fundamentally+Dishonest

See what you missed? Same link (only this one is not hyper-linked) as above, just not hidden.
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Old January 28, 2013, 09:35 AM   #60
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Thanks Al. You are absolutely correct!
The link as you posted it is working. pardon my failure to look at the link and decipher correctly.
After all, I only get paid to administrate other companies servers.
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Old January 28, 2013, 12:05 PM   #61
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I couldn't figure out why they were pushing the agenda as hard as they are, considering how obvious it is where that pathway leads.
This is DiFi's last chance to get it done. She will retire after this term, if she finishes it. This is an agenda item for her, has been for decades.

This is also an agenda item for Holder and Obama, among others, all through their "public" careers. Sandy Hook is the excuse Fast + Furious was supposed to be.

Another issue may be that Democrats sense they may not have all that much time to cement their "transformation". I guess some have to how far off center this drive is, by the reactions occurring.

Citizen disarmament is something that would help promote the end goal of the Cloward-Piven strategy. That is a dark view, but cannot be completely dismissed.
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Old January 30, 2013, 04:49 AM   #62
Bartholomew Roberts
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It is their last chance to get gun control done demographically. The demographic that grew up being fed non-stop stories of "guns are evil" by the 3 major networks is disappearing. Soon they will be outnumbered by younger people who grew up on the Internet and Call of Duty. If they don't get gun control passed now, it may be a long time until they have the opportunity to do so again.

That is why it is especially important we fight hard here. Our actions (or inaction) are going to change the course of this debate for a long time to come. The antis basically enjoyed a period from 1963-1999 where they were constantly gaining ground. 1999 was their high water mark. If we stop them here, we will grow stronger.
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Old January 30, 2013, 04:58 AM   #63
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Yep, the Baby Boomer generation believed the three major networks, the ultra left print media (NYT, AP, etc) then CNN's biased garbage about guns. Today, there are more sources of news, the internet, and more activism than ever before. It doesn't hurt that many more people, first time gun buyers and women have taken up shooting for sport and self defense. AR's are mainstream, and many see guns as the great equalizer for self defense now knowing that the police can't protect you.
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Old January 30, 2013, 10:09 AM   #64
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Hell, this "Boomer" doesn't believe you, forget the networks. Are we burning "Boomers" now?
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Old January 30, 2013, 01:46 PM   #65
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Are we burning "Boomers" now?
No, but they were the demographic for Clinton, and most gun owners I spoke with in the 1990's who just didn't see the big deal about a ban on "assault weapons" were from that age group.

Also, Jefferson Airplane. Not cool.
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Old January 30, 2013, 02:09 PM   #66
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It is their last chance to get gun control done demographically.
Well, I have no real data to support this, but I see a big increase in the diversity of people I see at the local ranges. Granted I live in a urban/suburban type area, but I think the idea of gun owners as “old white guys” is changing.

Somehow the NRA needs to find spokespersons that can appeal to this changing demographic which may actually be open to the message, but may not really care for Chuck Norris or Ted Nugent.
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Old January 30, 2013, 03:06 PM   #67
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Deeper motives

The demographic is one thing, but the Congress are the ones who vote. What I observed in 94 was the people with the means bought every AR in sight. Bill Clinton was gun salesman of the year. I feel dumb now, but I traded a takedown Savage 99 to get my hands on an AR. In my opinion, the "Boomer" generation had not realized their political power. Most of the crowd I ran with were conservative, and voted that way, but the other party held sway, at least until the next election. I think many people of the more liberal persuasion changed their views on being armed for defense. The instinct for preservation is the motivation. The Dalai Lama has spoken. Self defense is a reasonable thing!
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Old January 30, 2013, 03:22 PM   #68
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Pennsylvania has House Bill 357.

Short Title: An Act providing that any Federal law which attempts to register, restrict or ban a firearm or to limit the size of a magazine of a firearm in this Commonwealth shall be unenforceable in this Commonwealth; and imposing penalties.

This bill is gaining a fair amount of support even has it,s own facebook page (you have to bee logged in to fb for this link to work) that is up to almost 8,000 likes. I sure hope these folks are doing more than just liking the fb page and write their Reps to get this passed.
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Old January 31, 2013, 06:18 PM   #69
wyobohunter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HarrySchell View Post
Citizen disarmament is something that would help promote the end goal of the Cloward-Piven strategy. That is a dark view, but cannot be completely dismissed.
Are you drawing the connection yourself or can you cite the source of the connection? I don't doubt that many people who favor a national guaranteed income also favor disarmament. I just fail to see how one depends on the other.
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Old January 31, 2013, 08:21 PM   #70
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Are you drawing the connection yourself or can you cite the source of the connection? I don't doubt that many people who favor a national guaranteed income also favor disarmament. I just fail to see how one depends on the other.
Is this serious? Name a single gun grabber who isn't extremely in favor of welfare.
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Old January 31, 2013, 08:37 PM   #71
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Quote:
Is this serious? Name a single gun grabber who isn't extremely in favor of welfare.
Agree, and you could ask the reverse of that question as well:

Name a single politician in favor of govt enforced redistribution of wealth (per Cloward-Piven guaranteed annual income, aka welfare state) who is NOT a gun grabber.

Both issues are about dis-empowering the individual, making individuals more dependent on the govt (income and protection), and thus achieving more complete control of citizens and therefore votes.
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Old January 31, 2013, 08:45 PM   #72
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As I said, most folks that favor one also favor the other; I didn't dispute that. Can you show me where those particular professors write about disarmament and how it would help push toward the collapse of the current social welfare system?

I like ice cream, I like steak, I don't have to have ice cream to enjoy my steak.

We're among friends so I'm not trying to be snotty or pedantic... I just fail to see where one is dependent on the other.

If Cloward and Piven were trying to use the government to force their doctrine upon us your connection would make some sense. They are proposing that the people (at least the poor ones) force the government to change. Whole different thing and disarming us would not help realize their aspirations.

Even a former writer for "The Nation" felt the answer (post VA tech shootings) was to arm more people. Not all who are in favor of social welfare are gun grabbers. I think it's best if we focus on the issue at hand, doing otherwise does not add strength to our argument.
http://www.theweek.co.uk/americas/43...-tech-shooting

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Old January 31, 2013, 09:05 PM   #73
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We have a society that has been impacted by social media like never before. In the past your family was the strongest impact on the average persons outlook on life. I do not believe this is the case anymore. Media of all kinds directly connects to the youth and unfortunately you get gangs of inexperienced young adults and even somewhat older adults who collaborate to form their own reality.

We live in a society were fads are becoming the normal because of this overall media effect and the influences of peer groups with little age or wisdom. How many times do you see young people doing blatantly stupid stuff just for attention and their friends encourage it.

Regardless of where anyone sits on the political spectrum I doubt there are few who would disagree that this nation has become hyper polarized. Were it all ends or what the new normal will be in the end is a big question. I hope the youth will find a proper place for guns as our founders wished... but if you've seen youtube, its scary to see what passes for normal or good.
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Old January 31, 2013, 09:33 PM   #74
Bartholomew Roberts
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Instapundit had a poll discussing support for an assault weapon ban - if you broke it down by age it was shocking to see how closely age correlated to support for than ban. The biggest support was the oldest demographic (65+) and the 18-25 crowd was most strongly opposed to it.

The tail end of the boomers were essentially evenly split. That tracks pretty well with my own personal observations.
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Old January 31, 2013, 11:17 PM   #75
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Guys, welfare and wealth distribution isn't the topic here, and it's not really germane to any part of the forum. Let's stick to the matter at hand.
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