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Old December 24, 2011, 10:23 AM   #1
TX Hunter
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Traditions Persuit Muzzle Loader?

Hello, I just had a quick question about this Muzzle Loader,
Its the New Kind, with the 209 Shotgun Primer.
My Question is, Would it make alot of difference to use Three Pyrodex Pellets instead of Two ? It says in the manual that 150 Grain Powder charge was the Max, I was going to use this to hunt deer at less than 100 Yards.
Would a 100 Grain Charge, limit me in any way for hunting deer? I have a mixture of different projectiles, I plan to use Sabots so I wont have to mess with patches and grease. Any Advice, the Rifle is the Stainless Model with a Fluted Barrel and a Thumb Hole Stock.
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Old December 24, 2011, 11:01 AM   #2
shortwave
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Quote:
My question is, Would it make alot of difference to use three Pyrodex pellets instead of two
Ask your shoulder after comparing the two.

Your hunting out to 100yds. max. Two 50gr Pyrodex pellets (100gr). charge is plenty for deer and will not limit you in any way as long as you marry the charge with the projectile that best performs out of your rifle.

Try your load with the different sabots and use the one that performs best.
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Old December 24, 2011, 11:12 AM   #3
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Thanks Shortwave, Im excited about trying this rifle, I like the way it feels, and from what I have read and heard about these, they are supposed to be very good, and user frendly.
I am going to shoot it some time today, Thanks and Merry Christmas.
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Old December 24, 2011, 11:31 AM   #4
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shortwave + 1

shortwave; Is spot-on. ..
M/L manufacturers will list the max, for your protection and their CYA program. It's up to your range-time to confirm performance. Whenever I see a post like this, I always try to see where the OP is from and what kind of cover would be encountered. Ours, in Iowa, is very much like yours and I load 90-95grns. of loose powder. Most of my deer have been in the 30-60 yds. range. The farthest "Harvest" shot that taken is 125yds loading 95grns. .....

Be Safe !!!
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Old December 24, 2011, 04:37 PM   #5
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Hey Pahoo

My Son and I took the Muzzle Loader out today, and with our Sabots and Two Pyrodex pelets the Rifle was very accurate out to 125 Yards.
the Recoil was not harsh, and the sights were great.
This Rifle will be used in a Hardwood Creek Bottom where 100 Yards is about the Max.
I really like the gun.
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Old December 24, 2011, 04:39 PM   #6
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Well, good for you !!!

WOW !!!
Sounds like you are where you want to be, already. With most M/L's, it takes time. Good work !!!


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Old December 24, 2011, 06:09 PM   #7
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1st, you'll probably get much better accuracy if you forget about using pellets. Loose powder is generally much more accurate plus you can custom tune your load. 2nd, the velocity difference between 100grn and 150 grns is not nearly enough to justify the loss of accuracy and the extra recoil.
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Old December 24, 2011, 06:18 PM   #8
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TX Hunter,

What sabot did you end up getting the best results with?
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Old December 25, 2011, 08:12 AM   #9
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Shortwave

I got really good accuracy with some Knight Lead 310 Lead Bullets With High Pressure Sabot MFG# 900204.

Thanks, I will also try loose powder, the Pellets Fouled up worse than I thought anyway.
Thanks Guys.
MERRY CHRISTMAS. *Note CHRIST Mas, because in God I do indeed fully trust.
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Old December 25, 2011, 09:26 AM   #10
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Quote:
I will also try loose powder
As Pahoo and Doyle eluded to, me thinks you'll like the loose powder as you'll be able to more finely tune your shot. The pellets are more convenient and generally accurate enough for deer hunting but for best consistency, reliability and accuracy(esp. @ longer distances) the loose powder is worth the effort of using.
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Old December 26, 2011, 12:38 PM   #11
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I recall one fellow who posted how his Pursuit prefers Pyrodex pellets over the loose powder.
The pellets actually produce a little higher velocity compared to the loose powder because they're so highly compressed.
And because they're uniformly compressed, they can produce more consistent velocity.
Every individual rifle is unique and loose powder doesn't always mean better performance.

Last edited by arcticap; December 27, 2011 at 11:37 PM.
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Old December 26, 2011, 06:39 PM   #12
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Quote:
And because they're uniformly compressed, they can produce more consistent velocity.
Actually, just the opposite. Pellets are notoriously inconsistent. Run some shots through a chrono using pellets then using measured loose. You'll generally find much better velocity consistency with with carefully measured loose powder (assuming you also use consitent tamping pressure).
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Old December 26, 2011, 08:05 PM   #13
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Just not happy there !!

When pellets first came out I set up my hunting gear with them as I felt this was a logical choice. I usually do a dry run with anything new and kept running into too many issued using them. On top of that, they were more expensive. While trying to work through these issues, a little voice kept reminding me that loose powder did not present these problems. I still feel there is an advantage during hunting. ....

Have to admit that I may have given up on them, too easily. To date, I have given more away to folks who like them. At any rate, I don't miss them and my shot-strings with loose are working out just fine. ..

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Old December 27, 2011, 08:51 AM   #14
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My sentiments with pellets mirrors Pahoo's and Doyle's...

...and I also may have given up on them a bit to fast as my experience's with them were probably 20yrs ago.

With respect, I also question their consistency. A year or so ago, a friend of mine and I were weighing his 50gr. Pyrodex pellets and their was not two in the container that weighed the same. So, with decided to take 5 loads of loose powder, poured it into our powder measure'er (at 100grns) and weighed these. We got a more consistent weight when compared to the pellets.

Also, aren't the pellets designed to burn from the inside out via the hole in the pellet. If you accidently crush one of the pellets when loading, you have a great chance of a short round(or squib).

Course the 'proof is in the pudding':

If you can find a boolit and number of pellet combo your gun shoots well and you don't crush,crack the pellets when loading...you should have good enough accuracy for deer hunting.
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Old December 27, 2011, 11:42 PM   #15
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by arcticap
And because they're uniformly compressed, they can produce more consistent velocity.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Doyle
Actually, just the opposite. Pellets are notoriously inconsistent. Run some shots through a chrono using pellets then using measured loose. You'll generally find much better velocity consistency with with carefully measured loose powder (assuming you also use consitent tamping pressure).

Perhaps it has something to do with the 209 primers being hotter, along with the weight of the conicals being a good match for the pressure curve that's produced, and the cleaning regimen in between shots. But for whatever the reasons, there's no doubt that the accuracy of pellets can be extremely good from some rifles.
For another example, the White Hots pellets which are an improved form of 777 can produce excellent accuracy from some guns and not so good from others, while loose 777 is notorious for performing erratically when heavily compressed. Yet the muzzle loading world is filled with great accuracy results being obtained using both 777 & White Hots pellets.
So it seems that muzzle loading still has its X-Files of unexplained mysteries.
The truth is out there!

Last edited by arcticap; December 28, 2011 at 12:02 AM.
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