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Old June 9, 2012, 03:25 PM   #76
TheKlawMan
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Yes, Amsdorf, we agree that the putting the hit on the bad guy, and only the bad guy, is what we want. I do not agree, though, as many do not agree that you need to or should use 00B. That depends to some degree on the individuals situation.

I do admit that I only practiced one day with buck and slugs and do not pretend to have learned that much in a couple of hours. The range officer giving me some advice, and when he learned of a mutual acquainance he took a great deal of interest in showing me the ropes, had be blasting away with an 870 short barrel at a silhouette target from 10 yards with 00b and slugs. The drill was to take my safety of as the gun comes up from waist level and to shoot as soon as I get a cheed weld with the breifest look at the bead.


Those lucky enough to live in rural environments with some land may have situations where home defense coujld include a longer shot, but it is hard to imagine the need to take a shot much beyond 10 yards in my suburban area.


I am a crappy shot, but all of my buck was in the black and my slugs were withing an inch of my poa. I didn't just shoot individual shots but pumped and refired as fast as possible for effect.

That was back when I had no more than 300 clay shots down range. I am still a crappy shooter, but have somewhere in excess of 8,000 clay attempts and beleive I have improved with that "game" a little.

But you do have me thinking that I should revisit the rifle range where I can get some practice in with Buck and Slugs, as well as this new fangled Ultimate Home Defense stuff with the high density BBs. While my primary load is that stuff, I have an ample supply of 00B and slugs in case all hell were to break lose.
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Old June 9, 2012, 03:33 PM   #77
Stevie-Ray
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Who in their right mind would believe a shotgun will magically hit its target? Of course, you have to aim/point at the target.
Obviously, you haven't seen some of the people applying for CPLs in my state. (Agree that this is probably the norm for ANY state.) Some of the people that were in my original class were shocking with their ignorance. We could tell they were being told BS outside of class, and were taking it as gospel, not to mention their total incompetence with their own weapons. I have to wonder how many of them gave up on the idea of using a handgun and bought a shotgun "because they couldn't miss." I have proven to myself many times by my small patterns at 7 yards that in HD distances you damn sure WILL miss if you haven't pointed/aimed that thing well enough. I submit that, pointing at a clay pigeon 30 yards away with target load invites a much bigger pattern, and a better chance of hitting with something. YMMV.
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Old June 9, 2012, 04:01 PM   #78
TheKlawMan
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I submit that, pointing at a clay pigeon 30 yards away with target load invites a much bigger pattern, and a better chance of hitting with something.
A better chance of hitting compared to what, hitting a stationary or slow moving target at a third the distance?

Sure, Stevie-Ray, your pattern at 30 yards is larger than at 10. It may be 30" in diameter depending on choke, but that 4+ inch target is still moving at a pretty good clip and often requires more than a single hit to break the clay. Then you have variables such as angles, wind gusts, leads.

Isn't the horse dead yet?
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Old June 9, 2012, 04:31 PM   #79
Stevie-Ray
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Sure, Stevie-Ray, your pattern at 30 yards is larger than at 10. It may be 30" in diameter depending on choke, but that 4+ inch target is still moving at a pretty good clip and often requires more than a single hit to break the clay. Then you have variables such as angles, wind gusts, leads.
Yeah, you're right, as I have said I pretty much suck at shotgunning games. But I do shoot a lot at HD distances. I'm just saying that taking "you can't miss" at face value is a dangerous thing, considering patterns at 7 yards or less-I found that out with my first few shots years ago. I also know personally 3 people that have only a shotgun for HD and have never fired them. Since 2 out of 3 of those people have normal 870s, their patterns are going to be even tighter than mine. Likely victims of "Here, buy this. You can't miss with it." I never asked, just a guess.

People that truly "can't miss" with a shotgun have all my respect. But most of them have been doing it for a long time. Don't ever try to sell a shotgun to somebody with that line within earshot of me, as it's a true pet peeve of mine. Stick a fork in me.
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Old June 9, 2012, 04:33 PM   #80
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Stevie-Ray, I find it hard to swallow that the folks in your state believe in magic, but they may be misinformed about how shotguns pattern. With respect to shooting at HD distances, consider Skeet's Station-8 where, with proper pointing, targets are routinely ink-balled at less than 7-yards. Yes, it takes training (not magic) since the pattern has developed very little at that distance.

I think we can all agree, if you're going to use a firearm for HD, get more training than just video games and watching YouTube. How many times do we see members' proud pictures of their HD guns that exhibit no signs of wear?
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Old June 9, 2012, 05:44 PM   #81
TheKlawMan
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I do little Skeet, but I love station 8 even if it seems intimidating until you do it and I am far from being a "decent shot".
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Old June 9, 2012, 05:50 PM   #82
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"I think we can all agree, if you're going to use a firearm for HD, get more training than just video games and watching YouTube. How many times do we see members' proud pictures of their HD guns that exhibit no signs of wear?"


I try to clean the blood and guts off mine before I make a YouTube video. Next time I'll bring it au naturel so to speak.

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Old June 9, 2012, 07:40 PM   #83
TheKlawMan
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I try to clean the blood and guts off mine before I make a YouTube video. Next time I'll bring it au naturel so to speak.
So that was your video and Zippy was correct that we had been spammed.
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