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Old November 8, 2011, 11:43 AM   #1
David Bachelder
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Berry Manufacturing lack of service

All

I ordered three LE Wilson Pistol Gage's from Berry's Manuf. A .40. .38 and a .357. The .40 and the .38 arrived as ordered. The .357 box was labeled correctly .357 Mag Pistol Gage, however the Gage its self was wrong. They shipped me a .357 case length Gage in a .357 Pistol gage box, which is of no use to me at all. I called Berrys and told them what happened. They explained to me that I could return the mislabeled gage to LE Wilson because Berry outsources the LE Wilson products. I told Berrys that I ordered the tool form them, not LE Wilson and I expect them to honor the sale, meaning I return the improper tool to them and in return they send me the proper tool (as ordered).

Well they agreed to refund the purchase price for the wrong tool if I send it back. However I would need to reorder the tool. They wanted me to return the tool, pay the postage, and take a chance on a replacement order.

Didn't sound like a responsible way to handle a customer to me. I expect them to stand behind the product they sell, weather it's outsourced or not has nothing to do with me. I didn't choose outsourcing for Berry Manf, they did. I'm a customer that expects to be treated fairly. If I order a product from a company and the wrong item arrives I don't expect their mistake to cost me money.

My account has been canceled and I will never spend another penny with Berrys Manuf. I'd suggest you do the same.
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Old November 8, 2011, 11:52 AM   #2
Sevens
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I'm sorry about your experience, it sounds frustrating.

However, I will not take your suggestion. Berry's has been a terrific company for me to deal with. Fantastic product, good people, lighting fast shipping. I use their bullets over all other plated and I've used tens of thousands of them across half a dozen different calibers. Their ammo boxes are better, IMO, than any flip-top plastic boxes on the market. Jay from Berry's posts here on TFL on occasion with help & experiences with the product and even takes suggestions any requests from shooters around here.

Berry's is one of my favorite companies across the board in the guns/shooting/handloading business. I won't be taking my business elsewhere and I suggest that nobody over reacts because of your isolated incident where you've said they'll happily refund your purchase price.
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Old November 8, 2011, 12:08 PM   #3
David Bachelder
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I called LE Wilson. They have agreed to exchange the tool and pay the postage. They also said they don't understand Berry's policy either.

Anyhow, life goes on.
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Old November 8, 2011, 12:18 PM   #4
Sevens
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IMO, from what you said, I can easily see why Berry's won't exchange it if it's a sealed package. (I have no idea how it's packaged) It definitely seems like Berry's should have reimbursed you for shipping both ways.

Screwups certainly happen.
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Old November 8, 2011, 12:27 PM   #5
chiefr
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I agree with OP. Berrys made the mistake and Berrys should make amends.

I have had the same issues with other retailers IE, Midway USA. GRAFs and Gun Parts Co and they promptly took care of things at their expense. One time they even sent the correct order overnite. It is a pleasure to deal with great cust service.

I too like Berrys products, however, I buy their stuff from retailers, not direct. I will take your advice and not order direct from them.
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Old November 8, 2011, 12:45 PM   #6
serf 'rett
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Really sorry to hear about the apparent lack of service; however, I suspect you had not gone high enough up the food chain at Berry's. Jay strikes me as a reasonable fellow.

I second Stevens in that I've had excellent service from Berry's and from the use of their products. I can easily imagine the inexperienced service rep at Berry’s trying to simplify the resolution by putting you in direct contact with LE Wilson (who was the source of the problem), but Berry's should have offered to pay the shipping.
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Old November 8, 2011, 02:13 PM   #7
Shane Tuttle
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Moved over to Retail Deals and Feedback.

Now, from this point on, anyone willing to post in this thread SHALL COMPLY WITH THE RETAIL DEALS AND FEEDBACK RULES. No excuses will be accepted.
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Old November 8, 2011, 06:14 PM   #8
dunerjeff
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I've had nothing but good service from them,prompt shipping and everything as ordered. I had ordered a LNL press from Midway and they sent me two (doubled everything I ordered) they reimbersed shipping for the return .Ya ,they charged for both.
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Old November 8, 2011, 09:46 PM   #9
jfrey
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Things will happen from time to time but I've never had anything but good service from Berry's. I think I'll stay with 'em.
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Old November 9, 2011, 09:50 AM   #10
Berry's MfG
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David,
I'm sorry you felt our service was lacking, but you also have to see it from our perspective. Our policy is to get the product back so we can correct the problem, we can't just re-send a new one with the hopes of getting the gage back. This was not a CSR picking on you they were following the policy set by the company. Last month we sold an RCBS scale that the customer said did not work when he opened the box. He emailed us and I told him that I would suggest he contact RCBS first since they are the ones who warranty their products. I also told him that if they were unable to satisfy him I would refund his purchase including shipping if he sent it back and then I would deal with RCBS on the bad product. Your conversation got heated when you were asked to send the product back and we would take care of you as our customer. I understand your frustration and if it were a Berry's product that we made and packaged the response may have been different. Since the incident we have taken corrective action and quarantined the 357 gages in question and have gone through the inventory to make sure there is not another mixed gage in the packaging. We do our best to make a quality product and stand by our customers. You are welcome to contact me if you would like to further discuss the matter and if you would like to return the gage I will refund your money including your return freight.

