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Old September 19, 2012, 04:30 PM   #1
OkieGentleman
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Small Primers in .45 ACP

Who besides Blazer and Fiocchi who else uses small pistol primers in their 45 ACP ammo? I seem to have about a 5% ratio of small pistol primer mixed in with some used mixed brass I bought. I thought the press was messing up till I figured out the problem. The only two brands I have found using small pistol primers are these two.

And can someone recommend a good bullet puller. I am worried that I might have some doubled powder loads. I don't want to throw away everything.

I also gave up trying to use the case feeder on my Lee Load-Master. I am tired of trying to keep the #$%&* thing adjusted. I seem to be getting a lot more done be hand feeding the cases and have much better control on the process. Yes Yes I know if I adjust it correctly and properly lube it it, it will speed up my loading. I decided I do not need to load at a rate of 50 rounds a minute, so I will go for comfort and less aggravation.

So I just had to get that off my chest, 6 months of fiddling finally did me in and I may have thrown some double loads working with the blasted case feeder.

Last edited by Brian Pfleuger; September 19, 2012 at 07:04 PM. Reason: Giant text not needed
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Old September 19, 2012, 04:36 PM   #2
Misssissippi Dave
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Federal Champion and I don't remember the other one right now have small primers.
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Old September 19, 2012, 06:55 PM   #3
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Go back to the basics and start over, you will be much more satisfied and comfortable with your outcome---be safe.
SPP are not the problem.
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Old September 19, 2012, 07:31 PM   #4
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Just talking to guys at the range today. One of them received an email from someone he knew with pictures. That guy had been loading 45 ACP on a Dillion 1050 (or 650) and got one of those small primer 45 ACP at the priming station. The large primer went off and ignited all the primers in the priming system and basically fragged the press. Too the email was deleted, would liked to have seen it. Dillion replaced everything.

Darm small primer 45 ACP is a hazard for progressive reloading presses.
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Old September 19, 2012, 07:46 PM   #5
m&p45acp10+1
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Federal NT are small primers. Also Win Clean are as well. Both use Lead Free primers.
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Old September 19, 2012, 08:41 PM   #6
Misssissippi Dave
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I have been loading .45 with the small primer, since I don't like to toss brass if I don't have to. I load all the small primer brass first. If I get a large primer brass it just leaves the primer in the cup. Since I use a Dillon 550b I can easily get the case out before I add powder and toss it into the right brass box for when I load the large primer cases. I don't apply so much force normally to set off a primer and I make sure there isn't any debris on the priming pin to crush the cap to the anvil. I think is is safer to load a little slower to try to avoid problems.

There is one advantage to loading small primer .45 cases. I don't have to change over to large primers if I have been loading small primers on the caliber I was loading before. It does save a little time.
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Old September 20, 2012, 03:47 AM   #7
Gerry
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Once fired .45 ACP small primer brass around here sell for a premium simply because there is a growing demand for it among Dillon 650 owners who also load 9mm.
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Old September 20, 2012, 07:14 AM   #8
Qtiphky
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Loads?

I too found this out the hard way as I wasn't paying attenting expecting them to be large primers. Didn't really cause any problems as I was just sizing and depriming before the cleaner, but this leads me to my question.

Can/do you use the same powder and load with the small primer as with the large primer?
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Old September 20, 2012, 11:01 AM   #9
serf 'rett
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Quote:
And can someone recommend a good bullet puller.
I use the RCBS Impact Puller. Paid a few dollars more for the "name brand" just in case I broke the sucker and needed to try out their excellent Warranty program.
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Old September 20, 2012, 12:23 PM   #10
tkglazie
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Quote:
Can/do you use the same powder and load with the small primer as with the large primer?
Perhaps, but the only way to find out is to do what you would do when you change any component- back off to the starting point and work the load back up again.

It has been reported that on average SP and LP primers show a 30fps difference in .45s but I havent tested that myself.
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Old September 20, 2012, 01:05 PM   #11
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Been reading about small vs large primers in 45 ACP for quite a while now. Read an article abouy a year or so ago when small primed and large paimed brass was loaded identically (except for primer size) and the result was small primed ammo shot a few fps slower than large primed ammo, mebbe 25-30 fps. My "solution" to the large vs small primer delimma is to inspect my brass prior to processing! I jes look at 'em...
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Old September 20, 2012, 02:46 PM   #12
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Kaboom?

