The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 23, 2012, 11:14 AM   #1
Muleskinner13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Posts: 3
Need some help with 204 Ruger

I am new to the website so bare with me. I have been reloading for about 45 yrs . I bought myself an atta boy present after retiring from 21yrs in Air Guard and three trips over in the Sand Box. The problem I am having with the 204 is the necks on the brass is cracking on almost new once fired brass. I am using Hornaday dies. I was told to check the head space and it is ok. I tried annealing some cases and must have over heated them cause the necks collapsed.

Could it be the brass itself? By the way the Rifle is a Savage Md 12

Any thoughts? Thanks and Merry Christmas to All

I tried to attach a picture but I don't think it went thru
Muleskinner13 is offline  
Old December 23, 2012, 11:50 AM   #2
Brian Pfleuger
Staff
 
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Central, Southern NY, USA
Posts: 17,446
Is this brass "once fired" in YOUR gun, I assume?

What kind of brass is it?

"Head space" shouldn't have any relation to neck splits. If head space was off enough to blow the shoulders forward enough to effect the neck, there should be visible, obvious changes in the case shape. Even then, you shouldn't be splitting necks in one firing. Ackley cases are formed that way in a lot of cartridges, neck failures do not result.

Be careful annealing brass, if you get too much heat down into the web/head area you can have catastrophic failures.

I load .204 and use some Hornady but mostly Norma brass. Some have 7-8 loads and I've never lost one to case failure.
Brian Pfleuger is online now  
Old December 23, 2012, 12:00 PM   #3
Muleskinner13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Posts: 3
Thanks for the reply

The brass has come from a couple of different guns. The necks are splitting when I reload them some are winchester and some Hornaday.
Muleskinner13 is offline  
Old December 23, 2012, 12:41 PM   #4
K472
Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2009
Location: SE Kansas
Posts: 31
I have been reloading the 204 for about 4 years now. The Hornady cases split for me too. I have thought about annealing them also. but as I only have it happen to about 1 in a 100 I have not done it yet.

I shoot an AR platform for Prarie dogs loaded fairly hot and full length resize each time.

I have also found that the Hornady rims are regularly oversize, making them difficult to get in and out of the shell holder at times.

I have used Winchester and Norma brass also. No issues so far with the Winchester. Norma provides noticeable accuracy improvements for my weapon but is very expensive.

If I was punching paper I would use it exclusively but I only need minute of prarie dog.
K472 is offline  
Old December 23, 2012, 01:36 PM   #5
kimbers rule
Member
 
Join Date: November 3, 2012
Location: State of Jefferson
Posts: 95
I have loaded alot of .204 in both winchester and hornady brass. Ive never had a problem with the winchester splitting but the flash holes are not concentric with the primer pockets. I have had hornadys split after the first reload. They were once fired factory brass and once I got the few that split out of the batch of 250 rounds I have had no trouble with the rest after about 8 loadings. R-P brass has been the best Ive used so far. And its affordable too.
kimbers rule is offline  
Old December 23, 2012, 02:38 PM   #6
hounddawg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2009
Posts: 760
had issues with Hornady brass also, using Winchester now but none have been reloaded
__________________
Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other. - Ronald Reagan
hounddawg is offline  
Old December 23, 2012, 08:59 PM   #7
Kevin Rohrer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 19, 2010
Location: Medina, Ohio
Posts: 498
It could be the brass. Hornady stuff doesn't have a good rep, although Winchester does.

You chamber neck could be oversize. What is the width of a fired round at the top of the neck?

Annealing *might* help, if done correctly. 750-degrees for 5-seconds will do it. Don't let the flame get past the shoulder. There are Youtube videos available to learn how to do it.
__________________
Member: Orange Gunsite Family, NRA--Life, Varmint Hunters' Assn., ARTCA, American Legion, & South Cuyahoga Sportsmen's Assn.

"Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery...all else is twaddle!" --Admiral Sir John Fisher, RN
Kevin Rohrer is offline  
Old December 24, 2012, 07:36 AM   #8
Muleskinner13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2012
Posts: 3
Thanks again for all the replys on the 204 ruger

I will try to refine my annealing process. And barrow another set of 204 dies and see if that makes a differance. I like the Md 12 Savage with the acura trigger. But the brass cracking bothers me. Thanks
Muleskinner13 is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 12:30 AM   #9
Colorado Redneck
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 6, 2008
Location: Northeast Colorado
Posts: 986
I have Remington brass for the 204 Ruger. After 3 or so resizings split necks start showing up. Not more than 2-3% each time. My gun hates neck sized brass so they are full length sized only.

I looked into annealing cases and to do it right is a bit more difficult than merely heating the case neck and dropping them in water. I would do a forum search here and on the Internet. It is easier for me to buy a bag of brass. YMMV
Colorado Redneck is offline  
Old December 25, 2012, 11:36 AM   #10
A_Gamehog
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 9, 2009
Location: Central Oregun
Posts: 556
Quote:
The problem I am having with the 204 is the necks on the brass is cracking on almost new once fired brass.
Stop "overthinking" your problem.

You don't anneal once fired 204 brass in a factory chamber. You made the necks softer and then inside chamfered them? to a knife point?

1). Full length size the brass
2). Trim to length.
3). Primer after cleaning holes.
4). Powder
5). Seat to length.
6). Test.
7). Repeat.

Then you can "cook" your brass with a torch after 5-6 loadings.

Enjoy reloading but get the 204 Ruger basics down first. It has it's own special problems you don't find with other cals. Winchester 204 brass is the worst out of the box to buy, I got 500 bad split necks from cabellas last year out of 1,000 I also use the RCBS comp. seater with the "window" to seat the flat based bullets for the 204. No more crushed cases using that seater die.
Brass is good but $$$
1). Norma 60$ per 100
2). Nosler 70+ per 100
3). Hornady 50+ per 100
4). Win-Rem 45+ per 100

I use Norma and Hornady now.Hornady has a thicker case neck than Norma!
knowing that you might need to process your loads differently.
Good luck.
__________________
"Happiness is knowing the Barred Owl is Eating the Spotted Owl and environmentalists are watching Nature take it's course"

Last edited by A_Gamehog; December 25, 2012 at 11:43 AM.
A_Gamehog is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 06:04 AM   #11
hounddawg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 1, 2009
Posts: 760
good info on the RCBS die Gamehog, those itty bitty flat bottomed bullets can be a pain, literally with the pinched fingers
__________________
Government is like a baby. An alimentary canal with a big appetite at one end and no sense of responsibility at the other. - Ronald Reagan
hounddawg is offline  
Old December 26, 2012, 10:15 PM   #12
Ifishsum
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 15, 2005
Location: Oregon
Posts: 689
I've got 8-9 loads on some of the first Hornady cases I bought with the rifle, don't think I've had a split neck yet. I noticed early on that the .204 really needs lube inside the necks when resizing - if I don't, the expander button puts enough pressure coming out the neck to elongate the shoulders and make them hard to chamber, especially with the Hornady brass. Sometimes even pulls the expander/decap rod through the die. Not sure if that has to do with your problem, but the extra working can"t be good. I usually neck size with a FL die backed off about a turn, and bump the shoulders back every 4-5 firings. Cases are very minimal chamfered, I only load BTs in it.
Ifishsum is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2013 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09413 seconds with 9 queries