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Old May 8, 2012, 03:44 AM   #1
Hank15
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Getting into Bullseye, need recommendations, suggestions, and personal experiences

Hi all,

so I am thoroughly convinced that I want to get into Bullseye shooting.

I've read through numerous articles, threads, and even this:

http://www.bullseyepistol.com/equipmnt.htm

I also watched a few people shoot it "Gallery" style.

So now I have to "invest" in the equipment.

I am pretty settled on the 45, I'll get a Les Baer with 1.5" guarantee and have my pistolsmith give it a good action job.

But I am uncertain about what to get for the .22. What is considered acceptable accuracy for the .22 pistol? I know for the 45 it has to be < 2.5". The Marvel Conversion claims < 1.8" with most commercial ammunition, is that an acceptable standard for Bullseye?

What do you guys suggest/recommend? And what are some useful experiences that you guys can share with me?

Let me know. And thanks in advance.
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Old May 8, 2012, 04:22 AM   #2
darkgael
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equipment

You will already be paying Les Baer for a shootable gun....belay that action job. It shouldn't be needed. If your guy is good, have him make you one or contact someone like Ed Masaki or Dave Salyer for a gun.
The Marvel .22 conversion....John Zurek used one during the last Winter to shoot an 893 44X....was an unofficial new national record....maybe official by now. What more needs to be said?
Pete
PS - Check out the Encyclopedia of Bullseye Pistol at bullseypistol.com
P
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Last edited by darkgael; May 8, 2012 at 04:47 AM.
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Old May 8, 2012, 08:09 AM   #3
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I'd recommend going to a few matches and seeing what other people are shooting before you buy. Get advise from the more experience guys you shoot with.

When I started 22s were either Smith 41's or High Standards ( I use a HS Victor). Now you see a lot of Rugers. The quality of the Ruger 22s have really came up the last 30 years or so. A lot less money then a Model 41 Smith.

Before you get carried away on a 45, check out the CMP Rules for Service Pistols, you will eventually want to start working on your Dist. Pistol Badge. Not all 1911s are legal.

Don't go to a third pistol (center fire) use your 45 in the center fire event. Remember you're going to want to shoot EIC matches (to get your Dist Pistol Badge) so do most of your shooting with the service pistol.

The same thing goes for sights, stick to the service pistol iron sights, stay away from red dots and such until you get your DP badge.
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Old May 8, 2012, 08:56 AM   #4
darkgael
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and..

And.....if you haven't already done so, get a copy of the USAMU Pistol Marksmanship Guide.
It can be downloaded at the "Encyclopedia" site referenced above.

I, also, shoot a Victor as well as Colt Gold Cup. Iron sights both.
P
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Old May 8, 2012, 12:28 PM   #5
spacecoast
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A Ruger Mark II or Mark III Target model (usually 6" barrel) is a great and inexpensive way to get started, and even if you decide you don't like BE you will still have an accurate, versatile and fun to shoot range/hunting pistol. Until you get quite good at BE you won't need a more accurate pistol.

There's lots of room to get better with the .22 before you invest big bucks in a higher end 1911. For matches, I recommend the Federal Auto Match .22LR you can get at Walmart for about $15 for a box of 325. Better than the cheap stuff but still affordable.
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Old May 8, 2012, 12:32 PM   #6
Hank15
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What type of accuracy can be expected out of the Rugers? And what is the minimal acceptable accuracy standard? Also, how do they compare to the 41s, High Standards, and the Marvel Unit 1 Conversions?

I ask because I was reading this article on the website and it really spoke to me: http://www.bullseyepistol.com/cstomgun.htm

Also, is there any reason why the CMP does not allow beavertail grip safeties or combat style hammers? It seems like the only reason would be to be consistent with the "as issue" sentiment.
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Old May 8, 2012, 12:58 PM   #7
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My old school pistol box has a 41, 52 and a Gold Cup.
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Old May 8, 2012, 01:18 PM   #8
kraigwy
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The Rugers will out shoot just about most Bullseye Shooters I know.

It is capable of cleaning the 50 yard slow fire target. More then accurate enough.

If I ever had to replace my HS Victor, I'd go the Ruger route. Can't beat it for the price.
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Old May 8, 2012, 02:22 PM   #9
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Kraig, I've got a Ruger with a Volquartsen upgrade that's a sweet shooter.
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Old May 8, 2012, 06:18 PM   #10
darkgael
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ruger

Rugers. I have an old Mk,II with the Volquartsen trigger kit/hammer, etc. and a VQ upper. It is a nice shooter. That being said...the last 2700 that I shot (last Fall) had a full line of shooters. There was a single Ruger on the line. One High Standard (mine), a selection of Smith 41s, at least one Marvel conversion, a few Hammerli 208s, and number of FWB AW93s.
Just for reference.
Pete
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Old May 8, 2012, 06:41 PM   #11
spacecoast
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My best ever slow fire round was a 93, shot with my run-of-the-mill used Mark II using only the gun's iron sights (no red dot). Like Kraig said, they are more than good enough for most BE shooters, and even if you upgrade later they are a great way to get started.
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Old May 12, 2012, 02:32 AM   #12
Hank15
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What's the ideal barrel length for the Rugers?

i.e. at what length does diminishing returns start to kick in?

