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Old October 5, 2012, 02:56 PM   #1
Win73
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Is this doe challenging this buck (video)

I got this video of this doe apparently challenging (?) this buck on my trail cam. Any body else ever seen a doe do this?

http://s869.photobucket.com/albums/a...0Challenge.mp4
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Old October 5, 2012, 03:54 PM   #2
FrankenMauser
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She looks "submissively assertive" ... if that makes any sense, at all.

She appears to be trying to tell the buck that she wants the good spot, but simultaneously being fairly submissive and cautious.
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Old October 5, 2012, 04:35 PM   #3
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I sat over a doe and 2 fawns one time. She and her kids bedded under my stand and i listened to he chew her cudd for about 30 min. I heard another animal approaching and got to watch her reaction to the little buck about like the one in the video. The doe never showed any sign of interest in the approaching buck, then must have got his sent when he got within 20 yard.
That doe was all over the little buck, nuzzling him and, well she was a slutt!
One of the fawns got up and was watching the happenings and while she was nuzzling his flanks and his head was up in a peacock like pose, I dropped him in his tracks. She jumped straight in the air and ran about 10 yards and then just started browsing around. The fawn that was still in its bed got up and went over to the downed buck and sniffed it a bit and then went bawling over to mom. They browsed right by my stand for the next 40 min. and then I heard 1 twig snap. The doe's tail went up and the next twig that cracked she was full speed in the opposite direction. I was really curious as to what was now coming my way and a few min. later in walks a nice 8 pointer!
Well i was very curious as to what his reaction would be to the downed buck but I also didn't want to loose this guy, after all it was Tuesday and the radio in camp was calling that day, Two for Tuesday and I told my B-I-L that that sounded like a good plan, that I was going to shoot two buck that day, he said he would also and we both did just that! .
Well when the 8 pointer was coming to me I had decided that if I get any shot other than the head-on i would take it. Well he turned at the sent of the doe where she crossed the trail he was on and gave me a good shot that put him down too.
Sorry for the long story.
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Old October 5, 2012, 04:52 PM   #4
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The doe does not appear to be challenging the buck, not in a fighting sort of way and the buck is not responding as if challenged.

Quote:
That doe was all over the little buck, nuzzling him and, well she was a *****!
Wrongly and inappropriate biological assessment of a doe in estrus. Additional activity, head ducking, glance posturing, attentiveness are all signs does may exhibit while in estrus and are seen in the video, except maybe the last (attentiveness) which we didn't have time to assess.
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Old October 5, 2012, 04:54 PM   #5
shortwave
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Looks as though the actions of the smaller deer is a bit submissive but are you 100% sure it is a doe? I had to repeatedly freeze frame the video but did get to a spot where I could see the back of the deers head and it looks rather lighter in color where antlers should be.
Is it possible that the smaller deer was that years buck with just bumps instead of horns popping through?

Last edited by shortwave; October 5, 2012 at 07:25 PM.
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Old October 5, 2012, 06:31 PM   #6
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delete

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Old October 5, 2012, 11:12 PM   #7
Win73
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Quote:
...are you 100% sure it is a doe? I had to repeatedly freeze frame the video but did get to a spot where I could see the back of the deers head and it looks rather lighter in color where antlers should be.
Is it possible that the smaller deer was that years buck with just bumps instead of horns popping through?
Now that you mention it, no, I can't be sure. The camera takes a still picture then the video when in the video mode. Here is the still but it didn't get enough of the deer to help much.

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Old October 6, 2012, 02:19 AM   #8
FrankenMauser
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Around the 0:25 mark, where the antlerless deer walks slowly past the camera, there's a better shot of its belly and back side.

It doesn't appear to have testicles or a penis.
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Old October 6, 2012, 04:16 AM   #9
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And the glands on the hind legs are quite diminuitive, as you would expect on a doe.

Quote:
I had to repeatedly freeze frame the video but did get to a spot where I could see the back of the deers head and it looks rather lighter in color where antlers should be.
The lighter color areas on the back of the head are normal pelage coloring. Besides, antlers don't grow off of the back of the head. The pedicles of the antlers grow out of the frontal bones and are located above and forward of the ears, not on the back side.
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Old October 6, 2012, 09:10 AM   #10
shortwave
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Quote:
Quote:
I had to repeatedly freeze frame the video but did get to a spot where I could see the back of the deers head and it looks rather lighter in color where antlers should be.
Quote:
Besides, antlers don't grow off of the back of the head. The pedicles of the antlers grow out of the frontal bones and are located above and forward of the ears, not on the back side.
I think my post was a bit confusing. I should have posted "that I had to freeze frame the vid. in order to see the top of the head".

Just so happens the only frame in which I could see the best angle of the top(and it's not very clear) was a shot from the rear in which the head is slightly tilted up.
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Old October 6, 2012, 09:39 AM   #11
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There is no accounting for why animals act sometimes, after all, they are individuals. It just kind of looks like the doe is not "Ready" yet. She had her tail clamped down. Seen that lots of times.
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Old October 6, 2012, 12:13 PM   #12
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Sorry shortwave, but your post wasn't unclear. There are light spots on the back of the head where you said they would be, LOL.
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Old October 6, 2012, 12:19 PM   #13
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I have watched deer for hours and hours for decades. I don't know what goes on in their head.

But, having watched young bucks chase doe until both of their tongues are hanging out I find it unlikely that she was wanting to mate with that little chap.
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Old October 6, 2012, 02:44 PM   #14
shortwave
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Quote:
Sorry shortwave, but your post wasn't unclear. There are light spots on the back of the head where you said they would be, LOL.
Yes there are light spot on the back of the head as you suggested. Unfortunately, that's not where I was referring to
If you look at the beginning of the vid. where the smaller deer is at the very left of the screen, you'll notice at one point where the deer quickly throws its head straight up in the air.Snout straight in the air.
Start freeze framing just before that happens and you eventually get a shot of the whole top of the head. Your looking at it from kind of a rearward top angle. But you can still see clear to the eyes including the frontal area where the antlers grow from.
Again, don't know if that area looked a bit lighter due to lighting or if in fact it is lighter.

Never-the-less, I wasn't claiming the smaller deer IS a small buck. Just suggesting the possibility from the freeze frame and its actions.

What ever the case, the smaller deer, doe or buck, looks to be very young.

Last edited by shortwave; October 6, 2012 at 02:52 PM.
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Old October 7, 2012, 10:46 AM   #15
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Interesting video...............

Nothing useful I can add but I do have a question: Does it matter that the buck is not swolen in the neck as to his responce to the doe ( that's what it seems has been decided it is? ) assuming she is really in heat??
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