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Old January 18, 2013, 11:29 AM   #51
L_Killkenny
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Quote:
"Cheap" implies "low worth".

These guns are inexpensive.

They are worth more than the $150-$200 asking prices, in that they are a greater value than most any other $200 rifle. If you store a 91/30 in a cool, dry place for a hundred years, it'll be worth something when you take it out. The same can almost certainly not be said of the cash - put $200 in a cool dry place and it won't buy a box of ammo in 100 years.

They are generally capable of better accuracy than the people shooting them.

"It's a rare marksman that can shoot up to his rifle."
Cheap can imply lot's of things. Cheap can mean bad, cheap can mean in expensive, etc. But if we use your definition than "cheap" is 100% accurate. Mosins are low worth. Let's face it, retailers aren't in the habit of offering deals to make themselves feel better. If Mosins were worth what you are claiming guess what? That's what retailers would be sellin em for. They are not of any greater worth or value than any other gun sold in their price range. For that matter they aren't any less in value either. The market sets value not some misguided feelings you may have.

You like the Mosin. Fine, we all get it. If all I had was a $100 and I needed something to shoot I might look at one too. As a matter of fact that's the exact same way the Russians thought of them, "We need something to go bang, here's your Mosin". But stop trying to make a Mosin something it's not. It's pretty much the crudest of the WWII guns and it ain't got better with age. And when compared to the firearms world in general Mosins are low worth. As a matter of fact they are darn near "the lowest worth" you can find. Hence their price tag.
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Old January 18, 2013, 12:45 PM   #52
tahunua001
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I'm afraid that I must agree with KilKenny on this one. if they were worth more than their asking price the asking price would be higher. I personally own two and do not see a single feature , be it mechanical, aesthetic or performance that can not be found in my enfields, my springfields, my arisakas or my MAS36. I paid $125 for both of my mosin nagants and I would never pay a penny more for them if I could avoid it.

two of the most publicized snipers of all time used mosin nagants. big whoop, sergeant Alvin York used a 1903 with open sights and killed 28 germans, captured 132 more and managed to silence 32 machineguns all in a single day. Vasille Zaytzev and Simo Hayha never accomplished anything quite so grandiose. however one thing that you must realize is that all of these men handpicked the guns they used, you give me a stack of hi point carbines and I'm sure I can find one that shoots MOA, that doesn't mean that ALL hi point carbines can shoot MOA. the average mosin nagant is a 2-4 MOA rifle, the Finnish ones were turned down unless they met certain accuracy criteria but I don't really count a finnish among them when I talk about mosins as a whole, I mean the russians.
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Old January 18, 2013, 12:59 PM   #53
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werent the 1903s, mausers and other surplus guns that are now costing more also sold very cheaply when they came out as surplus
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Old January 18, 2013, 01:13 PM   #54
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I don't think anyone here is touting the Mosin as the greatest rifle of WWII. I was simply defending it for what it is. The weapons the Americans, Brits, Germans and Japanese produced were of better quality all around. I was simply defending the Mosin for what it is. A great shooting rifle for less than 200 bucks. Can my mosin out shoot my Long branch or K98? Absolutely NOT. But for what the thing was designed to do, it did it quite well. That 2-4 MOA that you stated will get the job done. The old battleaxe is a fun day at the range for little of nothing. I think its supply that drives the price down personally, I remember when Enfields of various models were 79 bucks. Try buying one for that now, and oh how I wish we still could. The supply dried up thus raising the price. The mosin probably will never be that valuable with in excess of 17 million rifles produced. But if that number was down around K98 or Enfield number we might see a difference. Collectors will COLLECT historical items no matter how well it did whatever said item was intended to do.
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Old January 18, 2013, 01:34 PM   #55
tahunua001
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you do make a good point deer slayer, and under normal circumstances 2-4 MOA is more than enough for the predominately close quarters(within 200 yards) combat ranges that russia was used to.
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Old January 18, 2013, 01:42 PM   #56
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Most of the time when I go shoot, if the rifle is Cantaloupe, watermelon, milk jug filled with koolaid MOA, I'm a HAPPY CAMPER!! Kinda like Gallager with a bang stick LOL So the Mosin makes me HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY with that!!
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Old January 18, 2013, 01:57 PM   #57
L_Killkenny
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A great shooting rifle for less than 200 bucks.
See "great shooting" is very subjective but callin a rifle that on average won't hold with any other production bolt action great is a bit of the stretch. You can say it's fine, or it's adequate, or it's fun, or it goes bang every time, but when you have a gun that isn't as good as the competition it can't be called great. Whether it be in the world of WWI/WWII rifles or in today's world I don't even think you can call them good as compared to everything else. But you can call em cheap, something that can't be said for it's competition.
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Old January 18, 2013, 02:06 PM   #58
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^^^ Boy did a Mosin blow up on you? Or kick you too hard or something? I'm just wondering what breeds all of your hatred. I will have to video what my 91/30 will do with surplus ammo. The use of the word "great" was my opinion in no way did I base that on accuracy from other rifles, all the variables were taken into account to come up with "great"!
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Old January 18, 2013, 04:21 PM   #59
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Nope, nothing that dramatic! Heck, I don't even mind them for what they are if you can believe that. But THEY are what they are. Some want to make them into something they're not and some even go as far as to include a Russian hyped, propagandised WWII shooter with a hand picked, arsenal built rifle to justify their reasoning.

