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Old July 18, 2012, 05:08 PM   #1
saands
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Strength of Brazilian 1908 Actions?

I was able to pick up a pair of Brazilian 1908's for a good deal because the barrels were basically gone ... far too pitted to even consider shooting. Anyway, they are in 7x57 currently, but I was thinking of taking one of them and making a 280 Remington Ack Imp ...

My question is one of receiver strength and reputation. For example, are the Brazilian 1908's solid enough to safely build a 300WinMag on? I only ask this because if people do the belted mags on them routinely, then they will easily handle the 30-06 pressure levels of a 280 Rem.

Thanks,

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Old July 19, 2012, 12:49 AM   #2
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That would be a Model 1907, made by Mauser, marked on the left side. There were some later that were made in Brazil, but even those were very good quality. Many Brazilian Model 1907s, 1922s, 1924s, 1924/34s, and 1935s were converted to 30-06 in the 1950s, so I would say yes, it is strong enough. It is a Mauser 98 action, after all. Rebarrel, and away you go.
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Old July 19, 2012, 01:32 PM   #3
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The 1908 Brazilian, made by DWM, is a beautifully made action. If the action itself is not badly pitted, I would not hesitate to use it for a 30-06 class cartridge. If converting to a magnum, I would consider having the receiver re-heat treated.

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Old July 20, 2012, 10:06 AM   #4
Clark
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Here is a pic of me hoarding Braz 1908 rifles.
By mid 2009 I was learning how to take them apart.

By mid 2010 I had converted two of them to 7mmRM with old Rem and Win take off barrels, by opening the bolt face, opening the extractor, opening the feed lips of the receiver, cutting off the threads, cutting new threads, cutting the chamber, welding the bolt handles, drilling and tapping for scope mounts, and putting old VZ24 stocks on them with glass bedding, And then putting large Limbsaver recoil pads on the stocks.
And then shooting 7mmRM handloads of 180 gr bullets in excess of 3000 fps.
Those loads are past the SAAMI limit of 61,000 psi for 7mmRM.

Because the belted magnum has a larger case head and interior diameter, there is more bolt thrust for a given pressure, compared to the Mauser case head.

What does it all mean?
Yes the 1908 Mausers are strong... They are 1898 type Mausers.
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Old July 21, 2012, 04:14 PM   #5
James K
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Someone on another site seems to have started a rumor that those Brazilian actions are weak and liable to blow up at any minute. Garbage and best ignored.

Jim
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Old July 22, 2012, 02:49 PM   #6
Clark
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CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
For the last 12 years my hobby has been overloading guns to see what happens.
Maybe a Contender is not stronger than the brass, because it is thin.
But any 98 Mauser I have seen, and I have over 50, is stronger than the brass.
Rem 700, Sav 110, Howa 1500, Mosin Nagant etc are all stronger than the brass.

But when the brass fails, what action do you want to be shooting?

A 98 Mauser is a little better than a pre 64 Win M70 and a lot better than a Rem 700.

But the 98 Mauser is no where near as good as a Handi rifle nor Sav 219 nor as good as the best I have tested... a Ruger #1.

What goes wrong with a case head blows off is that pieces of the 98 Mauser extractor, case head pieces, and gas come back and could hit the shooter. If the case head just swells up and the primer pocket gets big, the 98 Mauser is good for gas. It has a multi stage gas filter and shroud on the firing pin.

The Rem 700 is the worst.
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Old July 22, 2012, 03:15 PM   #7
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Can you expand a bit on what your tests show about the Remington 700 and why it is the worst rifle in handling an overload?

Thanks.

Jim
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Old July 22, 2012, 03:41 PM   #8
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Jim,
Here are some .223 case heads. The first one was fired in a Rem 700 and my friend had to stop hunting a find a doctor.

The next two are me shooting a .223 over a chronograph seeing how high a velocity I could get. That was with a Ruger #1, and there were no problems ejecting, but the brass was ruined.

I am not intending to gather any more Rem 700 eyeball data. I wear safety glasses when I shoot my Rem 700s.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Rem 700 223 eye injury.jpg (56.5 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg Ruger #1 biz as usual.jpg (22.7 KB, 15 views)
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Old July 22, 2012, 05:37 PM   #9
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Either gain access to a CAD drawing of a Rem700, or pull an action off a barrel and put it on the table in front of you. Do the same with a Mauser 98 action.

Imagine a case failure where gas escapes while you're looking at the drawing or the action and ask yourself "Where does the gas go?"

The Mauser 98 action had several features designed into it to deflect gas away from the shooter's face and eye, which would have been just above the line of the bore. Look particularly at the rear of the bolt on a 98. For example: Why does the 98 cocking piece have that huge flange that covers the rear of the action? Deflection of gases coming down the bolt raceways, that's why. Same deal with the design of the cocking piece and how it attaches to the firing pin, the large holes in the bolt body to dump gas down the magazine well, etc.

The Remington 700 has been made cheaper to build by removing features from the original Mauser 98 design. Matter of fact, most all "improvements" by most bolt gun manufactures over the Mauser 98 design are actually removals of safety features.

Why are those features on a Mauser 98 action? Because Peter Paul Mauser himself lost an eye while working on an action prior to the 98 where a case head ruptured and the gas came back into his eye. As a result, the 98 action has a number of improvements over the prior bolt action Mauser designs for deflecting and dumping gas before it gets to the shooter's face.
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