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Old January 6, 2013, 08:10 AM   #1
Vartarg
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Disturbing News on the "Gun Control" Front

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...46f_print.html

It appears to me that there's a real fight coming down the road.

In order to create a database of guns, so that transfers can be tracked, with background checks on all transaction, they will have to require registration of all firearms.

Perhaps they're just blustering, but it increasingly seems that they're serious.

George
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Last edited by Vartarg; January 6, 2013 at 08:25 AM.
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Old January 6, 2013, 08:23 AM   #2
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Yep, another anti-gun scheme is laid out. That devious scheme will take a back seat in the coming months as congress and the white house get tangled up in debt ceiling and budget cutting debates.
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Old January 6, 2013, 08:50 AM   #3
fsfty
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Yep, another anti-gun scheme is laid out. That devious scheme will take a back seat in the coming months as congress and the white house get tangled up in debt ceiling and budget cutting debates.

Someone is whistling past the graveyard...
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Old January 6, 2013, 09:00 AM   #4
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Let's not get complacient and think that the AWB folks are all brainless. They are masters of politics, know the system in Washington and know the sooner they send bills through congress the more inertia they have after the Conn. incident. I would bet they will enter bill after bill after the 20th. of January even if they have to call for a vote in the middle of the night to get as many facets of their plan through even if in increments. They know any sweeping plan will not go through without a huge fight, but eating away tiny bits at a time is their best avenue. This will happen even as our so called budget goes over the fiscal cliff. These folks are planning their move 24/7 so don't even think for a minute everything is ok for the rest of us.

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Old January 6, 2013, 09:13 AM   #5
FALPhil
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Quote:
Yep, another anti-gun scheme is laid out. That devious scheme will take a back seat in the coming months as congress and the white house get tangled up in debt ceiling and budget cutting debates.
There are two ways you can look at it.

First, and I agree, we have much bigger fish to fry. The current policy of diverting funds out of the economy and into government is a recipe for disaster, and because we refuse to learn from history, our currency, and therefore our economy will go down the tubes. Hence, in addition to investing in lead, you should also invest in silver. But I digress. The fact is, that we are teetering on insolvency on a massive scale, the kind of scale that causes cataclysmic change.

The second way to look at it is that because gun control is an emotional issue, it could be used to divert the attention of the ignorant voter away from the economic problems we face - a kind of fiddling while Rome burns scenario. The two salient facts for this scenario are (a) most voters are ignorant about all sorts of things related to policy, and (b) for the last 100 years, our elected representatives have shown an immense propensitiy to kick the national debt can down the road.

I hesitate to pick the most likely scenario. Either way, the central government is loosing its grasp. I think it collectively recognizes this. It may see gun control as a way to hang on just a little longer in the hope that it can find a way out. Unfortunately, hope is a pretty lousy strategy.
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Old January 6, 2013, 09:28 AM   #6
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Yep, another anti-gun scheme is laid out. That devious scheme will take a back seat in the coming months as congress and the white house get tangled up in debt ceiling and budget cutting debates.
Or......

it's the other way around.

While all the attention is focused on gun control,,,,the * "545" can pull off some dirty deeds elsewhere.


*from the excellent essay by Charley Reese..
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Old January 6, 2013, 09:33 AM   #7
Cascade1911
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I hear people say various gun control measures will never pass and others say we are doomed.

I say pay attention, stay informed and stay active. Get in contact with your representatives on the Federal and State level. Stay in contact. Urge fellow travelers to do the same.

For those saying there is nothing to fear and "this too shall pass"; I recall, when Bill Clinton was running for his first term, listening to conservatives hoping that Clinton would win the Democratic nomination because he had no hope of winning the general election. Then, when he ran for a second term those same pundits explained how, with all the scandal surrounding Clinton there wasn't a snowball's chance of him winning a second term.
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Old January 6, 2013, 10:15 AM   #8
Kreyzhorse
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Perhaps they're just blustering, but it increasingly seems that they're serious.
Of course they are serious. These guys would like nothing more than banning guns totally however, they understand that they can't get a total ban passed right now. Right now, they are attempting to lay the ground work for a total ban.

The first step is a registration process. Check out http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/publ...ssault-weapons for a summary of what they are after. In short; fingerprints and photos for gun owners, approval of local law enforcement allowing you to keep your guns, serial number registration, the banning of certain type of semi auto rifles, handguns and shotguns that accept detachable magazines (read that as all semi autos at some point) but rest assured, you will be allowed to keep your grandfathered guns. Of course on your death, those guns, which you can't sell, or gift, must be forfeited to the Government. Oh yeah, "legitimate" hunting won't be effected. Of course now that they qualifying hunting, you can start to kiss that goodbye too.

