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Old September 11, 2012, 07:55 PM   #1
huh
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another 9mm thread

okay I am tired of buying ammo for my colt new agent. I purchased 250 rounds of berry's 124gr HP boollits and 500 124gr RN. I have pounds of titegroup and 1000 federal small pistol match primers. And a 5 gallon buckets of all my once fired brass cleaned and re-sized and deprimmed

Here is the the question does any one run this combo? I was wanting to load up the hp something of a carry load of hornady 124gr XTP and the rn just as a blinking round. I know to start out at the minimum load and work up which I will do. But I like to get all the advice I can get. Sorry for the rambling I just get excited about reloading time.

Thanks for the time
HUH
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Old September 11, 2012, 09:29 PM   #2
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Me personally, I buy all my conceal carry ammo, but that's just me.

I have 500 Hornady XTP 9mm 115 that I just plan on loading to plink with. I also have 115 FMJ-RN that I use for plinking as well. I use Unique and Titegroup and load up whatever I feel like shooting at the range. I've really started using my Titegroup to load for Steel Challenge though since its more of a pop instead of a push.
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Old September 11, 2012, 09:31 PM   #3
huh
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Yes I buy my carry ammo but I was wanting to load up some to plink with. I have been using titegroup for my 45acp and I really like it
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Old September 11, 2012, 09:39 PM   #4
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Sorry I misread. You wrote something of and I read something for. My apologies. Yeah I love Titegroup and it doesn't take much. Which is good that way you can get more rounds per pound.
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Old September 12, 2012, 03:19 PM   #5
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TiteGroup and Clays are both very spikey and not what I would want to use for 9x19 unless I had nothing else. Load low and don't try for anything near max. Try to keep the COL as long as possible. 9x19 is very sensitive to changes in COL and bullet set-back.
If I wanted a fast powder for 9x19, I would use 231/HP38, AA2, and N320.
If I wanted a defense load duplicate, I would use Silhouette or HS6 powder.
Follow your manuals' guidelines and keep COL longer than the manuals reference.
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Old September 12, 2012, 03:31 PM   #6
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Yes, TiteGroup is fine....but be careful with it ...min is 4.1gr and max is 4.4 gr ( so only 0.3gr apart ).... but loads are under 1200 fps which is the max that Berry's recommends in their website. So I'd probably load them to a goal of 4.2gr with TiteGroup.

from Hodgdon manual:
125 GR. SIE FMJ Hodgdon Titegroup .355" 1.090" 4.1 1069 27,300 CUP 4.4 1136 30,600 CUP

Personally, for that bullet..I use Hodgdon Universal ...spread in recipe is a little more tolerant...4.3gr min / 4.9gr max ....and I was loading mine to a target drop of 4.7gr.

from Hodgdon Manual:
125 GR. SIE FMJ Hodgdon Universal .355" 1.090" 4.3 1031 26,900 CUP 4.9 1118 30,600 CUP

Both of the Berry's bullets you picked up are 124gr ...and plated ...so you'll load them both to the same powder specs ....the only variable is seating the bullet properly for each style of bullet. Personally, I would just pick one or the other...not fuss with both.

Montana Gold makes a very good bullet too ...FMJ ...or CMJ ...but nothing wrong with Berry's either.

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I would never reload my carry ammo ...and I think from a liability standpoint, most experts would tell you to buy your defensive ammo.
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Old September 12, 2012, 04:02 PM   #7
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Concerning the Berry's 124 gr. HP, be aware the nose of this bullet is short and broad and may need to be seated deeper than some designs. I need to seat to an OAL of 1.015 in my CZ SP-01 due to the short leade that CZ's are noted for. Don't know about your Colt. My SIL's Glock would accommodate just about any length. Fast-burning powders and short OAL is a recipe for disaster.

