The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The North Corral > Curios and Relics

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old April 21, 2012, 07:28 AM   #26
noelf2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2008
Location: Stafford, VA
Posts: 1,806
Sorry Webleymkv. I didn't mean to offend. I like the C&R guns as they are, for a historical perspective. I wouldn't change a thing about a Webley, or a Nagant. They are what they are, and that's what makes them interesting. I don't have any Webley's, but they are on my list!
__________________
Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.
noelf2 is offline  
Old April 21, 2012, 09:51 PM   #27
Webleymkv
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 20, 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 9,940
Quote:
Sorry Webleymkv. I didn't mean to offend. I like the C&R guns as they are, for a historical perspective. I wouldn't change a thing about a Webley, or a Nagant. They are what they are, and that's what makes them interesting. I don't have any Webley's, but they are on my list!
Oh I wasn't offended. My Mk. IV certainly doesn't have the best DA trigger in the world, but it is at least "useable" in my estimation. A Nagant's DA trigger, however, is only useable at bad-breath distance and would be very difficult to shoot well with even for experienced revolver people.
__________________
Smith, and Wesson, and Me. -H. Callahan
Well waddaya know, one buwwet weft! -E. Fudd
All bad precedents begin as justifiable measures. -J. Caesar
Webleymkv is offline  
Old April 22, 2012, 09:17 PM   #28
raftman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 4, 2009
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,889
I for one think Nagant DA triggers aren't as bad as they're often made out to be... or maybe I have unusually strong hands. I've had a couple of Nagants and think the DA trigger is significantly better than some of the new production revolvers I've owned (specifically models 85UL and 94).
__________________
"My momma, she done told me, there's heart and then there's hate
If one of 'em's inside of you, the other one, it aint."
raftman is offline  
Old May 20, 2012, 07:30 PM   #29
jimisbell
Member
 
Join Date: May 19, 2012
Location: Third Coast
Posts: 24
I just ordered one and I found on UTube some instructions on improving the trigger pull that I will try. Just cant say no to $99 for a really nice pistol with holster and cleaning kit. I also bought 140 rounds of ammo at $0.36 a round.I am, however, wondering why a 9mm silencer was used on a 7.62mm weapon.
__________________
If you are NOT living on the edge, well then, you are just taking up too much space.
jimisbell is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 07:57 AM   #30
noelf2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2008
Location: Stafford, VA
Posts: 1,806
Quote:
I am, however, wondering why a 9mm silencer was used on a 7.62mm weapon.
It was/is readily available, and it works.
__________________
Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.
noelf2 is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 08:39 AM   #31
jimisbell
Member
 
Join Date: May 19, 2012
Location: Third Coast
Posts: 24
Why does it work? Would an 8mm silencer work better? Would a .45 cal silencer work as well?
__________________
If you are NOT living on the edge, well then, you are just taking up too much space.
jimisbell is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 11:58 AM   #32
noelf2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2008
Location: Stafford, VA
Posts: 1,806
Quote:
Why does it work? Would an 8mm silencer work better? Would a .45 cal silencer work as well?
Let's get back to the "availability" part. 8mm might work too, but can you find one? My guess is that .308 (or close) and .355 (or close) isn't a big difference when considering the properties of a silencer. We're only talking about 5 hundredths of an inch (or so). 9mm works.
__________________
Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.
noelf2 is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 01:11 PM   #33
RAnb
Junior member
 
Join Date: July 20, 2008
Location: WA, USA
Posts: 447
If a person is buying a silencer, then the 9mm models are probably the cheapest ones that will work on the 1895 Nagant. Since minimizing bore size is one of the keys to suppression, the 9mm will work okay as it was designed for a .355" bullet and the Nagant is a .310" caliber. Using a smaller can designed for the smaller powder charge in the Nagant cartridge would probably work better, but the market for a can made for that revolver is very small.

Ranb
RAnb is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 02:10 PM   #34
jimisbell
Member
 
Join Date: May 19, 2012
Location: Third Coast
Posts: 24
But with near new Nagant pistols selling for under $100 and the ammo at 33 cents a round, the market could get bigger !! LOL
__________________
If you are NOT living on the edge, well then, you are just taking up too much space.
jimisbell is offline  
Old May 21, 2012, 03:21 PM   #35
noelf2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2008
Location: Stafford, VA
Posts: 1,806
Not likely. There's never a big market for silencers.
__________________
Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.
noelf2 is offline  
Old May 23, 2012, 04:59 AM   #36
akguy1985
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 17, 2012
Location: Claremore, Oklahoma
Posts: 179
one of the guys on my state gun forum who is a silencer dealer has a suppressed nagant. Its cool looking.
__________________
Marksman of the mezzanine
akguy1985 is offline  
Old January 29, 2013, 11:03 PM   #37
bixbyru
Junior Member
 
Join Date: January 29, 2013
Posts: 2
A hopefully not too глупый question...

