The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Conference Center > General Discussion Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old November 30, 2012, 10:13 AM   #1
Colduglandon
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 5, 1999
Location: Mass
Posts: 480
Time to boycott Autozone?

Is it time to boycott businesses that are anti-gun?
http://wtkr.com/2012/11/30/autozone-...-beard-bandit/

from story "Devin’s manager is grateful.

“He was like “Thank you Devin, you really saved my life,” says McClean.

Two days later, he was fired.

“It’s pretty much getting slapped in the face doing something that you feel was right everybody else around you feels you were right,” says McClean.

NewsChannel 3 spoke to a representative at AutoZone’s corporate office, and he says that the company has a zero tolerance policy for employees having weapons inside the store.

“If I can save somebody’s life, I put that way above a store policy,” says McClean. "
Colduglandon is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 12:30 PM   #2
g.willikers
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 28, 2008
Posts: 5,407
Kind of less than ideal tactics, wasn't it?
As heroic as his actions were, in running back into the store to confront the bandit, wouldn't it had made more sense to stay outside and call the cops?
None the less, just on principle, we won't be buying any more car stuff from Autozone.
__________________
Lock the doors, they're coming in the windows.
g.willikers is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 12:44 PM   #3
BBgunsRule
Junior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2012
Posts: 1
My anecdotal phone call to Autozone about the employeed firing

Hello,
(Newbie here, I had to join and give my two cents worth.)
This story got me so riled up that I called the Autozone corporate office this morning to voice my opinion.
This is what followed (as best I can remember):
Corporate office in TN told me they had not heard of the news...
I told them that if the story is true, I will no longer do business with them.
They took my message down, and then offered to patch me to the regional Autozone office where the attempted robbery and employee firing took place.
I said sure, why not... After a couple minutes of being on hold, I was patched through to a conference/speaker phone call with some owner/manager/whatever guy...
He was not alone, as a woman could be heard on the line with him as he answered my questions. Anyway, the man on the phone told me the employee had been fired, but not for stopping a robbery...
When I asked was he fired for using his own gun to stop the robbery... he told me they had a zero tolerance for guns in the workplace...
So, I asked... He was fired for using a gun to stop a robbery?
Sir, we can't discuss employees, past or present, or terminations, yadda, yadda, yadda...
But, I reminded him, he had already told me the employee had been fired...
I then told him I wasn't a reporter, or a lawyer, just an average joe citizen, wanting answers and voicing my opinion...
At this point, I could tell he was getting mad...
He then asked if there was an auto part he could find for me... Over and over again... Sir, how can I help you? What do you want from me? What auto part may I locate for you?
I told him no thanks, that the call was kind of funny/ridiculous at this point. I told him that he could certainly count on me, my family, friends, that we would never shop at Autozone again.
He quickly told me that's the great thing about America... that I could shop wherever I wanted to... And, that he would love to keep me as a loyal customer forever... Etc.. (All of which came across the phone as a bunch of snarly hate filled attitude.)
I told him I appreciated his wanting to keep me as a loyal customer, but assured him again that I would never do business with Autozone again.
I then thanked him for his obvious hate and smart aleck attitude he had given me.
He then hung up on me. Such professionalism.
I suggest everyone call Autozone and voice their opinion.
BBgunsRule is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 01:49 PM   #4
jasmith85
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2012
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 368
I'm back and forth on this issue. If he had the weapon in his vehicle I don't see how it went against company policy. On the other hand, when I took my CCW course I was told you should never under any circumstances use a weapon unless you fear for your life. If you can run outside and get a gun you can run away and thus have no reason to fear for your life. I don't think he should have been fired but I do understand why he was fired.
jasmith85 is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 01:56 PM   #5
hardworker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 4, 2010
Posts: 820
You have to look at this from Autozone's point of view. It sucks they had to fire him, but if they didn't, they'd be sending a message to all other employees that bringing guns to work and confronting robbers is ok. Unfortunately, not everyone is Wyatt Earp.

He did the community a service but in today's lawyer world that's a lot of liability for a store to have.
hardworker is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 02:00 PM   #6
RedBowTies88
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 18, 2011
Location: 609 NJ
Posts: 705
Autozone is horrible anyway. My local one is stocked with complete imbiciles who don't even know what an ignition coil is.

