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Old December 28, 2012, 10:22 PM   #1
ratrodney
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the riflemans rifle.

Hello.
wat kind of rifle was that used in the old show "the rifleman"?
Love that lever action to shoot it. Any still made? Tnx RR
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Old December 28, 2012, 10:28 PM   #2
Tuzo
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Winchester 1892

Link to Wikipedia that describes the rifle as used on "The Rifleman."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rifleman
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Old December 28, 2012, 10:56 PM   #3
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As Tuzo said

The Winchester Model 1892 is the signature weapon of Lucas McCain (Chuck Connors). The famous opening shows Lucas firing 12 shots from his Winchester in less than 5 seconds! The rifle is fitted with a large lever loop to allow one hand reloading. There were actually 3 prop weapons used on the show, 2 true Winchesters and a Spanish El Tigre used for stunts.

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/The_Rifleman#Winchester_1892

Always liked at the beginning of the show when he fires those 12 shots he's wearing gloves, that loop would have been heck on his knuckles without them.
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Old December 29, 2012, 03:43 AM   #4
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I thought this thread was going to be about the Winchester Model 70 .
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Old December 29, 2012, 08:54 AM   #5
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Quote:
I thought this thread was going to be about the Winchester Model 70
Same here.
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Old December 29, 2012, 09:00 AM   #6
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Quote:
The famous opening shows Lucas firing 12 shots from his Winchester in less than 5 seconds!
Yep, problem is it only holds 10.
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Old December 29, 2012, 09:31 AM   #7
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Well Hawg, just try telling that to Lucas!

In several of the early Peckinpah shows, he is shown to have quite a temper.
Folks in Northfork learned to stay on his good side.

92s, I think, are the ultimate refinement of the lever action. Just the ticket for that rapid fire and Chuck was a pretty fair gun hand.

JT
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Old December 29, 2012, 10:30 AM   #8
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I am sitting in front of the tube right now watching Chuck and Paul in "The Surveyors Dream" (1959)
The 1873 Winchester would be the appropriate rifle for that time period post Civil War.
As for
Quote:
One Handed Loading
Would that more properly refer to, One handed Chambering?
I can load my 1894 one hand, but Chambering or cycling the action is a different thing.
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Old December 29, 2012, 10:40 AM   #9
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Quote:
Quote:
The famous opening shows Lucas firing 12 shots from his Winchester in less than 5 seconds!
Yep, problem is it only holds 10.
Must've been filmed in California with the ten-round limit
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Old December 29, 2012, 01:31 PM   #10
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Also, the guns used were modified, to keep the round from falling out when he "spun cocked" the gun.

Regular 92s (and most other guns) will not work right when you spin them around, the ammo tends to get mis aligned and jam.

There was a pretty good article about the guns, the show and Conners a while back in the Rifleman (couple years ago, I think...)

One of the other things that made the dramatic spin cocking work was Conner's height. Being tall, the short carbine didn't hit the ground like it could when spun by someone shorter...
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Old December 29, 2012, 01:46 PM   #11
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It's not the ground that'd be the problem, it's the arm pit.
Connors had a long reach that allowed him to spin those 20-inch Winchesters without hitting skin.

You can find Italian-made 92 variants with the elongated "John Wayne Style Loop Lever" here & there, and there's an expensive version you can order from DiMuzio at www.riflemansrifle.com with both correct lever configurations for the TV show rifles.
You can also find Brazilian Rossi 92 variants with the Wayne-style levers.

The Italian & Brazilian guns do not have the set-screw in the trigger bow to trip the trigger.
You can dicker with DiMuzio to get one on his guns.
Denis

Last edited by DPris; December 29, 2012 at 02:00 PM.
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Old December 29, 2012, 09:40 PM   #12
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You can emulate the look of Lucas' carbine "on a budget" with a used Rossi 92. They've been available stock--or can be retrofitted with the Rossi part that's out there--with a close approximation of the rounded "D" style which was one of two of the loop-lever styles he used. Early style Rossi large loop:


He also used a more squared-off D which looked less refined/more backyard gunsmith, but must've suited him better operationally (as it was later episodes IIRC)...and would need to be custom-made now. The "John Wayne" style mentioned is more of an oval--also available at times from Rossi and the Italians (Chiappa made Taylor's and Cimarrons as the "Eldorado" for instance, and on some Win 94s over the past few decades) and will not give you as much of the larger-loop Rifleman look--like this current Wayne style Rossi:

Legacy Sport's (LSI) Chiappa-made "Puma" also had a fancy (autograph, emblem etc) Rifleman commemorative that was a reasonably precise Lucas McCain facsimile (with the more rounded/earlier style lever, not the squared-off).

