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Old November 7, 2011, 07:48 PM   #26
Ram972
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yes the cal is stamped on the frame.
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Old November 7, 2011, 07:52 PM   #27
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Cobbled together from spare parts would be my guess then. .45 frame, 9mm barrel, chamber, etc.

Reason for doing so? Who knows. Maybe to make it legal, could have been stolen at one time and modified, your guess is as good as mine.

Might wanna look into finding someone who knows their Uzis
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Old November 7, 2011, 08:00 PM   #28
Willie Lowman
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What are the markings on the reciever? Does it say IMI Israel on the left or right side just under where the rear sight is?

Does is say Vector Arms on the left side of the reciever?

Does it say NHM anywhere on it?


I am gonna guess that this is one of the old IMI/Vector guns made with full auto triggers welded into semi auto only.

--------
Edit: I have one of the Uzis that Vector built on the IMI receivers that NHM imported. Most of them were marked .45 ACP or they were marked .22/9mm/.45. It doesn't matter, you can change the caliber of a Uzi in a minute by changing the barrel, bolt, and magazine.

Even if the OP doesn't have one of the guns I am guessing he has, from the sound of it, what he does have is a great 9mm carbine.

As to my previous question about the bolt locking back; If it were a "real" Uzi the bolt would lock open as they are open bolt submachineguns. There are some closed bolt full autos but they are pretty darn rare.

Last edited by Willie Lowman; November 7, 2011 at 08:14 PM.
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Old November 7, 2011, 08:21 PM   #29
Ram972
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the stamps on the frame are Israeli so i really do not know. i just notice that on the barrel there is a 9mm stamp on it. i also notice that the switch dose not click. it just slides from side to side. although the safety dose work .
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Old November 7, 2011, 10:06 PM   #30
Willie Lowman
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If the stamps on it aren't in English I don't know what to tell you.

Take the top cover off of your gun. Remove the bolt and the firing pin, they will just lift out. (you have to dry fire the gun to release the pin)

Now look inside. If you don't see a "blocking bar" you have a illegal machinegun receiver.

Does it look like this toward the back? With the bar on the left side of the receiver?


Or is there nothing there like in this pic?




If the gun does not have that bar it is illegal. Like 10 in the pen illegal.
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Old November 7, 2011, 10:58 PM   #31
Ram972
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i got it opened, there seems to be a "blocking block". it those not look like the on the pictures. its of a different color and it has some nice welds on it. also the switch fell off

today i took it in to get it looked at. the gun smith said that it is a fake, the receiver seems to have Hebrew on it but he said it was really a Chinese receiver. he said that "this could have been done to it so that the value of the weapon could go up".

Last edited by Ram972; November 8, 2011 at 06:06 PM.
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Old November 8, 2011, 07:28 PM   #32
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OK so maybe what you have is a dummy gun cobbled together from parts, except you said you shot it so that makes it a firearm. You need to find out what you have exactly.

And for anyone else reading this who MIGHT have an illegal unregistered machine gun: Guys, DO NOT TALK TO A LEO. DO NOT TALK TO YOUR BEST BUDDY. DO NOT TALK TO THE GUY SITTING NEXT TO YOU ON THE BARSTOOL. RUN DO NOT WALK TO A GOOD ATTORNEY. You have an illegal weapon and it is a very serious offense. BATFE does not take these things lightly. An attorney can talk to BATFE and if necessary arrange to surrender the weapon to them. He cannot and will not divulge any information about who his client is, not how/where he obtained the weapon nor anything else. That will be the best couple of hundred bucks you ever spent.
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Old November 9, 2011, 07:41 AM   #33
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It sounds like a semi-auto Norinco UZI where someone (for whatever reason) fitted an Israeli full-auto pistol grip to it, but with semi-auto parts. In the semi-auto pistol grip, I believe there is a blocking bar to prevent the switch from going into the "full-auto" position.

I'm not sure whether moving the switch to the full position (where full-auto parts were replaced with semi-auto parts) would cause the gun to slam-fire. If it does, it is just as illegal even if it won't truly fire full-auto.

Legal Full-Auto UZI's are a different breed. That's because there were several ways to legally modify them back in the day this could be done (and registered). Some were built on Registered full-auto receivers. Some were made by milling a slot in the bolt - these are called "bolt guns", because the bolt is the machine gun. Some were made by taking the blocking bar out of a semi-auto receiver. Still others were made by modifying the semi-auto bolt. I may not have covered them all. You really need someone who is familiar with full-auto UZI's to take a look at it.
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Old November 9, 2011, 11:11 AM   #34
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Or a semi auto norinco .45 that someone converted to 9mm with Israeli parts.
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Old November 9, 2011, 04:38 PM   #35
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thanks everyone for the productive info. i asked my family friend how he got this firearm, he explained that he got it form a military gun store.he dose not know what he got and i do not know what i have. this firearm seems to not be a safe firearm and i have decided to take my torch to it.
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Old November 9, 2011, 05:05 PM   #36
Skans
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I wouldn't torch it just yet. If all someone did was put a full-auto grip frame on it, you can simply take it off and replace it with semi-auto grip frame, and the gun should be perfectly fine - if that's the only issue. Now, if someone has been monkeying with the receiver itself or it's got full-auto parts installed, then forget it.
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Old November 10, 2011, 11:48 PM   #37
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As Skans said, don't torch it just yet.

Go here:

http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/

Register and ask your questions there.

It would help if you could post pictures of what you have.

Just so you know, the full auto lower can be used to build semi auto gun if it's properly modified and use the appropriate sear.

http://www.uzitalk.com/forums/showth...n-a-semi-build
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Old November 11, 2011, 05:58 PM   #38
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Full Auto is the trickiest of subjects....

And unless registered with the BATFE, prior to May 1986, it is illegal. There is no allowance for making new ones (for legal private ownership), or for registering old ones "found" today.

Having a full auto marking on a gun that does NOT shoot full auto is not automatically a crime. Having a gun with some full auto parts in it (even though it does not shoot full auto) MIGHT BE.

As several have said, contact a lawyer, and not just any lawyer, but one who has some experience in this field. An unregistered machine gun is a felony, 10 years in prison, along with a hefty fine, and loss of your gun rights.

DO NOT DO ANYTHING ELSE until after getting the lawyer's advice.

DO NOT DISPOSE OF THE GUN, DO NOT CUT IT UP, DO NOT SELL, OR GIVE It TO ANYONE (even back to the original owner) until you know for certain if it is a legal gun, or not.

IF THE GUN IS ILLEGAL, you have ONE legal option, surrender it to the Feds. Doing anything else is committing a crime. Going through a lawyer is the smart thing to do.

TO EVERYONE WHO RECOMMENDED DISPOSING OF THE GUN:
Yes, it seem like good advice, bury it, drop it in the river, cut it up, etc...
BUT, doing that is a Federal crime. Telling someone to do that is advocating committing a crime, and is not something tolerated on TFL.

This is a general warning, to all members, posting advice that advocates committing a crime (any crime) is against forum policy and rules. Please do not do so. You can be banned from the forum for this.

Remember this is a public forum, and anyone can come here and read your posts. Conspiracy to violate Federal Firearms law is not a joke.
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Old November 14, 2011, 09:43 PM   #39
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the grip is a fully auto grip, with a Chinese receiver. the gunsmith did the proper checks and fired it. everything seems to be legal.
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