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Old November 12, 2012, 07:21 PM   #26
OsOk-308
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Mid-Length is the best compromise in my opinion. Even with a 16" barrel you get a longer sight radius and a slightly better gas system. I really see no advantage to the carbines with the short handguards.
I could not agree more. I had one carbine, and I liked it well enough, but I sold it and have a 16" with midlength system. But if you're going to have a 16" barrel, go middy for the gas system and longer sight radius. Indoors-midlength outdoors-rifle!
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Old November 12, 2012, 07:35 PM   #27
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For the 5.56 round, a 20 inch barrel seems more appropriate, with a good compromise of velocity, moderate noise and sufficient barrel stiffness for length. However, the market seems very focused on 16 inch barrels with many options and lots of competition.
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Old November 12, 2012, 09:14 PM   #28
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I've always been partial to the 20" AR's. I like the sight radius and the length is more of a blessing than a detractor. I'm not out kicking in meth lab doors with a team so don't need a shorty. I've shot a 16" bbl AR before and didn't like the increased muzzle blast over the longer tube.

Besides, the 223 is sort of a pipsqueak round anyway, and can use all the velocity it can get, ergo longer barrel.
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Old November 13, 2012, 02:00 AM   #29
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I'm weird when it comes to aesthetics and how some guns are "supposed to be"

To me, a carbine is supposed to have a 14.5" barrel. If I can't have that then I see no reason to half-ass it. May as well just get a full-length 20" rifle.

So I guess there will be no carbines or commandos in my future until they either repeal the NFA or I feel like paying the SBR tax.
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Old November 13, 2012, 04:16 AM   #30
Rob96
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After using the M16 in the service and owning a few carbines, I have to say I really like the 18" barrel with rifle length gas system and adjustable stock. For me it works best.
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Old November 13, 2012, 04:53 AM   #31
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For general purposes not involving long range shooting, the M4 Carbine models are just more compact and lightweight overall -- depending on your accesories of course. But if you keep everything to a minimum, a carbine will serve most uses and will be as reliable if set up correctly.

The other compromise as others have said is a mid-length with a 16 or 18-inch barrel. My 300Blackout middy with 12-inch rail was a good setup without the longer rifle profile and heavier weight.



I'd love to build an AR15 rifle length in the future..
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Old November 13, 2012, 02:58 PM   #32
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I think that i have the same solutions everyone else does. I have a midleanth 16" for Home Defense, and a longer (18" MK12 Style) for target work and to get a boost in MV. I can for some situations really see the need for short barrels on the AR15, I know that the shorter you go the lower the MV goes, but sometimes the handyness of the system outweights the defects. If it were not for the horrible muzzle blast i would almost consider getting an SBR for home defense, but the combined effects of muzzle blast, paper work and fees just turns me away.

Now having fired both 16", and 14.5" weapons indoors I have to say that its loud and lots of flash but I did not notice the blast myself. (my concern in the future, would be hearing damage to members of my family from a defensive shooting.)

As for sight radius with mid, full, and carbine it does not matter to me. Since I mostly use some sort of optic I use the sight for backup. Even at times when shooting the three I did not notice that I shot any better or worse with oen vs. the other. I know that sometimes the theoretical differance in accuracy from something is midagated by our shooting skill. (or in my case sometimes lack there of!) It would be intresting to have some really good shooters do a study with the differant leanths of sights and then get some stats on what the exact effect is. We all know it does have an effect but how much really, or is it more like the differance between .15 & .20 MOA? I can't shoot that well to notice. just a thought.
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Old November 13, 2012, 03:43 PM   #33
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I'm weird when it comes to aesthetics and how some guns are "supposed to be"

To me, a carbine is supposed to have a 14.5" barrel. If I can't have that then I see no reason to half-ass it. May as well just get a full-length 20" rifle.
It's not just aesthetics though.... The carbine length gas system is designed for (roughly) 10-14.5'' barrels. When you start using it on longer barrels it tends to put more force on the bolt/lugs and can (not always, I know...) cause sheering. From my understanding, this is why Colt now puts "H" buffers in their civilian 6920s. With the exception of my Colts, all my 16'' ARs are middys for this reason. Just throwing that out there
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Old November 13, 2012, 04:13 PM   #34
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To me, a carbine is supposed to have a 14.5" barrel. If I can't have that then I see no reason to half-ass it. May as well just get a full-length 20" rifle.

