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Old June 8, 2012, 03:49 PM   #1
Don P
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Need help with a 40S&W recipe

I am shooting 155 grain lead bullets and using Titegroup at a charge weight of 4.7 grains.
There is no load data for 155 grain lead and Titegroup.
Any thoughts as to whether I am under/overcharging the round.
Hodgdon was absolutely useless as they told my NOBODY uses lead in 40S&W reloads
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Old June 8, 2012, 04:07 PM   #2
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Removed

Last edited by bfoosh006; June 10, 2012 at 06:40 PM.
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Old June 8, 2012, 05:23 PM   #3
serf 'rett
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A couple of the manuals show a starting load of 5.4 grains TiteGroup for jacketed bullets. A reduction of 10% for lead would put you at 4.86 grains starting load, so you should be fine unless you're below 1.120" COAL.
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Old June 9, 2012, 07:26 PM   #4
Don P
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Quote:
so you should be fine unless you're below 1.120" COAL.
Appreciate the info. Thats what I was thinking just wanted to double check. My OAL for the SWC is 1.140. Thanks again
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Old June 9, 2012, 08:34 PM   #5
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I always try to confirm anything from the Internet, but have you checked this source?
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Old June 9, 2012, 08:40 PM   #6
tom234
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Alliant is the same way; no lead bullets data for 9mm .40 S&W, or 10mm. Not even target loads.
Lead bullets are perfect for .40 S&W and I have never use jacketed bullets. That said, switch to AA powders. There is load data on line.
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Old June 10, 2012, 10:17 AM   #7
BDS-THR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don P
Hodgdon was absolutely useless as they told [me] NOBODY uses lead in 40S&W reloads
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom234
Alliant is the same way; no lead bullets data for 9mm .40 S&W, or 10mm. Not even target loads.
Really? 1999 Winchester load data and 2004 Alliant load data have some lead 40S&W loads.



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File Type: jpg 2004 40SW.jpg (72.1 KB, 70 views)
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Old June 10, 2012, 06:02 PM   #8
Don P
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Quote:
Really? 1999 Winchester load data [thehighroad.org] and 2004 Alliant load data [glarp.atk.com] have some lead 40S&W loads.
What does the above quote have to do with the following statement

Quote:
Hodgdon was absolutely useless as they told my NOBODY uses lead in 40S&W reloads
Apples and Oranges are they not?? Since when are Alliant and Hodgdon the same????????

That is just like some of the folks advising me to change bullets to coated and to change powder.

Sorry folks that is NOT what information I was asking about.
I DON'T WANT TO CHANGE POWDER OR BULLET TYPE.
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Old June 10, 2012, 06:08 PM   #9
BDS-THR
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Don P, settle down, I was trying to be helpful.

Since there is no lead load data for Titegroup available for 40S&W, I was offering some other "published" alternatives.

However, if you want to journey down the path of lead 40S&W bullets with often spikey Titegroup, it's your choice and you have been warned.

Peace.
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Old June 10, 2012, 06:23 PM   #10
Don P
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OK I was drowning and I got thrown to me an anvil instead of a life jacket. I am calm and chilled but Alliants load data doesn't work with Hodgdon powders and I'll take the warning with the proverbial grain of salt with regards to my "spikey" powder choice.
Its dark outside and looks like rain, maybe I'll go and get wet
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Old June 10, 2012, 06:34 PM   #11
bfoosh006
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Ditto on the settle down message, I was just offering some imput on a different lead bullet type.... I also gave you my answer about the powder charge. From now on I will not offer you any imput.

Waiting for a rude answer for this post as well......

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Old June 10, 2012, 08:20 PM   #12
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Don, I do like Titegroup for 9mm and 40S&W jacketed/plated loads that are accurate; but for 40S&W lead loads, I think there are better powders.

I offered other published alternatives in the hopes that you had other powders on hand you could try instead.

Here are some more Titegroup/lead 40S&W opinions if you are interested - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/inde...owtopic=134972

Quote:
Red Ryder - Am I the only reloader that thinks Titegroup sucks. It's cheap...but that's all it has going for itself. It's dirty, especially at lower power factors. It doesn't fill the case up very much at all (I think this is a safety issue). It is very "snappy" with increased felt recoil. In my personal testing, I had to load it to almost 140 PF to get decent accuracy from it.

Otto - I don't care for it...burns too hot, stains the brass, excessive recoil and was less accurate in my 1911s.

SLM - I burnt a pound when I shot Production and like you found it to be quite dirty and it put a bunch of heat in the gun. I got it to minor PF under 147's without issue as long as I used jacketed bullets. I couldn't get it to work with lead or moly coated. They would tumble.

Skydiver - You are right on the money about the gun being "hot" after a fast 32 round stage ... I found TiteGroup much too snappy for .40 180gn bullets. Also snappy for .45 200gn bullets

blaster113 - I'm another one thats underwhelmed by Titegroup. I tried a little of it in 9mm minor with 124 grain bullets and found that it had more recoil than my other powders on hand. I've used alot of it for .40 major and didnt care for it at all. For the same PF as N320 it kicks much harder, makes the gun get hot real quick and is dirty.

mlmiller1 - I tried it repeatedly & never got any results that I liked, either. I moved on & sold what I had left.

59Bassman - I like it in 9mm ... However, out of my 1911 in .45ACP, I've fallen out of love with it. I used to shoot WST, then switched to TG under a 200 LSWC. Everything was fine until I had to shoot a long array on a stage with no wind. By the 10th shot, I couldn't see the targets anymore. I'll be looking for another powder in .45

shred - I've also found it to run very hot in most loads.

CZinSC - Another former Tightgroup user here ... My analogy I give people is this: (shooting 124 FMJ) TG is like catching a baseball in a glove straight on the palm. N320 is like catching the ball in the webbing. Both do the job, but N320 feels a lot better.

gm iprod - Dirty, but it is just a carbon / soot fouling that comes away easy enough. Hot, yep, that is true, but no nasty hot, just hotter than many like.

RePete - I don't like TG in .40S&W and .45ACP with lead bullets. IMO it burns too hot and melts the bullet base creating more leading in the barrel.

CocoBolo - TiteGroup don't suck, just because it is violent, nasty dirty, overheats your gun, smokes like burning the sugar cane in mexico, well maybe you right. I tried it I quit it, there are lots of better alternatives.

Miker - I didnt like it last time I tried lead bullets as it produced alot of smoke compared to jacketed bullets

DoubleA - I like TG alright. The accuracy is good, not too dirty in the gun, but I do end up with flakes all over my arms after I have shot 200 rnds or so. The recoil is sharp and snappy

Last edited by BDS-THR; June 10, 2012 at 08:28 PM.
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