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Old October 10, 2012, 04:09 PM   #1
JarheadHunter
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Questions onCamp Carbines

I was ignorant to Camp Carbines till I recently started looking into them. I have some questions for some of you salt dog gun fanatics out there. 1) would anyone recommend either the 9mm or .45 for hunting whitetail deer or farrel hogs? That briongs me to the second question. What have some of you experienced as far as maximum effectivness for 9mm or 45? I would be shooting from approximately 100yds as far as hunting. I love teh idea of the pistol cartridge in a rifle and this will most likely be my next gun purchase. Of course that depends on the opinions i get here.....
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Old October 10, 2012, 04:21 PM   #2
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I have killed deer and feral hogs with the .45. In each case the animals had been wounded with other weapons and needed to be put down. This was strictly a close range proposition. I've also dispatched a deer with a 9mm. I don't recommend hunting with either.
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Old October 10, 2012, 04:36 PM   #3
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I wouldn't use one unless it was all I had and it was a survival sitution. Feral hogs can range from 50 lbs to 500. While either would work on the smaller ones, I wouldn't want to shoot one of the big ones with either caliber.

On whiteail at close range either would work, but there are much better choices.
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Old October 10, 2012, 08:02 PM   #4
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Damn i was really hoping to hear different. That would be the only real way i could justify buying it with my wife. It still seams like it would be a hell of a lot of fun and a good little brush gun at that. Now i have to ask about if I looked into a .30 Carbine. I am so curious in these becasue i have always shot rifles, shotguns, and pistols. Closest carbine was an M4 that was issued and well i dont consider it anything the same.
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Old October 10, 2012, 08:19 PM   #5
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I have a Camp9 marlin, and I feel it's more of a SD carbine. 9mm doesn't get a big boost from the longer barrel. I don't think either chambering is legal for deer, but Ruger made a semi in .44 mag and it is legal most everywhere, and is much more effective.
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Old October 10, 2012, 09:00 PM   #6
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I was issued and carried a Model 28 in LE.

I was with the Anchorage Police Dept. We had a lot of Moose/vehicle accidents that required we put down injured moose.

My 357 w/LSWCs worked perfect for the task. Late in my career they stated allowing semi autos and I went to a 1911.

I wasn't impressed with the way the 45 handled moose so I went back to my Model 28.

If you want a rifle that shoots hand gun rounds I'd recommend one of the levers shooting 357/44s.

For semis a good one would have been that 44 Ruger that came out a while back. Don't know what happened to them but that would be a good choice.

Also you might want to check your game laws, some states, including Wyoming have restrictions on such cartridges. 44s were good, at present 357s are out but that's suppose to change next year. 9mms and 45acps are a No No in Wyoming.
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Old October 11, 2012, 02:16 AM   #7
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the smallest caliber carbine I would hunt with is 357 mag, I have owned a 9mm carbine, and was disappointed.
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Old October 11, 2012, 03:17 AM   #8
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nope

While likely a fun gun, a 9mm carbine, or a .45, is not good deer medicine. The best 9mm loads don't come clsoe to .357, which is about border line as a deer rifle. A heavy .45 is some better, but not by much. Can it be done...sure. Heck deer get killed w/ .22 lr. But not advisable.

I've shot .45 acp handgun to 100 yds. It was like mortar fire.
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Old October 11, 2012, 12:08 PM   #9
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Buy it for your wife. They have very low recoil and are
sized for smaller stature adults and children. She might
even let you shoot it once in a while.
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Old October 11, 2012, 08:32 PM   #10
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A guy here in Houston is selling a Ruger .44mag carbine, very rare rifle. Looks exactly like a 10/22.

http://texasguntrader.com/index.php?a=2&b=248889

.44mag in a carbine would probably put you close to 30-30 ballistics. Pretty cool little gun.
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Old October 11, 2012, 11:49 PM   #11
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I have read that those .44 magnum Ruger carbines had feed problems. Has anyone owned one ? If so you give your opinion on them, as I know there were two versions.
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Old October 12, 2012, 12:04 PM   #12
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For the OP's purpose, the M1 Carbine is "better" than the 9mm or .45 ACP, also offering the same or better "firepower" while outranging those rounds. (Thompson gunners would call "even" a carbine guy over to take out "that sniper in yonder palm tree" they were having trouble with--if an even better Garand wasn't handy). Among the above, the .30 Carbine is closest to. .357, but like the comments about 9/.45, I wouldn't get one specifically to hunt for anything larger than varmints or as a pest'er, only if you had to for "survival." "Yes you can" doesn't mean "yes you should," the .30 Carbine is great, but for hunting, the .357 trumps it due to heavier/better bullet selection, related downrange energy "within its effectice range," and the slightly bigger hole it creates. I'll +1 a .357 or better yet .44 Mag lever, especially for the hogs--again among the calibers mentioned and within the "pistol" caliber theme of the thread.

Not a "pistol" round, but I'd pick a .30-30 over any of them if not only hog but deer was possibly on the menu past the above guns' 75-125 yd effective "hunting" range
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Old October 12, 2012, 12:57 PM   #13
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There's nothing "boderline" with a .357 rifle for deer if you limit your shots to 100-125 yds. With certain ammo it can approach .30-30 velocity at that distance.