Hello all -

So the 1895 Nagant is still actually in service, both with the Russian Railways combine and with numerous northern rural police forces.

Now suppose that Oleg the Angry, a weight lifting petroleum worker In Krazny Sigorsk has a little too much водка and decides to break a few bones - none of 'em his own.

Presumably the local constable isn't going to yell "Stoi!" and threaten him with some anemic Prvi or Fiocchi target round.

Where do these Russian coppers get their ammo, and who makes it?

Thanks,

Russ
bixbyru is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 11:49 AM   #38
noelf2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 14, 2008
Location: Stafford, VA
Posts: 1,806
Who knows where they get it. But you can get much stouter 7.62x38 military surplus ammo from most milsurp sites. AIMSurplus has it I think. I bought a case of it a while back.
__________________
Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither.
noelf2 is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 09:05 PM   #39
bixbyru
Junior Member
 
Join Date: January 29, 2013
Posts: 2
Indeed - I was just wondering what the current users use. Hmmm...
bixbyru is offline  
Old January 30, 2013, 09:58 PM   #40
deerslayer303
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 10, 2011
Location: Leesville SC
Posts: 1,367
I've only shot Prvi out of mine. They punch holes in paper, milk jugs, soda cans, clay pigeons, and ring plates just fine. if Oleg the Angry gets fired up, I assure you the Nagant revolver is the LAST thing I'm going for. Ole Oleg will have a date with 230grs of silvery goodness So the Prvi works well for my use. haha
__________________
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery."
- Thomas Jefferson
deerslayer303 is online now  
Old January 30, 2013, 10:00 PM   #41
SteveBonning
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 2, 2011
Location: Baltimore, MD
Posts: 132
Prvi Partisan makes modern ammo for the Nagant revolver. I have some, think I got it from Sportsman Guide.
__________________
Steve Bonning, PA-C
Licensed Collector of Curios & Relics
Maryland Designated Collector
SteveBonning is offline  
Old February 9, 2013, 11:09 PM   #42
gandog56
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2006
Location: Mobile, Alabama
Posts: 964
Heck, the stuff has spam cans of the real stuff available. But I may be one of the few guys that not only has the Lee dies, but an actual RCBS 7.62 Nagant SHELLHOLDER (No longer in production) . The Lee dies use a 32-20 shellholder and they do NOT fit on the used hotshot commercial brass I use. The rim of the brass is too thick for the Lee shellholder. As to the guy who says that he takes a real round of 7.62 Nagant and uses it to set his dies for a like original round crimp, I need to see if that is good for the Lee dies, since they use a shorter case and disable the gas seal function. I know that the bullet seater plug from the Lee set won't even seat the bullet deep enough without some modifications. I wonder if he has the old RCBS die set? (also no longer in production)
__________________
Some people think I'm paranoid because I have guns. If I have guns, what do I have to be paranoid about?
gandog56 is offline  
Old February 10, 2013, 10:43 AM   #43
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,544
Lee dies for the 7.62X39R DO WORK, I've loaded hundreds of rounds using the Lee dies.

In using 32-20 brass you do have to trim the back of the rim about .10 but they do work. The 32-20 brass is too short to get the gas seal system on the Nagant to work, but the ammo works.

I bought a bunch of ammo that came with boxer primers so I have a good supply of brass. I use the 32-20 in a pinch.

But the Lee dies do make some nice loads.

I shot this target at 15 yards with ammo loaded with the Lee dies.

__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is offline  
Old March 12, 2013, 03:35 PM   #44
gandog56
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 31, 2006
Location: Mobile, Alabama
Posts: 964
The real problem is not a single one of my reloading manuals have recipes for a real Nagant cased reload. I have to start from various recipes I can find on different boards.
__________________
Some people think I'm paranoid because I have guns. If I have guns, what do I have to be paranoid about?
gandog56 is offline  
Old March 13, 2013, 12:23 AM   #45
Romeo 33 Delta
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 27, 2009
Posts: 315
Kraigwy ... I've been using a 115gr RNFP in my .32-20 cases, but recently fell into some Fiocchi 7.62 X 38R brass and not using it is killing me. What bullet are you using?