The faster powders such as Titegroup will give a nice soft recoil. If you're trying to duplicate the feel (recoil) of a personal defense round, a slower powder such as W231/HP-38 or HS-6 might better suit your needs. The slower powders will also give you a bit more leeway before entering the danger zone (pressure-wise). Whatever you decide, start low and work up slowly.
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Old September 12, 2012, 04:13 PM   #8
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I don't use Berrys bullets but I do load 124gr Hornady XTPs and this is great shooting load.
124gr XTP
4.2 gr. titegroup
cci 500 pr.
col 1.100
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Old September 12, 2012, 08:31 PM   #9
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Thank you every one I might have to look into getting another powder but pickens are very slim in the central valley of California

Korny where do you shop for powder?

Thanks everyone for the input
HUH
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Old September 12, 2012, 10:17 PM   #10
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In Stockton, I purchase at the Outdoor Sportsman. I've also purchased at Bass Pro in Manteca but their prices were a little bit higher. Barnwood Arms in Ripon has a fair assortment. The Gun Room in Galt also carries powder, but their pricing is off the chart.
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Old September 12, 2012, 10:19 PM   #11
huh
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Thank you I am 30 min south of fresno I was going to venture to bakersfield but I could run up north
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Old September 12, 2012, 10:28 PM   #12
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I believe there is a gun show in Fresno this weekend. Might try there. Powder pricing should be competitive and it'll save you a bunch in petrol.
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Old September 14, 2012, 06:47 AM   #13
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proven performers

Power Pistol

Silhouette

3N37

AA5

HS6

These can be considered "high-performance" 9x19 powder choices.
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Old September 14, 2012, 08:50 AM   #14
Don P
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Quote:
TiteGroup and Clays are both very spikey and not what I would want to use for 9x19 unless I had nothing else
Poppy-cock, horse poop. I use Titegroup for 38 spl/357 mag, 9 mm, 40S&W, and 45 acp. Easy to meter and good consistent chrono results. As they say pay attention when you load and you have no issues with solid repeatable performance.
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Old September 14, 2012, 09:06 AM   #15
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Quote:
Poppy-cock, horse poop. I use Titegroup for 38 spl/357 mag, 9 mm, 40S&W, and 45 acp. Easy to meter and good consistent chrono results. As they say pay attention when you load and you have no issues with solid repeatable performance.
With .3gr difference between start and Do Not Exceed and filling less than half the case on on a very small case, I can see a potential for Very Bad Things to happen..... call it "spikey" or "hard to visually verify", "plenty of potential for pressure events", or whatever ..... I won't use it.
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Old September 14, 2012, 10:09 AM   #16
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Personally I always liked W231 in 9mm loads.
Here's a couple of things to keep in mind no matter what powder you decide to use.

There's a lot of variation in 9mm brass, so if you work toward max loads this is something to be concerned about if you are using mixed brass.

The other is Berry's bullets, years back I bought some Berry's bullets to load 45 acp pin loads.
The bullets were great looking bullets but I noticed some of my pin loads showing pressure signs.

It was not a mixed brass issue as I was using all Starline brass from the same lot.

It was not a powder issue because each powder charge was hand dropped and I would check the measure every 10th round, the measure setting never moved.

So I started checking bullet diameter, there laid the problem. Some of the bullets were measuring as high as .458 in diameter. So I measured all the bullets, used only those that measured no larger then .452 and gave the larger diameter bullets to a friend that had a 45 revolver with a generous bore and cylinder diameter.

I could only use about half the Berry's bullets I purchased so I never bought anymore.

Best Regards
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Old September 14, 2012, 10:55 AM   #17
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Bob, how fast were you pushing these pin loads?

I push my pin loads as hard as I can safely go, so as to knock the pins off the table.....

Berry's advises no faster than 1200, IIRC.

I will agree that oversized bullets=pressure spikes. Hot loads make that worse.

Did you call Berry's on it? I'm sure they would have been very interested in any QC problems they might have had.
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Old September 14, 2012, 03:19 PM   #18
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Quote:
Bob, how fast were you pushing these pin loads?