This is on the Federal level. Lots of local governments are talking about banning all semi autos to and none seem to care at all about the Supreme Court's decision that it is unconstitutional to do so.

So yes, I'd suggest they are pretty damn serious.
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Old January 6, 2013, 10:30 AM   #9
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I believe we need to be vigilant about a weapons ban being placed in a spending bill or debt ceiling bill. Politicians have gotten real sneaky about placing touchy issues in other bills so as to not draw attention to them.
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Old January 6, 2013, 10:43 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Wbdisco View Post
I believe we need to be vigilant about a weapons ban being placed in a spending bill or debt ceiling bill. Politicians have gotten real sneaky about placing touchy issues in other bills so as to not draw attention to them.
The upcoming debt ceiling bill is exactly where I expect to see the damage done. But I don't even think it will be sneaky. I think there will be some onerous amendment like a magazine ban attached to the bill, then dare the conservatives to hold the country hostage over it.

Bohener is a weak kneed Speaker, so I wouldn't be shocked to see that get by with no sunset. Disappointed, but not shocked. Angry as hell, but not shocked.
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Old January 6, 2013, 10:48 AM   #11
stargazer65
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stiffen penalties for carrying guns near schools or giving them to minors
That wording concerns me. What does it mean "near schools"? Driving through a school zone...? What is "giving them to minors"? Some minors have succesfully defended themselves and family using guns...how affected?
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Old January 6, 2013, 11:27 AM   #12
rickyrick
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Ok, I think President Obama is popular enough to get something going. I think something will get passed. I'm sure a version of what has been proposed. How restrictive remains to be seen.
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Old January 6, 2013, 11:45 AM   #13
Cascade1911
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Quote:
I believe we need to be vigilant about a weapons ban being placed in a spending bill or debt ceiling bill. Politicians have gotten real sneaky about placing touchy issues in other bills so as to not draw attention to them.
The other thing that can happen is a politician can use the other items in the bill as an excuse for why they voted for a gun control measure.

(Pretty much "MrBatchelor's" point I think)
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Old January 6, 2013, 11:58 AM   #14
Glenn E. Meyer
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Sen. McConnell said that he wants to wait until he sees what Biden comes forward with but that the next three months will be concerned with fiscal matters.

That suggests that the immediately proposed bills will not be passed.

I'm betting on, that if we get new legislation - it will be mandatory NICS for private sales at gun shows. I don't see a comprehensive ban like Feinstein's.

I do suggest that if the NICS idea goes through - it should be ammeded to state that since NICS is so great - then any law abiding citizen in the USA should be able to purchase firearms (handguns included) for their home if NICS checked.

However, as currently, no Federal keeping of the check as a form of registration.

Such a provision would be anathema to Bloomers as it would short circuit the laws in NYC, Chicago, DC, etc. How can they say no if they think NICS is great?
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Old January 6, 2013, 12:01 PM   #15
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If you've never been to Canada I suggest you visit. Their gun laws will be ours in 20 years.
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Old January 6, 2013, 12:45 PM   #16
Gary L. Griffiths
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The ultimate showdown has been coming for quite a while. It's now almost upon us. Even if you've never called or written your congresscritters in the past, now's the time to do so.

I look for universal background checks to become the law of the land, since it doesn't infringe on our right to "keep and bear" arms, especially if the gummit doesn't get to have information about the type (other than handgun or long gun) of weapon transferred.

Quote:
I do suggest that if the NICS idea goes through - it should be ammeded to state that since NICS is so great - then any law abiding citizen in the USA should be able to purchase firearms (handguns included) for their home if NICS checked.
Now that's gold, right there!
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Old January 6, 2013, 12:54 PM   #17
tdawg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vartarg View Post
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...46f_print.html

It appears to me that there's a real fight coming down the road.

In order to create a database of guns, so that transfers can be tracked, with background checks on all transaction, they will have to require registration of all firearms.

Perhaps they're just blustering, but it increasingly seems that they're serious.

George
When I bought my pistol, I had to fill out paperwork with very specific info about myself and the pistol, and then had to wait 7 days before it was mine. I don't see why everybody shouldn't go through the same regardless of where they buy one (ccw permit holders notwithstanding). It's easy to just save that background check and firearm data instead of discarding it within 24 hours.