Thanks!
Romeo 33 Delta is offline  
Old March 13, 2013, 08:07 AM   #46
donkee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 7, 2004
Location: Mid-Michigan
Posts: 431
To increase the fun factor of shooting my Nagant revolver I no longer load smokless cartridges for it. I have gone to black powder using 100g cast lead bullets. Makes a neat boom and lots of smoke. Fairly accurate too.

I use the LEE die set and Starline 32-20 brass. I modified my revolver to take the 32-20 brass as is so no shaving off a couple thousandths off the brass.

I'll do a video of it next time I take it out. It will probably be a while though.
donkee is offline  
Old March 13, 2013, 10:05 AM   #47
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,544
Quote:
Kraigwy ... I've been using a 115gr RNFP in my .32-20 cases, but recently fell into some Fiocchi 7.62 X 38R brass and not using it is killing me. What bullet are you using?
I use a 90 grn .311 RN bullet from a Lee mold (actually throws 94 grans). I don't know what number, can't read it.

I size smaller and use the same bullet in my 30 cal Carbine. Plus my wife just bought a 32 H&R which I found I can use the same bullet.

As mentioned you can use the 32-20 brass. I chuck them in a lathe and trim off .010 off the back of the rim. You also have to run it through the sizing die to get it to work. Works but I don't like it. Its too short and the gas seal doesn't work.

I bit the bullet and bought a bunch of factory ammo with re-loadable brass, works better.

Another hint on loading the 7.62X38R. I use my carbide 30 cal Carbine die to size the brass. its .004 larger then the Nagant brass, (M1 Carbine base is .356, the Nagant base is .352). It doesn't seem to matter in my Nagant cylinder.
__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is offline  
Old March 13, 2013, 10:11 PM   #48
Romeo 33 Delta
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 27, 2009
Posts: 315
Kraigwy ... well I just put up some dummy test rounds with the Fiocchi brass. Did like you suggest ... .30 Carbine FL die.

Then used a Lee powder-thru die to flare the case mouth. (had it lying around)

Then modified a spare .32-20 Seater die I had wasting away by unscrewing the stem cap and dropping a 3/4" long 1/4-20 Roundhead Machine Screw into the end and screwing the cap down tight (you have to now set the depth of seating with the die lock ring instead of the stem cap, but that's OK). The bullet I ended up using was a 100gr, .312" plated RNFP that I had for my H&R.

Then dug up an old .25-20WCF seating die that I had laying around from some other project I pirated the other dies for and that was just PERFECT for putting just the right amount of chamfer/taper on the case mouth. A nice, little bit; nothing like the "factory" rounds so I hope for a decent case life.

Then put the .30 M1 die (without decaping pin) back in the press and just ran the loaded round up into it about half the length of the "neck" area (as otherwise the case would stick with about an 1/8" not fitting into the cylinder). After that last, little operation the loaded rounds drop right into the cylinder and the case mouths snug up without any resistance when cocking the pistol.

Thanks for the tips ... now I can swing both ways on this cartridge!
Romeo 33 Delta is offline  
Old June 2, 2013, 10:13 PM   #49
dmmccarter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: June 2, 2013
Posts: 1
Here is something I posted over at Castboolits...

I have been working on a gas seal load that would replicate the velocity of a Military Surplus Nagant 7.62x38r round for a couple of months and thought I'd share what I found.

Boolit: Lyman 311008 FN 115GR
Case: PPU 7.62mm Nagant
Powder: Trailboss 5.1gr C
Primer: CCI 550
Dies: Lee M1 Carbine (with custom seating), Lee Universal Decapping, Lee Universal Expander (with custom flare die), custom crimp die.

Data: (taken from 10ft from the muzzel)
Test Round: 113 GR Cast Boolit Gas Seal
Hi Vel: 974
Low Vel: 834
Ave Vel: 907
Ext Spread: 140
Std Dev: 36
+1SD: 944
-1SD: 870


Basline: 108 GR Military Surplus Gas Seal Round
Hi Vel: 937
Low Vel: 846
Ave Vel: 900
Ext Spread: 91
Std Dev: 30
+1SD: 931
-1SD: 870


Chart:


Let me know if you have any questions, if this is useful for you and if you have any feedback.



Here are the dies in order of operation...
decapper, expander, <prepared case>, M1 seating die, custom crimper, M1 sizing die.




Here are three finished rounds and a cast boolit...
dmmccarter is offline  
Old June 2, 2013, 10:52 PM   #50
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,544
Just for your information, the Russian Nagant Revolver and its 7.62X38R ammo sucks for shooting bowling pins.

But its still a lot of fun to shoot.
__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is offline  
Reply

Tags
.32 , 1895 nagant , revolver , soviet

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.12582 seconds with 9 queries