Have fun with you're Mosin. Heck, even be proud of it. But call a spade a spade.
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Old January 18, 2013, 04:42 PM   #60
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Some people....just don't like to shoot "commie" rifles --- I don't mind --- because I get more bang for my buck; shooting the M91-30. The scope sighted M91-30, was the most prominent sniper rifle for the Vietcong and the NVA regulars; during the Vietnam War.

Granted...the M91-30 was not a great trench gun, due to it's long length. The bolt handle sits to far forward for an easy grasp. But I'll wager...that on any open gun range in the U.S., the most prominent Hi-Power rifle, day in and day out, on average --- will be some form of the Mosin Nagant rifle.

The Russian's were smart...building the long length M91-30 --- because they could use older people --- who were far sighted, when any shorter rifle, the front sight would be a blur to them; but not with the M91-30 front sight.
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Old January 18, 2013, 05:19 PM   #61
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Nope, nothing that dramatic! Heck, I don't even mind them for what they are if you can believe that. But THEY are what they are. Some want to make them into something they're not and some even go as far as to include a Russian hyped, propagandised WWII shooter with a hand picked, arsenal built rifle to justify their reasoning.

Have fun with you're Mosin. Heck, even be proud of it. But call a spade a spade.
Indeed, I see your point. Its human nature to defend what ever brand you own. No the Mosin is NOT my favorite rifle in the safe. But they have an interesting history and A LOT of it. The russians were involved in that war long before we were and had ALOT more to lose. I like the history of the rifle and storys of the people who used them (the whole reason I buy C&R firearms). And heck yeah I like burning up that cheap ammo. I should have bought all the cheap enfield and mauser ammo I could get my hands on back in the day when it was available.
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Old January 19, 2013, 10:40 AM   #62
Jack O'Conner
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These are solid rifles but the safety is a deal killer for me. I don't want to own a Mosin at any price!

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Old January 19, 2013, 11:41 AM   #63
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You're right, the safety is a joke.

I'll bet the soldiers holding them never used it.

There are mods (like adding a ring) that make it easier to use, but look odd.

We're not hunters, so there's no need for a safety off the bench. But, my converted Mosin has the Timney, which in addition to the usual match grade trigger, features a usable trigger-block safety.
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Old January 29, 2013, 06:25 AM   #64
jim in anchorage
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Tell that to someone like Vasily Zaytsev, just before he took your head off with one of those, "sucker rifles" with some of that horribly inaccurate surplus corrosive ammo.
I will stick with Carlos Hathcock's pre 64 M-70 if you don't mind.
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Old January 29, 2013, 07:13 AM   #65
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If you spent any time on a Milsurp forum over the last 7 years you'd see the interest is hardly new ... but quite old.

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