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Old April 28, 2012, 09:50 PM   #1
Speed_demonnat
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My first uspsa match. Embarrassing DQ.

I'll start by saying I'm not new to shooting in local matches although I haven't shot a match in 7 years. I have only shot IDPA in the past and I'm well aware of and totally support the 180 rule and have never broken it till today. I was extremely embarrassed and very dissapointed in myself as I always take safe very seriously. I was dq'd on a stage that required several targets to be engaged while standing in front of a wall then move to the left and go through a doorway behind you. Then move left to a port and engage the final targets. I broke the 180 rule while moving through the doorway. The stage prior to that also required engaging targets while moving backwards. I am thinking USPSA is not for me with all these stages that require moving backwards to engage the targets. Is this common place at USPSA matches? I cannot remember ever having to move backwards in a IDPA stage. I did hear several more USPSA experienced shooters commenting about the stages being easy to make a mistake and break the 180 rule then I fell victim. I did have several shooters come up to me and tell me not to get discouraged over the dq and to come back to the next shoot. It is impossible not to be totally disappointed in myself.

Last edited by Speed_demonnat; April 28, 2012 at 09:52 PM. Reason: Spelling
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Old April 29, 2012, 07:34 AM   #2
MrBorland
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Sorry to hear of your DQ, but try not to be discouraged, or too hard on yourself: There's a saying that there's only 2 types of competitors - those who have been DQ'd, and those that will be DQ'd (I was at a major match recently where a top shooter got DQ'd). Nonetheless, DQ's are generally given for good reason, and a DQ is a good way to remember a strict safety rule in the future, so you'll likely not make the same mistake again. Also, try practicing at home backing up while keeping the muzzle forward (& finger off the trigger) so it becomes second nature.

I hope you'll make it out to more matches in the future, and best wishes to you if you do!
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Old April 29, 2012, 09:50 PM   #3
Jesse Tischauser
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All DQ's are unintentional and embarrassing. The two I have had taught me two lessons. All u can do is Learn from it and move on.
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Old April 30, 2012, 06:20 AM   #4
Gerry
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A lot of DQs caused by breaking 180 are partly the fault of the stage designer. Never should a setup entice or tease shooters into the prospect of breaking 180 due to being able to hit a target more conveniently from the wrong position. Even when moving rearwards to engage targets, there has to be some hard cover (barrels, walls, etc.) that obscure the targets until you're a safe distance past the 180 mark to engage them.

Having to move away from the rear berm is common on most medium to long stages, and is therefore considered a fundamental technique. Like everything else it has to be practiced until you don't even have to think about where your gun is pointed while doing so. Perhaps you already know this, but there are two arm positions you need to worry about when moving rearwards: arm over opposite shoulder, and arm out trailing. Which you use depends on the angle at which you're moving, and if going straight back which side of your body the target is that you'll be engaging first. You need to practice both positions, running backwards at every angle. You can make this exercise part of your dry fire routine at home.

If you're right handed, you'll use arm over shoulder if running rearwards to the right of the range, and you'll unwind your arm while turning your body to the left in order to engage the targets. And the opposite goes for moving rear-left where you'll use the trailing arm technique and and turn your body to the right. After awhile it becomes second nature.

Unless it's only a step or two, never actually run backwards while looking over your shoulder to see where you're going. Only run "forwards", either away from the berm or towards it at any and every conceivable angle. Moving away from the berm with your toes pointed toward the berm is awkward, slow, and dangerous.

And sorry to hear about your DQ, but don't feel too bad and as others have said, use it as a learning experience. There are much more dangerous things DQs are called for than breaking 180. I saw two ADs last year, and one happened to a guy during a mag change!
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Old April 30, 2012, 07:07 AM   #5
Speed_demonnat
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Thanks for tips Gerry. I will be doing lots of practicing before I head to the next match. I keep replaying the dq in mind and kicking myself. I believe the main cause was trying to go to fast. Which is dumb on my part and I know speed comes with experience. I was even telling myself to slow down but then the buzzer went off and that went out the window.
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Old April 30, 2012, 10:20 AM   #6
Gerry
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I nearly forgot about it, but a certain lady told us about the time when she was DQ'd for breaking 180 in one of her first matches. Only she apparently turned around to face the RO while waiting for the "if you are finished..." and swept everyone watching, including spectators and her squad. Everyone ducked!