I will be calling autozone reguardless to voice my opinion however.
__________________
"...with liberty and justice for all." (Must be 21. Void where prohibited. Some restrictions may apply. Not available in all states.)
RedBowTies88 is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 02:02 PM   #7
Strafer Gott
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 12, 2011
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,144
And let's not forget about Wally World among others. I don't think the kid would get fired at a mom and pop store. It's the big franchise stores that can't just sell you goods, but rather insinuate some out of state policy that insults our intelligence. I realize it's easy when you can pass your costs on to the masses, that a robbery impacts you less than hanging your morals and ethics out to dry with some policy that let's robbers walk. Morals and ethics aside, it's just business. I don't feel safe at places like these.
Strafer Gott is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 02:22 PM   #8
WileyP
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2011
Location: Sangre de Cristo Mountains, New Mexico
Posts: 13
Wanna do something about it? Here is a link to Autozone's web site e-mail. Drop them a line. Tell them you feel that Devin McLean should not have been fired for potentially saving the store manager's life. Tell them you feel it inappropriate to support the kind of thinking that would leave a man unemployed after he had saved their store manager's life and thereby also keeping their store from being robbed.

Thanks for being there, Devin - And good luck!

Wiley

PS - From jasmith85's post above: "...when I took my CCW course I was told you should never under any circumstances use a weapon unless you fear for your life. If you can run outside and get a gun you can run away and thus have no reason to fear for your life."

In some States, it is rquired that you do run away if you can instead of standing your ground. Does that mean you would not use your firearm to save the life of your spouse or children? How about your friend or neighbor? In most States, you are permitted to save the life of anyone, not just yourself.
__________________
"The government is good at one thing: It knows how to break your legs, then hand you a crutch and say, 'See? If it weren't for the government, you wouldn't be able to walk.'" - the late Harry Browne

Last edited by WileyP; November 30, 2012 at 02:29 PM.
WileyP is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 02:50 PM   #9
jasmith85
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2012
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 368
Quote:
In some States, it is rquired that you do run away if you can instead of standing your ground. Does that mean you would not use your firearm to save the life of your spouse or children? How about your friend or neighbor? In most States, you are permitted to save the life of anyone, not just yourself.
Yes I would use a firearm if need be to save someone I cared for. What I was pointing out is that, going by what I was taught, he not only went against their policy but also would have technically broke the law if he was here in Tennessee. I'm not saying he shouldn't have done it. I'm saying that I understand why they had the right to fire him.

Just to play devil advocate a little, I did not watch the video but the article said that he had robbed around 30 other businesses. It did not mention him ever even drawing the gun. It just said he would show the gun then take the money and leave. This employee running out and grabbing his gun greatly increased the risk of the criminal actually shooting someone. Had a shoot out started, it would have been because of his actions and people on the street could have been injured or worse. Thats why stores have policies to just give the criminal what they want.
jasmith85 is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 03:09 PM   #10
WileyP
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2011
Location: Sangre de Cristo Mountains, New Mexico
Posts: 13
Yes, they certainly do have the right to fire him. As you said, the very act of bringing his weapon into the store while he was at work was against company policy and, at least in this instance, they have a zero tolerance philosophy about it.

The "Fake Beard Bandit" did indeed have his weapon out. The video indicated that when Devin told the man to put down the gun and raise his hands, the bad guy raised his hands with the gun still in his hand...and then he fled the scene.

Wiley
__________________
"The government is good at one thing: It knows how to break your legs, then hand you a crutch and say, 'See? If it weren't for the government, you wouldn't be able to walk.'" - the late Harry Browne
WileyP is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 03:21 PM   #11
CWKahrFan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 3, 2010
Posts: 1,839
Quote:
Just to play devil advocate a little...
Well, that's the thing... Many corporate lawyers basically ARE advocates for the devil when they let the "demons" run amok 20, 30, 100? times with no repercussions.

Why should they stop?... It's a sad state of affairs.

Oh well, maybe some 2nd Amendment supporter will gladly hire Devin after seeing the video.
__________________
What did Mrs. Bullet say to Mr. Bullet? ... "We're having a BeeBee!"...
IF THE SHOE FITS, WEAR IT!... IF THE GUN FITS, SHOOT IT!
"Experience is something you don't get until just after you need it."
CWKahrFan is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 04:00 PM   #12
Ben Towe
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 6, 2009
Location: Middle Tennessee
Posts: 1,122
Quote:
Yes I would use a firearm if need be to save someone I cared for. What I was pointing out is that, going by what I was taught, he not only went against their policy but also would have technically broke the law if he was here in Tennessee.
Not true if he thought the manager was in danger.
Quote:
Tennessee Code 39-11-612. Defense of third person.

A person is justified in threatening or using force against another to protect a third person, if:

(1) Under the circumstances as the person reasonably believes them to be, the person would be justified under § 39-11-611 in threatening or using force to protect against the use or attempted use of unlawful force reasonably believed to be threatening the third person sought to be protected; and

(2) The person reasonably believes that the intervention is immediately necessary to protect the third person.
__________________
'Merica: Back to back World War Champs
Ben Towe is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 04:51 PM   #13
wayneinFL
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 18, 2004
Posts: 1,935
Of course they have the right to fire him.