The OP should consider a .357 levergun or a .30 Carbine.
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Old October 12, 2012, 07:13 PM   #14
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Jeff did a review of the 9mm version back in 2009. He lists out some of the velocities. Check it out, might impress you. Personally... I've always wanted the .45 version.

http://www.gunblast.com/Marlin-Camp9.htm

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Old October 12, 2012, 08:14 PM   #15
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I chose the M1 Carbine over either the 9mm, or .45 carbine. I got 'em from the CMP. Nice light carbines. I use for Coyote, feral cats and dogs and any other light game in season. Though I have taken to using a Desert Eagle in .357 magnum I am not beyond taking a M1 Carbine with me. At Bow and Arrow distance I think the M1 Carbine could be relied upon to do the job on Whitetail Deer.
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Old October 12, 2012, 11:13 PM   #16
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People go hunting with a 357 handgun at ~1400fps. A hot 9mm with slow powder in a carbine barrel will do at least that much.
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Old October 13, 2012, 12:51 AM   #17
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9mm and .357 magnum are not even close.
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Old October 13, 2012, 01:15 AM   #18
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Hook - I owned one of the Ruger .44 Mag carbines in the early 1970s. Kept it less than a year and sold it since it didn't seem to have a whole lot more oomph than my Blackhawk 7 1/2" in .45LC. I can't recall any feeding problems - it's just that I expected some kind of major improvement in "thump" and didn't get it. And it didn't have the smooth action and sex appeal of an M1 carbine, which may not sound logical. At least that's as best I can remember.

Today do I wish I still had that Ruger? Somewhat, but not enough to buy one again unless it was a steal. I can't remember any gun I parted with that I am still glad is gone, except a post-'64 .30-30 Model 94. Had no need for it and back then we still worshipped the pre-'64 guns.
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Old October 13, 2012, 01:17 AM   #19
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apples to apples

Especially from a carbine.
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Old October 13, 2012, 05:42 PM   #20
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Thanks for the reply Florida. I assume the early 70's Ruger was tube fed. I think I'll be content with the Marlin 1894SS.
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Old October 13, 2012, 10:25 PM   #21
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You can compare the velocities for yourself on Jeff's review linked above. If we are comparing 9mm to a .357 revolver, the 9mm rifle can do good work. True, .357 Magnum out of a rifle will open up the gap again but I think the comparison was that people seem to think that a .357 Magnum revolver is "powerful enough for deer hunting."

The big advantage of the larger .357 Magnum case is going to be heavier bullets/slower powders. Quite obviously 9mm is never going to be able to match the kinds of hunting loads we see using 158 grain and 180 grain bullets. But if you are talking about 115-125 grain Gold Dot or other bonded bullets which should stay together at higher velocities... should have potential.

And I have to agree, any carbine is going to give you far greater hit potential under stress. Especially over any kind of range at all. Multiple attackers spread out over 25-50 meters... really... would there be any doubt you would be better off with a carbine than a handgun for both hit potential and time between shots?

re: Ruger .44 carbines

I've got the later model, the one with the detachable magazine. It's a great little rifle. I normally hunt out of a tree stand and the deer are never further than 75 meters away. And sometimes I get bored and start trying to move slowly through the thick stuff, trying to get one to jump up practically under my feet. That's almost like quail hunting. For both types of shooting, the Ruger is just about all you need. I'm always taking "something new" out to deer hunt but honestly I could just use that little rifle every time and it could do everything I need. The accuracy is more than enough, it cycles perfectly, recoil is nearly non-existent, a second shot is quick (although I've never used one) and .44 Magnum out of a rifle is deadly. Put a short light scope on it and it can do the job.

If you take my .44 Magnum carbine and put it side by side on the bed with my Ruger 10/22, they are virtual twins. A sharp eye would notice the thicker barrel or the plastic operating rod guard but they are virtually the EXACT same size and profile. Think of how quick and easy the 10/22 swings in your hands. The .44 is the same thing.

Gregg
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Old October 13, 2012, 10:26 PM   #22
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a 4" S&W shoots a 180 bullet at 1375 fps for 750 ft-lbs of energy. Refer us to a 9mm that will match that please.

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.ph...t_detail&p=100
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Old October 14, 2012, 12:02 AM   #23
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Hook - good question re the tube versus mag loading. Beats me, and I don't have the incentive to check it out. Just this month I dug out of my SD box a bunch of my old receipts for guns I bought or parted with, and the Ruger was one of them. The serial # was 100-316xx and I sold it on November 20, 1975 for $125.00.

My body clock and other signs are telling me that it's time to get my affairs in order, so that my descendants don't have as much hassle as some others do. This is where the rubber meets the road, IMO. At this point, I think that very few women would prioritize ordering (sorting) their guns and who they go to and their provenance, over other things. I am not the least bit apologetic that, as far as possessions and main memories go, my guns are "me" and I want my offspring to remember me that way.
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Old October 14, 2012, 09:53 AM   #24
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I'll drink to that. I bought 5 CMP M1 Carbines, one each for my grandkids and one for me that I will pass on to my son. If I am remembered every time they look at one of them I will smile.
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Old October 14, 2012, 10:37 PM   #25
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Back in college we did some chronograph testing with a Camp 45 and a PC9 Ruger and there wasn't much boost in velocity with some loads, some got quite an improvement, and one or two were actually slower from the carbine barrel. I seem to remember that the then new 147gr 9mm did much worse and that not all +p loads got a boost. Choose your ammo carefully, it may not perform like you expect.
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