I push my pin loads as hard as I can safely go, so as to knock the pins off the table.....

Berry's advises no faster than 1200, IIRC.

I will agree that oversized bullets=pressure spikes. Hot loads make that worse.

Did you call Berry's on it? I'm sure they would have been very interested in any QC problems they might have had.
I was using their 45 caliber 200 gr HP's, running them at 1075 fps for a 215 power factor.

In pin shooting they did not have a set power factor you had to make but the standard rule of thumb was a 210 power factor to move the pins off a regulation table with authority.

No I did not contact Berry about the bullet problem as I found another source for true jacketed bullets at the same price.

In all fairness to Berry Bullets my experience may have been just a one time thing that slipped by QC but it's still something that all handloaders should be aware of.

If you start seeing pressure spikes and you are using good brass, nothing else changed, then I suggest checking bullet diameters.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
www.huntercustoms.com
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Old September 14, 2012, 04:27 PM   #19
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HUH, Berry's MFG recommends that we use lead load data or start-to-mid range jacketed load data for their regular plated bullets to ~1200 fps. You can push their thicker plated (TP) bullets faster at ~1450 fps.

Current load data on Alliant's website won't list lead loads but 2004 Alliant load data has lead loads for Bullseye.



I use Bullseye for 9mm 115/124/125 jacketed/plated/lead loads and it produces very accurate loads with a bit more snappy recoil than W231/HP-38 loads. I also found 125 gr lead RN with 4.0 gr of Promo to be very accurate and economical load as well (per Alliant, I use 2004 Alliant Red Dot load data by weight).

Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2004 9mm BE.jpg (25.9 KB, 74 views)
File Type: jpg 2004 9mmRD.jpg (30.7 KB, 72 views)

Last edited by BDS-THR; September 14, 2012 at 04:32 PM.
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Old September 14, 2012, 06:51 PM   #20
huh
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Thank you everyone for the info. Bob i just received my order from berrys i think i will do some random spot checks tonight. And my 5 gallon bucket of brass was all factory loads i shot through the colt.

Thanks again everyone every little bit helps
HUH
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Old September 14, 2012, 09:38 PM   #21
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YMMV, but I am just warning...

Clays, TiteGroup, and N310 are very spiky.
If you need to use an overly fast powder for gamesmanship, I find that Solo 1000 and AA2 are NOT spiky and 231/HP38 is almost always more accurate.
I have had pressure spikes (sudden increase in felt recoil and case ejection) from 1 or 2 rounds out of 10 with weighed charges in .45Auto, 9x19, and .40S&W. I REALLY don't want any pressure spikes in .40 and would prefer to avoid the possibility in 9x19.
Main point is to NOT approach the MAX load with Clays, TiteGroup, or N310 unless you have a critical need that supersedes concerns with pressure spikes.
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Old September 15, 2012, 05:49 AM   #22
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I agree

And I, among others, find the best accuracy in 9x19 comes with powders more in the 'medium' burn-rate category.
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Old September 17, 2012, 09:29 PM   #23
THORN74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by huh View Post
okay I am tired of buying ammo for my colt new agent. I purchased 250 rounds of berry's 124gr HP boollits and 500 124gr RN. I have pounds of titegroup and 1000 federal small pistol match primers. And a 5 gallon buckets of all my once fired brass cleaned and re-sized and deprimmed

Here is the the question does any one run this combo? I was wanting to load up the hp something of a carry load of hornady 124gr XTP and the rn just as a blinking round. I know to start out at the minimum load and work up which I will do. But I like to get all the advice I can get. Sorry for the rambling I just get excited about reloading time.

Thanks for the time
HUH
I'm running similar load. .... Berry's 124gr fp, 3.5gr win231, 1.090" Col (I belive)......working good so far. Loading on a lnl-ap and shooting out of a sig p226 and m&p9c


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