And I have the right to shop somewhere else for auto parts.
wayneinFL is offline  
Old November 30, 2012, 05:09 PM   #14
Dr Big Bird PhD
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 26, 2012
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 778
They have the right to. They should not have.
__________________
I told the new me,
"Meet me at the bus station and hold a sign that reads: 'Today is the first day of the rest of your life.'"
But the old me met me with a sign that read: "Welcome back."
Who you are is not a function of where you are. -Off Minor
Dr Big Bird PhD is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 05:32 AM   #15
Master Blaster 2
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 29, 2011
Posts: 895
I think AutoZone did the right thing. If they didn't enforce it consistently then they open themselves up for lawsuits later for picking and choosing who to enforce the policy with. I'm glad the man is ok, but he was on company property. The company has a right to make choices regarding weapons on the premiss. I know that I have no way of knowing the what the outcome would have been if the employee had not had his weapon. But every other day he may have brought the gun to work and nothing happened, was in violation of policy. Any other employee found out with a weapon on them would have been fired on those days, why not him? Sure it sucks but he made his choice and now he has to live with it.
Master Blaster 2 is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 06:58 AM   #16
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,581
+1 MB2

Devin took the job knowing there would be consequences for breaking the rules and what the rules were. He agreed to take their money in exchange for working and abiding by the company rules. He broke the rules and was fired.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 07:10 AM   #17
Master Blaster 2
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 29, 2011
Posts: 895
Autozone is a private business and has a no firearms rules can be on their property by their employees. Autozone pay them to work there.. Just like Walmart.
I don't get where is the outrage here when no one can carry a friearm into Federal, State or County Court House? We as tax payers own thoes building Or a Military Base. Where is the outrage in that?

I will still buy and won't Boycott- Autozone, Pizzahut, Dairy Queen, McDonalds, Carls Jr.,Dollar General, Arbies, Burger King, Karogedrs, Walgreen, Wallmart, Ford Motors, General Motors, and everywhere else that has incidence like this every month..



https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&....1.UirmwEnT5mo
Master Blaster 2 is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 08:05 AM   #18
Chilidogs
Junior Member
 
Join Date: November 25, 2012
Posts: 11
Auto Zone has every right to fire him per their company policy.

I have every right to never go to Auto Zone again and call them every day for 2 weeks and remind them of that as well.

The fact that Devin McClean had to leave the premises to get a gun and than come back inside to confront the perp is another issue all together.

I'm glad, for Devin's sake, no one was shot as I don't think he'd like the outcome of that trial.
Chilidogs is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 10:14 AM   #19
zenner22
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 30, 2006
Posts: 226
jasmith85 said - "Just to play devil advocate a little, I did not watch the video but the article said that he had robbed around 30 other businesses. It did not mention him ever even drawing the gun. It just said he would show the gun then take the money and leave. This employee running out and grabbing his gun greatly increased the risk of the criminal actually shooting someone. Had a shoot out started, it would have been because of his actions and people on the street could have been injured or worse. Thats why stores have policies to just give the criminal what they want."

This is the anti gun mentality, what their entire anti carry stance is based on. Just give the criminal what he wants and no one will get hurt. Well, most of the time. Sometimes he'll just kill you anyway. But he MIGHT not! Best to leave the criminal in control of the situation, everyone is safer that way. Cower in the corner and let the bad guy decide whether or not he feels like killing you that day. If you try to fight for your life you will only make it worse.

Autozone has now published their willingness to get robbed. Don't worry criminals, come on down the Autozone! We'll not only give you whatever you want, we'll also help you carry it to the car! Don't worry, if anyone resists we'll fire them! We want to make you, the robber, safe. We'll do what we can to make your criminal experience an easy, satisfying one. Rob us? Sure, go ahead! Rape us? Why not? Kill us? Feel free, we won't put up a fight! We, at Autozone are there for you, the criminal psychopath. So, come on down to Autozone and rob us today!

Last edited by zenner22; December 1, 2012 at 10:25 AM.
zenner22 is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 11:01 AM   #20
hardworker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 4, 2010
Posts: 820
Let's put this in perspective.

You hire a landscaping crew to work on your yard. You have no real idea who these people are or their qualifications/familiarity with a gun. Your family spends time in the yard while this work is going on. Do you really want these random people working for you toting guns around your yard drawing on anyone they deem a threat? If not, congratulations, now you see Autozone's point of view.
hardworker is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 11:19 AM   #21
zenner22
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 30, 2006
Posts: 226
How about all these "random" people that work in gun stores? Where I am every employee of any local gun store is probably carrying a gun whether you see it or not. These people are employees of the store. They did not have to pass any kind of competency test with a firearm or go to a school. Where I am you can carry concealed with no permit. And as far as I am concerned the more people that do, the better.