So I guess there will be no carbines or commandos in my future until they either repeal the NFA or I feel like paying the SBR tax.
If I was going to go with a $200 tax stamp, I would not waste it on a 14.5" upper..... I would go with a max 12" and probably a 10.5" upper.

Spending that kind of money and only cutting back 1.5" just seems silly to me...
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Old November 13, 2012, 04:32 PM   #35
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You know that the SBR stamp applies tot he lower right? So you're not really "wasting" it for just 1.5". You can put multiple uppers on the same SBR lower. 7s, 10s, 14s whatever you want.

So i would get one registered lower and 2 uppers. 14.5" and 11.5". Maybe a tiny 7" upper as well.
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Old November 13, 2012, 04:45 PM   #36
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Yea I did....until I forgot while I was thinking about which upper I would pair it with


...my bad


I do have a question though, are you able to get SBRs in NY?
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Old November 13, 2012, 06:02 PM   #37
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Not in NYC. I'm pretty sure not in the rest of the state either. AWB and all.
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Old November 13, 2012, 06:35 PM   #38
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The federal AWB expired during the Bush admin . At this time it would be a state by state ban not federal. You would need to check your state laws to see if the SBR is baned or not in your state .( "Don't quote me on that" )
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Old November 13, 2012, 06:43 PM   #39
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Still very much alive and well here. And quite a bit worse than the federal AWB to boot.

The federal law allowed you to have 2 evil features. Here you're not allowed ANY evil features and pretty much all of the fun guns are banned by name regardless of how badly you neuter them.

9 more months and I'll be in Texas. *twiddling thumbs*
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Old November 13, 2012, 06:50 PM   #40
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Me to-ish . Im in C.A. and we have some tuff gun laws but not like N.Y. . In some ways I sure am glad we have the bullet button . It allows us to have all the cool stuff . I don't think we can have an SBR


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Old November 13, 2012, 07:24 PM   #41
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9 more months and I'll be in Texas. *twiddling thumbs*
Welcome to freedom

...heck, in 9 more months you might not even reside in the United States
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Old November 13, 2012, 09:16 PM   #42
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I have trouble thinking of any AR as a rifle. They all seem like carbines to me. ASSAULT CARBINES!!!
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Old November 14, 2012, 10:31 PM   #43
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I like shorter barrels. They feel more handy to me. I do like long barrels for activities like shooting Ground rats just because the added speed helps (some what) with bullet drop.
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Old November 14, 2012, 11:33 PM   #44
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Rifle length
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Old November 15, 2012, 06:09 AM   #45
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I have a 16" and was thinking about buying a 20" rifle length gun, but for ranges up to 300 yds others have told me their will be no increase in accuracy. With my 16" carbine I get groups at 100 yds that can be covered with a dime and groups at 300 yds that can be covered with a fifty cent piece using my hand loads, a bipod and nikon 3-9x40 scope.
So right now I am sitting on the fence as to if I should buy a 20" rifle or not.
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Old November 15, 2012, 07:18 AM   #46
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rebs

You get groups that a dime can cover at 100yds (1/4 MOA)? and you needed others to tell you that you would not get better accuracy with a 20" barrel . Your not going to get much better accuracy with any other rifle on the planet little lone barrel . Thats some nice shooting
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Old November 15, 2012, 09:03 AM   #47
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Rebs..... If you're getting groups that size.... It just don't get better than that.... At least making then better isn't as easy as buying a 20" rifle.

I say stick with what you've got.

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Old November 15, 2012, 02:52 PM   #48
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I like both and have both. Carbine length for HD, a 20" midweight barrel for varmint hunting, and a standard A2 HB upper with an M4 6 position stock.
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