home defense: .410 over 12 gauge - Page 2

Chainsawjames · December 8, 2012, 12:28 PM

I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of a .410 shotgun. If you had to defend your home with one, I'm sure the person on the other end would be injured severely. Especially at the close range in a home. Nothing wrong with a .410.

seeker_two · December 8, 2012, 12:29 PM

Hogdogs: Reading posts #3 & #8 seem to hint toward the ineffectiveness of the .410. And posts from other contributors here and in the other thread infer that using a .410, even with buckshot, is tantamount to using a .25acp. I think your three experts (Newton, mass, & math) would disagree.

I'm also confused as to how a 20ga using #3 shot is so vastly superior to a .410 using 000 buckshot. Does the #3 shot somehow penetrate deeper? I'd really like to know....

Pfletch83 · December 8, 2012, 12:38 PM

Wouldn't you say though that due to your own use of the .410 it made you a better shot with other gauges later on due to the lessons learned with that bolt action scattergun?

45_auto · December 8, 2012, 12:59 PM

Quote:

I make the argument the .410 is a supior home defense shotgun to the 12 gauge and i woullike to share why

Can't argue with you. Your well-researched (

) reasoning that the .410 has

1) equal power
2) less recoil
3) more pellets are not better

is why the police and military use .410's when they have to stop people.

(Oops, they use 12 gauges. Guess they'e just not as smart as you. Of course, you could do some additional research and try to discover WHY the other 99% of the world disagrees with you.)

I very seriously doubt if anyone would disagree with you if you claimed that a .410 was a viable home defense weapon (so is a .22), but to claim that it's superior to a 12 gauge and be wrong on 2 out of 3 of your reasons is pretty laughable.

**hogdogs** · December 8, 2012, 01:00 PM

Seeker, I do not try to claim the .410 to be "ineffective"... I do try to simply point out the potential to be less than effective is higher than a gun with a much larger payload of equal size pellets...

Pfletch, Certainly, I give that gun most of the credit for my current abilities with not only the shotgun but all guns in general...

And the best part... This kid who bucked formal training in anything... I never knew how much I was actually learning until looking back as an adult...

Them ol' cajun rabbit doggers with their sweet looking shiny wingmasters and auto loaders both braggin' up my shooting as well as some whining (literally) that I was shooting all the dang rabbits was my first hint that I was actually a decent shooter...

Not to mention, I also was a better woodsman and hunter and could setup in their woods in a premium spot to get the rabbit before it ever got pushed to their party...

Brent

Pfletch83 · December 8, 2012, 04:33 PM

To the O.P.

I wouldn't use the PDX-1 stuff personally.

Give the federal 3-inch #4 Buck a try.

As I have stated in my thread it gives a good pattern out of a full choke,and will do fine at close range without AS MUCH of an over punch worry.

*Notice I said AS MUCH*

WV_gunner · December 8, 2012, 04:35 PM

I too use a Circuit Judge for home defense. A small easy to move around with package is what I'm after. It has an 18 1/2 inch barrel and a pistol grip style stock. It's very easy to move around with this gun, I even took mine deer hunting this year. The sights are great and the overall feel of the gun is unmatched. It's also extremely light. I absolutely love this gun.
I was using 3 inch 000 in mine for home defense, but currently it's loaded with LeveRevolution .45 Colts.
For what it's worth, I also use an o/u 12 gauge with 3 inch #4, Winchester turkey loads.
Next idea is to use my Rifled Mossberg with mini slugs. Or maybe just Sabot Remington hollow points. They do incredible damage.

Shotgun693 · December 8, 2012, 04:50 PM

I've actually shot people with shotguns, not that it seems to matter much to some folks here. You stick to that .410 and under ideal conditions it might work just fine. I've never shot anyone under ideal conditions so I'll stick to a 12 ga.

SHR970 · December 8, 2012, 08:53 PM

Quote:

I make the argument the .410 is a supior home defense shotgun to the 12 gauge

Superior? Generally no. In certain circumstances where physical disability or limitations comes into play yes it could be.

Viable? Yes. There is certainly a plethora of less suitable options available in the world of firearms.

Quote:

From this point on, more is better takes over

Only to a point. Otherwise the 18 pellet 00Buck 3 1/2" magnums would be considered the new baseline. The previous baseline would have been the 15 pellet 00Buck 3" magnum.

OkieCruffler · December 8, 2012, 10:03 PM

For hunting, with the exception of deer/elk, my father only uses a .410 mossberg bolt action. He uses it for squirrel, rabbit, dove, even duck (or did before the lead ban). I've witnessed him take a couple of turkey with it. He may very well be one of the most impressive shooters I've ever known. But on his side of the bed sits an old Stevens pump 12ga. You can't possibly believe that the .410 is the equal of the 12ga in effectiveness just becasue the pellets are moving at the same speed. 22 lR is shooting at the same speed as well, but mass matters.

