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Old January 16, 2013, 02:56 PM   #1
deerslayer303
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Will all the gloom and doom affect muzzleloaders

Gary-- If this is not the right area to post this please move, I figured it was pertaining to B.P. so I thought it would be ok.


Do you guys think all the proposed legislation if passed will effect our beloved black powder arms. Are we going to be required a background check to purchase? No more shipping directly to us? I've been watching the news today and its just craziness.
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Old January 16, 2013, 04:13 PM   #2
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Who knows...

If you read the President's four prominent points they do make sense.

But when you read further the plan begins to unravel.

I am sure others will wade in on this issue but I am terribly underinformed since my primary source is the news media and you can be certain that the news media will not present the facts.

Of one thing I am convinced. Whatever we do, or whatever is done to us, it won't help. We are trying to fix the wrong problem just as we did with health care.
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Old January 16, 2013, 04:23 PM   #3
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If the legislation or executive orders or whatever measure is pursued leaves muzzle loaders alone, I think the industry & hobby will see a surge in interest.
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Old January 16, 2013, 04:35 PM   #4
Logan5579
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will the crazyness affect us BP guys?

Been reading about what the politicos want to shove down our throats, it probably won't affect us (as BP guys)at first and not directly...but you know we're on their list somewhere. Eventually the antis want ALL firearms, and probably the slingshots, knives, forks, and pointy sticks too.

The buying frenzy is already affecting us indirectly. Locally, there are few projectiles available (hornady roundball, powerbelt rifle bullets, etc) powder subs are gone off the shelf and on backorder, no #11 caps or 209 primers anywhere. I live in a rural area and everyone around here owns a smokepole or two and has proactively bought up everything they normally use "just in case."

Since our tools of choice are considered antique weapons, I do wonder if the antis are going to start trying to put us under the thumb by changing shipping regulations so we can't have purchases delivered directly to us or by limiting the number of primers we can buy. Already you can't buy goex or swiss at any local shop because BP is considered an explosive and the shops would have to build a bunker to house their stock. Hopefully the subs don't get reclassified too. This is all the more reason we can't give an inch on the gun control issue and why I re-upped my NRA membeship early and sent them an extra few bucks to boot.
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Old January 16, 2013, 04:45 PM   #5
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I think that it will encompass all firearms....and I will gladly hand mine over, Bullets First!!!!

Sic Semper Tyrannis!!!
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Old January 16, 2013, 05:36 PM   #6
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I think....

....That all of mine are going to be stolen.
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Old January 16, 2013, 06:08 PM   #7
Sure Shot Mc Gee
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From 1968 and on forward to this day. The only thing presidents & politicians have initiated in their proposals for more or better Gun Control Laws was the spurring of those who thought they were about to be affected by new laws and regulations. Thus causing many average law abiding citizens to immediately buy more of the same. As far as B/P enthusiasts worried. I see no reason too. How can today's politicians outlaw a rifle or pistol that was carried and used by many of those who signed the US. Constitution. To do so would be absurd. But needing to have a back ground check done or a firearms registration is indeed possible.
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Old January 16, 2013, 06:13 PM   #8
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Yes. Why think otherwise? In 1775 an F&I Brown Bess or a Committee of Safety musket in the hands of a Colonial was an "assault weapon" and a threat to the Powers that Be-Lexington and Concord anyone. We must not be fooled by divide and conquer tactics, an attack on ant aspect of the RKBA and on any category of firearms is an attack on ALL of us.
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Old January 16, 2013, 06:26 PM   #9
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I don't know, but I doubt it. I am not going to get hysterical about anything, that's already being done. Basically, he admitted all the really potent actions would need to be taken by congress, his orders were basically directed at federal agencies.
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Old January 16, 2013, 07:22 PM   #10
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THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary

EMBARGOED UNTIL THE START OF THE PRESIDENT’S REMARKS

January 16, 2013

Gun Violence Reduction Executive Actions
Today, the President is announcing that he and the Administration will:

1. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system.

2. Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system.

3. Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system.

4. Direct the Attorney General to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks.

5. Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun.

6. Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers.

7. Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign.

8. Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission).

9. Issue a Presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations.

10. Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement.

11. Nominate an ATF director.

12. Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper
training for active shooter situations.

13. Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime.

14. Issue a Presidential Memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence.

15. Direct the Attorney General to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies.

16. Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes.

17. Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities.

18. Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers.EMBARGOED

19. Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education.

20. Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover.

21. Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges.

22. Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations.

23. Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health.
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Old January 16, 2013, 08:28 PM   #11
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Where I live, you need a 'permit' to purchase powder, caps, primers, roundball etc. You do not need a 'permit' to possess them.
So, I just stock up on these items. I do not believe that they will come after BP stuff, at least not in the near future. However, the 'permit' can be revoked for almost any reason, by your local Chief of law enforcement. Lucky for me, mine is decent and does not mess with people.
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Old January 16, 2013, 10:50 PM   #12
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North East Redneck, May I ask a question, And I am not asking about you.. But lets say I move next door to you, and Being an ignorant so and so, If I drove to the sovereign state of Indiana and purchases a whole lot of the afore mentioned items, which are all off the shelf here, then drove back to my new home next door to you, would I be in any trouble legally...

Now you my friend would be in trouble because when I move into a neighborhood, the property values sink
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Old January 17, 2013, 08:55 AM   #13
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Indy, I would think that you would not be in any legal trouble. The property values dropped in my area when I moved in.
If you can lower em some, help me out. I like low taxes.
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Old January 17, 2013, 09:18 AM   #14
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Hahahahahhahahahaha! Good un!
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Old January 17, 2013, 09:19 AM   #15
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so a follow up question NER is not the permit to purchase those items pretty much bunk???? (Like so many of those laws are)
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Old January 17, 2013, 09:23 AM   #16
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At this point all we know is the proposed regulations/laws/orders, whatever they are will limit and control the lives of honest citizens. Privacy will be gone. We will become a controlled people, just as feared when Obama first ran for President.
Details are just speculation.
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Old January 17, 2013, 12:03 PM   #17
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As long as ATF classifies cab & ball & black powder guns in general as non fire arms we'll be okay but if that changes.......
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Old January 17, 2013, 02:35 PM   #18
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I slipped under the "finish line" and finished putting together the parts for an AR15 about a month ago.

Loved it , fun to shoot, quality parts from PSA ...

The effect all this broohaha has had for me... I sold the AR, and have purchased TWO blackpowder rilfes. Something about it made sense to me.

Less crap to break, more easily found parts, etc....

I still have hunting rifles , shotguns, semi-auto pistols.

But I like the idea of a muzzleloader. So now I have 2.

My $0.02..
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Old January 17, 2013, 02:46 PM   #19
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When you compromise with evil, you lose !!!

Quote:
Do you guys think all the proposed legislation if passed will effect our beloved black powder arms.
The ice is getting thinner and will have an indirect effect. Eventually they will go after the gun show promoters as well as the 2nd. amendment. Not only have I seen guns and ammo prices go up but M/L primers. Many "trusted" companies, have started gouging the folks. .....

Be Safe !!!
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Old January 17, 2013, 03:55 PM   #20
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Indy, if you purchase out of state, I'd say it is bunk. However, without said 'permit', if you are not hunting, don't get caught outside your home with a BP gun.
Looks like we are in for a NY state type law also. Who knows what next.
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Old January 17, 2013, 04:55 PM   #21
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It's funny, but last week I found 4 cans of primers, 10s and 11s, remmy, for a buck fifty each. Powder, well Pyrodex, is still widely available, but I bought a couple pounds anyway.
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Old January 18, 2013, 09:06 AM   #22
indy1919
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OHHH now I think I understand , North East Redneck.. I can own it with out a permit, I just better not get caught using it... If I may be so bold to ask, what does it take to get said Permit?????
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Old January 18, 2013, 09:16 AM   #23
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I think lead may be the biggest challenge in the long run, price will keep going up and regulations on lead may get you in the long run.
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Old January 18, 2013, 01:20 PM   #24
deerslayer303
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Quote:
I think lead may be the biggest challenge in the long run, price will keep going up and regulations on lead may get you in the long run.
Its HOGWASH I tell ya!! LEAD comes out of the ground, and we just put it back to where it came from!
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Old January 21, 2013, 10:18 PM   #25
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Indy, we got us some crazy foolish laws up here.
To get said 'permit', you must take a safety class, then apply to your local LE office. Get pictured and printed and your local chief of LE will decide what if any permit you may be allowed to have. FID is lowest, non large cap rifles and shotguns, LTC B, non large cap handguns, rifles and shotguns. LTC A, anything that isn't NFA, subject to restrictions placed on license by the Chief. Class B is not allowed to carry a handgun, except hunting and range trips, weapon must be locked up during transport.
Get an OUI, no more guns. Get any misdemeanor charge, good luck getting any guns. Sure, if you wait long enough you may get your non large cap rifles and shotguns back. Then again, you may not. Subject to local authority.
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