Functionally, the large loop is a mixed-bag proposition, actually increasing cycle time in normal use. The plus side - greater ease of use in cold weather with gloves . I swapped a large loop from a 16" Rossi 92 trapper (which is how.a lot of the looped Rossi 92s came) to a regular 20" carbine - 1) I wanted at least one of my Rossis with the Rifleman look/cache, and the large loop seemed to suit the longer 20" gun better than it did the 16",.and 2) winter shooting.
As for the TV show's rapid fire modification (operable set screw): yes it can be--and has been--done, as mentioned. I wouldn't--just an accident waiting to happen IMHO, unless you are a very well trained--and tall--"showman" by trade...or unless you want the detail of the look of the set screw but fixed/backed-off so it can't be "actually actuated." Many episodes showed Lucas adjusting/backing the screw off for "normal" shooting (precision/slow target practice, hunting, etc). In one particular episode, a kid was shown accidentally shooting and killing a buddy by actuating the lever when the gun was already cocked--and of course chambered--with the screw tripping the trigger, as designed when "screwed in" but with tragic consequences. Noteworthy "gun safety" episode.

Last edited by gak; December 29, 2012 at 10:58 PM.
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Old January 10, 2013, 11:13 PM   #13
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the riflemans rifle.

John Wayne used a '92 with a big loop on it, as well, in different times of his career.

His first movie shots, were him holding a saddle and a '92. He could spin it, as well.

Lastly, if you go and find your DVd of "Fistful of Dollars", one of the bad guys uses a Winchester, and in one of the final acts, he gives a different throw and comeback move.

Yes, a short-barreled 1892 Winnie, or clone, is a good rifle to own.

(the only other 'rifleman's rifle' that I know of, was a Remington 700, with a mil-spec scope mounted on it, a long time ago.)
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Old January 11, 2013, 03:12 AM   #14
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John Wayne & stuntman Yakima Canutt originated that large loop for the 1939 movie Stagecoach. He used the round loop in that one, changed later in life to the elongated version.
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Old January 11, 2013, 07:14 PM   #15
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Hawg, do not think you are correct about the 10 rds. Do believe it's 12 or 13 rds of 44/40.


Nail
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Old January 11, 2013, 08:00 PM   #16
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Quote:
I thought this thread was going to be about the Winchester Model 70 .
Maybe you were thinking about "the man with no eyes", the walkin boss (boss Godfrey).
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Old January 12, 2013, 12:37 AM   #17
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He gets off 13 rounds, at least by my count last Saturday! I'll have to watch it again tomorrow. DF must absolutely soil herself watching that 19th century assault rifle pump out the rounds.
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Old January 12, 2013, 02:18 AM   #18
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One shot was dubbed in, you hear one more than the rifle carried.
Denis
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Old January 12, 2013, 10:09 AM   #19
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I just watched it; I think it was 12 shots?? I thought 13 was an odd number given the superstition folks have about that. Then I considered that perhaps he had one up the pipe and 12 in the magazine tube. My coffee hasn't kicked in yet to make such pointed observations with any certainty.
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Old January 12, 2013, 11:24 AM   #20
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As I said- one shot was dubbed in, issue answered long ago.
Denis
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Old January 12, 2013, 12:13 PM   #21
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I too saw the title and thought of Jack O'Connor's "The Rifleman's Rifle" (the Winchester model 70 in .270 with a 4X scope). I guess anyone who knows who he was, or read his articles in Outdoor Life and his books, most likely has more gray hair than I.

Although I prefer the Remington 721 / 700 in .270, Jack was correct. A good quality bolt action with a decent 4X scope in .270 Winchester is pretty hard to beat. Woodchucks to Moose, the 130 or 150 grain .270 will handle them all, while shooting flat and not busting up your shoulder and cheekbone.

I have owned and hunted with many bolt .270's...Howa, Winchesters, Savages, etc., but for me, the Remington 700 BDL is the best.

But I doubt the Rifleman could shoot it anywhere fast enough to look even half as cool as the opening of "The Rifleman" TV show.

Last edited by shurshot; January 12, 2013 at 12:18 PM.
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Old January 12, 2013, 10:04 PM   #22
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The Riflemans Rifle

I thought and am thinking I have a book in my library by Jim Carmichael, The M70 Win., a riflemans rifle. Guess I'll have to hit the library to see. TomL
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Old January 14, 2013, 12:39 AM   #23
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I think Chuck was left handed but everyone at that time HAD to be right handed. TV had no lefties for some reason. Watching the show as an adult I picked up on that immediately.
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Old January 14, 2013, 09:48 AM   #24
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He was ambidextrous & could spin with either arm.
Denis
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Old January 14, 2013, 02:14 PM   #25
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I too thought of Jack O'Connors coining of "The Rifleman's Rifle" about the pre-64 Winchester M70. He loved that pre-64 M70 rifle(CFR)--not so much it's successor(PFR).
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