December 8, 2012, 12:29 PM	#27
seeker_two Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2002 Location: Deep in the Heart of the Lone Star State (TX) Posts: 1,547	Hogdogs: Reading posts #3 & #8 seem to hint toward the ineffectiveness of the .410. And posts from other contributors here and in the other thread infer that using a .410, even with buckshot, is tantamount to using a .25acp. I think your three experts (Newton, mass, & math) would disagree. I'm also confused as to how a 20ga using #3 shot is so vastly superior to a .410 using 000 buckshot. Does the #3 shot somehow penetrate deeper? I'd really like to know.... __________________ Proud member of Gun Culture 2.0......

December 8, 2012, 12:38 PM	#28
Pfletch83 Senior Member Join Date: November 3, 2012 Posts: 148	@ Hogdogs Wouldn't you say though that due to your own use of the .410 it made you a better shot with other gauges later on due to the lessons learned with that bolt action scattergun?

December 8, 2012, 01:00 PM	#30
hogdogs Staff Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 10,691	Seeker, I do not try to claim the .410 to be "ineffective"... I do try to simply point out the potential to be less than effective is higher than a gun with a much larger payload of equal size pellets... Pfletch, Certainly, I give that gun most of the credit for my current abilities with not only the shotgun but all guns in general... And the best part... This kid who bucked formal training in anything... I never knew how much I was actually learning until looking back as an adult... Them ol' cajun rabbit doggers with their sweet looking shiny wingmasters and auto loaders both braggin' up my shooting as well as some whining (literally) that I was shooting all the dang rabbits was my first hint that I was actually a decent shooter... Not to mention, I also was a better woodsman and hunter and could setup in their woods in a premium spot to get the rabbit before it ever got pushed to their party... Brent __________________ Finally have designs going up in the Hogdogs Outdoor Apparel online store. http://www.cafepress.com/hogdogsoutdoorapparel Thanks for lookin'...

December 8, 2012, 10:03 PM	#35
OkieCruffler Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2001 Location: Denison Texas on the banks of Texhoma Posts: 1,368	For hunting, with the exception of deer/elk, my father only uses a .410 mossberg bolt action. He uses it for squirrel, rabbit, dove, even duck (or did before the lead ban). I've witnessed him take a couple of turkey with it. He may very well be one of the most impressive shooters I've ever known. But on his side of the bed sits an old Stevens pump 12ga. You can't possibly believe that the .410 is the equal of the 12ga in effectiveness just becasue the pellets are moving at the same speed. 22 lR is shooting at the same speed as well, but mass matters. __________________ John A. Monroe, Never Forgive, Never Forget, Blood Pays Blood

December 8, 2012, 12:28 PM	#26
Chainsawjames Junior member Join Date: November 18, 2012 Posts: 23	I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of a .410 shotgun. If you had to defend your home with one, I'm sure the person on the other end would be injured severely. Especially at the close range in a home. Nothing wrong with a .410.

December 8, 2012, 04:33 PM	#31
Pfletch83 Senior Member Join Date: November 3, 2012 Posts: 148	To the O.P. I wouldn't use the PDX-1 stuff personally. Give the federal 3-inch #4 Buck a try. As I have stated in my thread it gives a good pattern out of a full choke,and will do fine at close range without AS MUCH of an over punch worry. Notice I said AS MUCH

December 8, 2012, 04:35 PM	#32
WV_gunner Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2011 Location: WV Posts: 444	I too use a Circuit Judge for home defense. A small easy to move around with package is what I'm after. It has an 18 1/2 inch barrel and a pistol grip style stock. It's very easy to move around with this gun, I even took mine deer hunting this year. The sights are great and the overall feel of the gun is unmatched. It's also extremely light. I absolutely love this gun. I was using 3 inch 000 in mine for home defense, but currently it's loaded with LeveRevolution .45 Colts. For what it's worth, I also use an o/u 12 gauge with 3 inch #4, Winchester turkey loads. Next idea is to use my Rifled Mossberg with mini slugs. Or maybe just Sabot Remington hollow points. They do incredible damage.

December 8, 2012, 04:50 PM	#33
Shotgun693 Senior Member Join Date: September 3, 2011 Location: Poteet, Texas Posts: 959	I've actually shot people with shotguns, not that it seems to matter much to some folks here. You stick to that .410 and under ideal conditions it might work just fine. I've never shot anyone under ideal conditions so I'll stick to a 12 ga.