I have my doubts as to whether or not trying to stuff a large primer into a small primer pocket would have set off the priming tube supply as Slamfire mentions. First, the primer is picked up at the bottom of the supply tube. On my Dillon 550B, the primer travels a full two inches to the seating station where it is surrounded by the steel cup that picked it up. I can't figure out how detonating a primer during primer seating detonates the primer supply tube, two inches away.

I might add that I've crushed more than my fair share of misaligned primers without once ever have a detonation. I've even decapped live primers, distorting them a bit but without a kaboom. Primers apparently also need percussion to set them off. To detonate a primer during priming indicates that somebody was working way to fast and not by feel.

As I uniform my primer pockets, range pick-up brass with small pockets are found before reloading and set aside until the batch is large enough to warrant changing over the primer feed on my Dillon.
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Old September 20, 2012, 03:01 PM   #13
tkglazie
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I recently started loading for .45 and was annoyed at first by the sp/lp deal, but now that I am building up a nice collection of .45 sp cases (I shoot only range pickups) I like that the sp cases give me the flexibility to reload for my .45 if I am out of LP primers. This could be handy during a shortage or for those times when you want to wait a bit so you can consolidate an order (like when powdervalley is out of something else you want)

plus having to check for primers just forces me to be even more diligent with my visual inspection.
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Old September 20, 2012, 03:39 PM   #14
bullspotter
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So far all i have seen for small primers in 45 is blazer and federal brass.

The blue puller by frankfert is a good one, better then rcbs but no warrenty.

Lastly a smashed primer in a 650 that is set off on the primer station can detonate the entire tube, their is a disk that rotates them from the tube and they are only about .115 inches apart, (trail edge of one primer to the lead edge of the next) they are alot closer then 2 inches. I have done it, and it was my fault, I didnt feel the primer seat all the way smooth, so i gave it an extra shove........ set the tube off, ears rang for days. was a far cry from fraging a press....... but the primer system had heavy damage....... Now if it feels odd I STOP and check out why. The brass was crimped. I have also smashed or deformed many, with out setting them off, but sooner or later if your careless......you will get the big noise and larg larg ploom of smoke!!
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Old September 20, 2012, 03:50 PM   #15
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Toss all small pistol primer .45ACP brass in the garbage. Don't want it around. Keep it 'very simple' is my motto.
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Old September 20, 2012, 04:53 PM   #16
Strafer Gott
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Wait! I see the future...

No point in throwing the SPP brass. Set it aside, cause in just a twinkle, it's all going lead-free SPP. Then we can read rants and whines from the shoe on the other foot. Sure hope the powers that be don't take the lead out of the other end.
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Old September 20, 2012, 05:08 PM   #17
sidewindr
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I have a bunch of Speer NT also,crimped, that is smalle primers. I don't think the press was blown up,not very likey. I can see the primer tubes and feed part being dismantled unhealthy, but not the entire press. The operator would be dead if it did.
As for the brass debate, small primers have been in some 45 brass for ten-fifteen years now,just more of it within the last couple years. I grabbed 2500 of the Federal and like them better than the large. No problems for me to spot the difference.
I don't see how so many don't know of them, there is a thread about them every week in every forum on the web.
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Old September 20, 2012, 06:38 PM   #18
rclark
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...going lead-free SPP. Then we can read rants and whines from the shoe on the other foot.
Well, hopefully not in my lifetime. Since the conception of the .45ACP it has been large pistol primers. Should be THE 'standard' after all this time. I've got plenty of 'normal' brass. And can get more from Star-Line and other brass makers if it ever becomes necessary, so saving the small primer brass has no value to me.... Of course I don't see the point of lead free primers either ... but that's just me.
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Old September 20, 2012, 06:56 PM   #19
TMD
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Federal started with the SP brass a few years ago with their NT loads (non toxic primers). I'm betting within the next few years they will drop lp brass in .45acp to streamline manufacturing.
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Old September 21, 2012, 02:56 AM   #20
Gerry
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It's too bad the American government doesn't allow guys to ship their brass out of the country. Here in Canada, the going rate for LPP .45 ACPs is about $60 to $80 per thousand for once fired brass. SPP .45 easily sells for over $150 per thousand here!

The thought of some of you guys tossing this in the garbage would give more than a few of us Canadians nightmares! It almost ranks right up there with taking a perfectly good firearm to the police for destruction. There is something sacrilegious about it.
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Old September 21, 2012, 05:54 AM   #21
sidewindr
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Wow, thats just wrong, both of those. How about face to face at the border? Is that allowed for sale of brass.
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Old September 25, 2012, 05:54 PM   #22
OkieGentleman
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Small primer pocket

Thanks guys. Now I know.
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