She went on to be one of the best woman open division shooters in the world, doing particularly well at the Philippines and South Africa world shoots. Now I get to attend her courses from time-to-time.

Expect your mind to turn into jelly at the sound of the buzzer for the next few matches too. But it does get better with each match. I still feel the adrenaline in anticipation of the buzzer and thus have been known to still suffer occasional brain-farts that affect my shooting plan. It's part of what makes this sport so fun and exciting.
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Old April 30, 2012, 11:09 AM   #7
MrBorland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Speed_demonnat
but then the buzzer went off and that went out the window.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerry
Expect your mind to turn into jelly at the sound of the buzzer for the next few matches too.
It's called Buzzer Brain. Based on my experience with it, if it "only" lasts for the next few matches, you're doing very well.

I spent the first year or so learning the game one (or more) dumb mistake at a time. I couldn't understand it - my plan was perfect before the buzzer went off.

Like a DQ, don't beat yourself up when Buzzer Brain bites. It'll get better, so be patient with yourself, and look at the things you did right in the meantime.
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Old May 3, 2012, 09:47 PM   #8
theycallmeingot
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it would be a shame if you let this hurt your pride enough not to go to another USPSA match. I would strongly encourage you to keep coming. It really is a lot of fun, and you will get better. I don't need to tell you, but focusing on safety first for 1 or 2 matches will make a world of difference, and then you can start to speed up once you get a feel for things.

i've not been DQed, yet. And i, too, will be sorely disappointed in myself when it happens. The only difference is, I've had a chance to go to more than 1 match before it happens, so I know i'll be back. Give it another chance.
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Old May 3, 2012, 10:39 PM   #9
Jesse Tischauser
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The old saying goes...there are those that have DQ'd and those that will. Or something like that.
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Old May 4, 2012, 08:11 AM   #10
g.willikers
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Don't feel badly about it.
And don't let it put you off.
We've all seen worse.
Like the young fellow, using his father's open gun, who ran by a target.
He retreated just fine, gun pointed downrange, unfortunately faster than the R.O.
He swept the poor guy's back, completely, left to right.
No doubt, that aged the R.O some.
The kid was back at the next match, though.
He got real good, too, and became a regular.
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Old May 4, 2012, 01:20 PM   #11
Gerry
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Last year I witnessed a very experienced master class open division shooter DQ with a dropped gun. It was the very first stage and the guy drove about 150 miles for the match. He was a great sport though, and stayed the entire afternoon helping to patch.

It was one of those "start in chair with elbows on table with fingers locked behind head, loaded gun holstered" deals. He didn't have a good grip on it while standing from the chair, and I guess his C-More caught on the edge of the table. Of course he didn't touch it once it dropped and let the RO deal with it as per the rules, but it was still a DQ. We all felt so bad for the guy because there was only one other person there who was in his league shooting open.

Last edited by Gerry; May 5, 2012 at 06:22 AM. Reason: Correction: Elbows on table - not shoulders!
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Old May 4, 2012, 09:02 PM   #12
Speed_demonnat
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Thanks for all the encouragement and tips. I am planning to go to the next match. I really want to shoot my open gun as I have shot it a lot more than my g22. We shoot bowling pins for time informally on the weekends. I've never used it in a real competition. Plus I think having to reload fewer times will give me one less thing to worry about. Although I don't have a race rig for it, I normally just use a kydex holster and mag pouches. What do you guys think? Keeping in mind I am not looking to be competitive just to have fun and finish the match, safely.
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Old May 5, 2012, 09:52 PM   #13
Gerry
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If you feel more comfortable shooting an open gun in open division, I say go for it and have fun. I know a few people who shot open from the very start and never competed in anything else.