Many times even on forums we think because we post here it's ok for us to have one but not ok for the "average" citizen, they don't have the knowledge or training that we do. Sounds kind of like the Bloombergs of our time, it's ok for them but not ok for us. We don't take that too well when we're deemed not responsible enough to have a gun. Why would we treat other legal citizens the same way?

I think it was Dave Spaulding who wrote an article for Shooting Wire a couple months ago that addressed this. Basically he said that for all the tactical, fancy training many of us put ourselves through, the vast majority of the time the lady with the 38 snub bought new and stuffed in a drawer for the past 10 years somehow manages to defend herself just fine.
zenner22 is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 11:31 AM   #22
Chilidogs
Junior Member
 
Join Date: November 25, 2012
Posts: 11
Quote:
et's put this in perspective.

You hire a landscaping crew to work on your yard. You have no real idea who these people are or their qualifications/familiarity with a gun. Your family spends time in the yard while this work is going on. Do you really want these random people working for you toting guns around your yard drawing on anyone they deem a threat? If not, congratulations, now you see Autozone's point of view.
hardworker is offline Report Post
Can you cite any cases where an armed citizen injured or killed a bystander while legally defending oneself or one's property?

If not...let's add a dash of reality into that perspective.
Chilidogs is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 12:28 PM   #23
hardworker
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 4, 2010
Posts: 820
Quote:
How about all these "random" people that work in gun stores? Where I am every employee of any local gun store is probably carrying a gun whether you see it or not. These people are employees of the store. They did not have to pass any kind of competency test with a firearm or go to a school. Where I am you can carry concealed with no permit. And as far as I am concerned the more people that do, the better.
They work at a gun store, not an auto parts store. It's to be expected that they're carrying.

Quote:
Many times even on forums we think because we post here it's ok for us to have one but not ok for the "average" citizen, they don't have the knowledge or training that we do. Sounds kind of like the Bloombergs of our time, it's ok for them but not ok for us. We don't take that too well when we're deemed not responsible enough to have a gun. Why would we treat other legal citizens the same way?
I think everyone should have the right to have a gun, and as long as they're not a threat to anyone else, they can be as incompetent with one as they want. I know people that own guns that are a danger to those around them. If they worked for me I'd make sure they didn't have one on them while at work. As a business owner you're responsible for anything your employees do. All it takes is one Dirty Harry wannabe to create a multi-million dollar lawsuit. Having that policy on the books and enforcing it takes liability off the company.

Quote:
Can you cite any cases where an armed citizen injured or killed a bystander while legally defending oneself or one's property?

If not...let's add a dash of reality into that perspective.
I'm not going to research for this, but the internet is full of negligent discharge stories done by people who were "safe with guns" until they accidentally shot their leg practicing quick draw. If they want to do that at home, more power to them. As a business owner, there's no place for that kind of liability.
hardworker is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 12:44 PM   #24
Stressfire
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2011
Location: Ohio
Posts: 1,497
Quote:
Time to boycott Autozone?
No need in my case. The one in my area is staffed by either gearheads or idiots, both of which treat the customer like crap if they ask any questions whatsoever.

So I go to Advanced Auto instead, much nicer people and better treatment towards the less mechanically inclined

Corporate policy is corporate policy, though, and they have the right to make their own rules for employees. Stupid? IMO, yes, it is.

I work in a no guns building, government (technically), not private. I have no doubt that were I to go out to my car and come back in with my weapon, even to defend my coworkers or the public, I would be both fired and charged.

I make no secret of my "plan" in the eventuality of a robbery or violent encounter - I'm going out the window, you're all on your own
__________________
"The best diplomat I know is a fully charged phaser bank" - Montgomery Scott
Stressfire is offline  
Old December 1, 2012, 05:42 PM   #25
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague County, Texas
Posts: 10,581
Quote:
Can you cite any cases where an armed citizen injured or killed a bystander while legally defending oneself or one's property?
Quote:
I'm not going to research for this,...
There, did the hard work for you, hardworker.

Here you go...
http://www.myfoxhouston.com/story/18661869/chl

Hitting the wrong person isn't just a concern during self defense. There are numerous incidents of employees and volunteers permit holders having NDs that injured or killed others while at work.

http://www.denverpost.com/breakingne...d-carry-permit

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...urch-dies.html

http://www.newarkpostonline.com/news...1e109e042.html

http://www.nhregister.com/articles/2...a478819539.txt
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher."
-- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.14392 seconds with 9 queries