Also, which specific model do you guys have tried and/or recommend over others?
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Old May 12, 2012, 06:11 PM   #13
Gerry
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The ideal length for LR 22 would be rifle length. Whatever is closest to that is what you want. No diminishing returns there.
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Old May 12, 2012, 06:33 PM   #14
243winxb
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Bullseye Pistol Shooting

The Ruger 5 1/2" is good for timed & rapid fire. But the longer barrels/sight radius is better for slow fire. If you get into international shooting, there was a rule about barrel length. Here the 5 1/2" was ok to use, but not longer. Check current rule books.
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Old May 14, 2012, 08:11 AM   #15
Bart B.
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Hank15 asks:
Quote:
What is considered acceptable accuracy for the .22 pistol? I know for the 45 it has to be < 2.5". The Marvel Conversion claims < 1.8" with most commercial ammunition, is that an acceptable standard for Bullseye?
1/2 to 3/4 inch at 50 yards (at worst, not average) has been the general rule for .22's in NRA bullseye competition for decades. I've seen test targets fired with Hi Standards, Jim Clark converted Rugers and S&W 41's from machine rests down in the 3/8 inch range; equal to what Hammerli free pistols would shoot.

Wadcutter .45's should shoot under 2 inches at 50 yards as should .38's in that configuration. And service .45 full power ball ammo should shoot under 2.5 inches.

One thing newcomers to bullseye pistol shooting often don't realize (such as I did when I started) is accuracy is in second place compared to how good the trigger is. Handgun triggers must break clean and crisp, have minimum overtravel (backlash) and be very repeatable for each and every shot. Back in the 1960's there was an article in a pistol magazine about SFC Bill Blankenship winning the Nationals and setting a centerfire aggregate record. He had a choice of three different .38 AMU pistols to shoot; their accuracy from machine rest at 50 yards ranged from about 2.3 inch down to 1.5 inch. He chose the least accurate one because it had the best trigger.
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Old May 14, 2012, 06:02 PM   #16
Clifford L. Hughes
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Hank15:.

When I was shooting for several Marine Corps pistol teams during the mid
1960's, I shot master scores with a Ruger MK1, 6 7/8 inch tapered barrel. The modern Rugers are even more accouate and reliable; you can't go wrong with one of the match grade MKlll's.

Semper Fi.

Gunnery Sergeant
Clifford L. Hughes
USMC Retired
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Old May 15, 2012, 10:01 PM   #17
Hank15
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Thanks for the tips everyone.

I will be testing out different models of Ruger MK IIIs and 22/45 at my local range.

On a side note, can anyone point me to a list of "official" competitions in southern California?

Turns out the range I went to does it informally.

I'd like to attend one with scores, rankings, etc. so that I can keep track of my progress.
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Old May 15, 2012, 10:19 PM   #18
Casimer
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check out Shooting Sports USA - there are match listings in the back - http://www.nxtbook.com/nxtbooks/nra/ssusa_201204/

You can sign up for a free online subscription here - http://www.nrapublications.org/ssusa/

And I'll second the advice to just start going to matches, shoot what you have, and let your experience and the advice of other shooters guide you. BE shooters tend to be very good about helping out new competitors. Also you can often find some great deals on used guns and gear, so it's worthwhile to hold off on buying too much until you get acquainted w/ the sport.
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Old January 21, 2013, 03:57 AM   #19
Hank15
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Update

Hi All,

getting into bullseye has been quite an adventure.

My focus was divided between the bianchi cup, steel challenge, IDPA, and bullseye.

Since I didn't have the funds to invest in a good .22 (I am talking about the setup as recommended by the people who've voiced their opinions in this thread - a Ruger with a Volquartsen trigger setup), I ended up shooting the other competitions first.

I finally picked up a Model 41 in November, but there were factory errors that needed to be corrected, specifically a rough chamber and uneven serrations cut on the top of the slide. Smith and Wesson says it should be back to me in the next 2 or 3 weeks.

In the mean time, I sold one of my other guns in order to purchase a Ruger 22/45 as a backup gun in case something like this happens again.

Thank you all for helping me pick out a .22 pistol. I will start a new thread that will track my progress.
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Old January 21, 2013, 05:54 AM   #20
darkgael
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Ruger

The Ruger is all you need. A Volquartsen kit can be installed by anyone who can read. A half hour at the kitchen table will do it.
Good luck with the guns.
Practice. Practice. Practice. And remember....practice makes permanent; only perfect practice makes perfect.
Pete
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Old January 21, 2013, 06:33 AM   #21
spacecoast
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Quote:
Since I didn't have the funds to invest in a good .22 (I am talking about the setup as recommended by the people who've voiced their opinions in this thread - a Ruger with a Volquartsen trigger setup), I ended up shooting the other competitions first.

I finally picked up a Model 41 in November...
A Ruger with or without a trigger upgrade should be a LOT less expensive than the Model 41. I did my own trigger upgrade, I think it cost about $90 on a gun that I got for $275.
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Old January 21, 2013, 10:05 AM   #22
kutz
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I use Ruger M II with volquartsen trigger,works when I do.
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Old January 25, 2013, 10:48 PM   #23
izzie80
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Browning Buckmark

Anyone using the Browning Buckmark for be shooting?
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Old February 1, 2013, 04:20 PM   #24
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Buckmark

I use the model; The grip angle comes close to my 45 though not exactly and basically it was available. Our indoor league was starting up and I did not want to putter around for months reading reviews and opinions. I wanted to get shooting and was pretty sure Browning was good quality. In about a year, at my progression rate, I might be in a position to need something better but not now. A kit of spare springs was readily available for long term maintainability.
Grip tape on front and back straps and four extra mags so I can come to the match all business and I am very satisfied.
There it is- my $.02
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