High cap mags may be better for you, but for people who can't count past 9 or 10 like myself, it's a disaster! In all seriousness, it seems a lot of newcomers shooting USPSA fall into the trap of thinking more rounds in the mag can make up for a lack of stage planning skills. Take my word for it, it doesn't.

If you're "worrying" about reloading, you should work on your mag changing in the comfort of your house until you can reload without fumbling from all your mag pouches without even thinking about it. Dummy rounds help with the weight. Start slow and do it right from pouch #1, and slowly work up the speed. Then #2, etc. Use a timer (cellphone app will do) on PAR mode so that you're setting goals and tracking progress. Reloading, draw, grabbing your gun from a table, running up range, or anything else should not worry you. Keeping safe while doing these things (finger out of the trigger guard, gun pointed downrange, etc.) should be automatic, and represent fundamental skills you can develop at home without even dry firing your gun.
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Old May 26, 2012, 10:43 PM   #14
Speed_demonnat
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Thanks for the all the advice. Shot the match today and had a blast. Kept it slow and everything went great. Met some really great people. Got lots of comments and questions about my open glock. Seems a lot of shooters are interested in open glocks. Hope everyone has a safe memorial day and remembers all those that gave the ultimate sacifice for our freedom.
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Old May 29, 2012, 02:36 PM   #15
M4BGRINGO
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First time I did a USPSA classifier I was told to load and make ready, which I proceded to do. I had never stood with my back to the targets before. I shoot revolver, so I can easily load the moonclip into the gun while it is still in the holster. Well, I almost got a DQ for that! I simply slid the gun up enough so the cylinder cleared the holster and was about to drop the loaded moonclip in.

The RO said he wanted me to follow the same rules as everyone else. Turn and keep the gun pointed down-range, load it, holster it, then turn back around.

He agreed that loading the gun while holstered posed no danger, but if I should ever decide to use a semi auto I better know to have the gun facing down-range when loading it.

He also made me do the hammer-down after unloading the moonclip and showing clear just to get be used to what everyone with semi autos have to do.
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Old May 29, 2012, 04:07 PM   #16
Old Grump
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My coach told me to expect bad scores and mistakes because everybody gets the jitters at a match and the newer you are and the harder you try the worst the jitters.

HA!, I knew better because I knew how hard I worked and how good I was getting after 3 weeks of daily practice.

That lasted through the NMC match and the slow fire match where I managed to keep the majority of my shots on paper, man I was doing good. Then my target fell over because some numbskull shot the left leg out from under my target frame.

OOPS


Don't feel bad, you joined a very large and not exclusive club.
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Old May 31, 2012, 07:45 AM   #17
WESHOOT2
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to the OP

Thank you for swallowing your pride and returning to compete again.

I have been DQd twice, and the lesson is hard, humbling, but worthwhile IF we accept it, LEARN FROM IT, and continue forward.

I applaud you. And maybe I'll see you on the range......


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Old June 26, 2012, 07:43 PM   #18
Tim R
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Dust your self off and get back in the game. I have found in my game if you can get through a match without mistakes you will have a pretty hgood score.

There is an old saying.....Slow is smooth. Smooth is Fast.

It's true.
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Old June 26, 2012, 11:41 PM   #19
Justice06RR
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A DQ is better than an ND

I'd say brush it off and cheer up. at least you didn't shoot yourself or anyone for that matter. I've seen an ND at an IDPA match firsthand and those can really ruin your day!
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Old June 29, 2012, 11:34 PM   #20
rgrundy
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Like everyone said just keep doing it. The matches are very safe because safe gun handling is constantly reinforced and being DQ'd is part of that process. Being embarrassed after being DQ'd is a good thing. Shows you are salvageable and will take it seriuosly. You'll be fine.
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Old July 2, 2012, 01:44 PM   #21
Blackops_2
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Got DQ'd my first match yesterday as well. Stage two. Then spent the 4 hours pasting with my squad at byrum. Sucked, but rules or rules and it happens. As mentioned there are those that have been dq'd and those that will be dq'd.
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Old July 5, 2012, 05:45 AM   #22
WESHOOT2
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I draw my iron-sighted Open gun from a Yaqui Slide.
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