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Old January 6, 2013, 01:21 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tdawg
When I bought my pistol, I had to fill out paperwork with very specific info about myself and the pistol, and then had to wait 7 days before it was mine. I don't see why everybody shouldn't go through the same regardless of where they buy one (ccw permit holders notwithstanding). It's easy to just save that background check and firearm data instead of discarding it within 24 hours.
Last time I bought a pistol, I filled out a 4473 and the dealer called it in. About five minutes later I was whistling my way out the door with my new pistol. I don't know why you had to wait seven days, and I'd be asking my legislators about that waiting period. I'd be madder than hell.

Oh, and why should the waiting period be any different for a CCW holder?

I'd be mad as hell about that too. Too much government interference in our lives as it is.
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Old January 6, 2013, 01:23 PM   #19
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As a chl holder, I just fill out the form, show the salesman my license, then I'm out the door.
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Old January 6, 2013, 01:59 PM   #20
ClydeFrog
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Violence against small children.....

To be honest, I think the major push & galvanizing event that caused all the uproar was the vicious murder of the 20 6/7 year olds.
The media images of young children being scared & the parents freaking out struck a nerve in the people who, until then, had no real concerns or feelings about gun control or bans.
If you saw the 2012 POTUS election debates, President Obama said; "we need to talk about guns." He did not say; I want to ban guns or make new gun control laws because he knew that would be a uphill battle.
Now, in 2013, emotions are high & many citizens demand changes.
The US gun owners or 2A supporters shouldn't be aggressive or be confrontational with gun control advocates but they should push for improvements in the mental health issues & prevention of unstable people buying firearms. That is the more realistic & prudent direction IMO.
Sen Leiberman(I-CT) had a valid criticism of Wayne LaPierre's NRA speech.
To be short sighted or narrow minded at this time when parents have lost their children to a brutal attack is wrong.

Clyde
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Old January 6, 2013, 02:07 PM   #21
johnbt
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"If you've never been to Canada I suggest you visit. Their gun laws will be ours in 20 years."

I disagree with you.


"The ultimate showdown has been coming for quite a while."

People have been saying that since JFK was killed when I was in the 8th grade.



"Sen Leiberman(I-CT) had a valid criticism of Wayne LaPierre's NRA speech."

I disagree with you.


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Old January 6, 2013, 02:42 PM   #22
Cascade1911
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@tdawg
Quote:
When I bought my pistol, I had to fill out paperwork with very specific info about myself and the pistol, and then had to wait 7 days before it was mine. I don't see why everybody shouldn't go through the same regardless of where they buy one (ccw permit holders notwithstanding). It's easy to just save that background check and firearm data instead of discarding it within 24 hours.
NOOOO!!!!!

When I obtained my permit to poses a handgun I had to wait a couple of months. When I purchased my last pistol I had to wait a couple of weeks. Maybe that should be the norm.

This reminds me of the old story where a gentleman asks a women if she would sleep with him for a million dollars. She says she would. He then asks if she would do it for $10. She retorts angrily "What do you think I am, a prostitute"? The man replies, "we've already determined that, now we're just negotiating price".

@ ClydeFrog,
Quote:
To be short sighted or narrow minded at this time when parents have lost their children to a brutal attack is wrong.
Please define "short sighted" and "narrow minded".
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Old January 6, 2013, 03:18 PM   #23
ClydeFrog
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gun control issues; NRA statements...

Sen Leiberman made a point that the NRA focused on guns rather than the violent acts of the person who caused them.
In my view, the NRA should encourage changes in the mental health & procurement(buying/obtaining) weapons by unstable people.

Years ago the NRA & Wayne LaPierre lauded the city of Richmond VA & the VA prosecutors for the "exile" laws. Gun laws like 10/20/life that put away violent felons for extended periods when they used illegal firearms.
The NRA worked with govt agencies & elected officials to improve conditions.

That's what the NRA & other 2A groups should do now, in 2013.

Clyde
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Old January 6, 2013, 04:02 PM   #24
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Never forget that Obama has a love affair with "Executive Orders". Yes, Executive Orders can be overturned, but would Congress or the Supremes do so? I don't have much confidence in the SCOTUS and even less in Congress.

Quote:
Even if you've never called or written your congresscritters in the past, now's the time to do so.
I did and have heard nothing back from any of them.
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Old January 6, 2013, 04:20 PM   #25
manta49
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As a chl holder, I just fill out the form, show the salesman my license, then I'm out the door
You can do that here if its trading in one gun and buying a new one.
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