Jay Phillips
Berry's MFG
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Old November 9, 2011, 12:10 PM   #11
Berry's MfG
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Here is an update to the issue we had on the order to David:

I got involved with the corrective action to check LE Wilson inventory in the warehouse. We found two 357 Mag case length gages in with the MAX case gages. The difference is the case gauge does not check OAL of the loaded round and the MAX gage does check it. In researching the mix up I found that LE Wilson only created product part numbers mid 2011, so all orders were based on product description. When we receive an item from a vendor we scan the barcodes of the order to make sure they match the packing slip of what was shipped and cross reference the PO to make sure we got what we ordered. With no barcodes available or part numbers on the product label, it would be the responsibility of the receiving agent to have the product knowledge in order to spot the difference. As one of the forum members alluded to that if David would have gotten pushed up to me the outcome probably would have been different, I would agree that when I did leg work on the problem I discovered the issue very quickly and would have been able to help the customer more to his satisfaction. It would have also helped me identify the problem with the Wilson products and how we purchase them. LE Wilson are what I consider to be the finest gages for the price and have 100% confidence in the product or I wouldn't be using them personally and suggested they be added to our line. My apologies to David for the error, it's hard to write a hard fast policy that works for all situations but we really try to do our best.
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Old November 9, 2011, 12:30 PM   #12
Sevens
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Okay... I read, and then re-read the RULES of posting in this thread. Since I have (what my credit card bill calls "extensive") experience in dealing with Berry's, I feel I can safely post in this thread.

I stand by what I said above.

In our ballgame, most of the companies are a bunch of good guys... usually, a bunch of shooters and gun cranks living the dream and doing a "job" that is similar to what the rest of us do for fun.

Most of the folks we deal with are good people. IMO, Berry's manages to put themselves ahead of even many of the others. This is a great company with a terrific product and my experiences have all be completely positive.

I think it can be a bit careless to "go public" in a much-viewed internet forum when someone has a glitch in their experience with a company. I'd like to think this one is or has been cleared up without any resulting skid marks.
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Old November 9, 2011, 01:04 PM   #13
Berry's MfG
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Sevens,
Now you've got me worried, I haven't read the rules of posting in this thread and hope I haven't gone awry. I agree with you on the "going public" and the blogosphere has made it necessary to stay tuned in, that is why I'm a member of so many forums. I will say that when I fist got involved I received a few calls from my colleagues at other companies asking me why I would hang it out so far and give the opportunity to get your head cut off. That is the real sentiment of many of the gun companies out there, and they have a valid concern. I have incorporated it into my PR budget as a valuable tool to interact with our customer base. But the negative postings about companies and their products have created a bias view of forums with many of the companies I know and do business with.
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Old November 9, 2011, 02:37 PM   #14
David Bachelder
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Berry

With all respect, I'm afraid the story you heard was not entirely accurate. The conversation with the employee got heated because the employee chose to get loud and obnoxious, I'm afraid I followed suit .... my bad.

First I was told Berry Manf outsourced the gages from LE Wilson and to call them. I informed the employee that I didn't buy the gage from LE Wilson I bought it from Berry's and I expected Berry to take care of the problem. I could see no reason to call LE Wilson. This is when she got angry, loud and interruptive. Frankly if she worked for me, I'd have fired her for talking to customers in that manor.

I never said I wouldn't send the tool back. I wouldn't expect you to replace a product that was not in hand, that would be idiotic. I was told that if I sent it back a refund would be issued and I could re-order. What would this do for me? Originally I paid to have you ship me the mislabeled product, not entirely your fault, but in the end it wasn't my fault. Next I'd have to pay to return it back to you for exchange, finally I'd have to pay to have the replacement sent to me. I'd pay shipping three times for a mistake I had nothing to do with. The Berry rep was very clear on this, I was told all shipping would be at my expense.

I guess I'm old fashioned, I expect companies to back up their product with service.

FYI, I did call LE Wilson, they claimed responsibility and have agreed to replace the mispackaged product and refund any shipping expences.

I own and operate a retail business and I deal with customers each and every day. Not once in eleven years did I not back up a product that I sold, even if it cost me money. If I send something out and it is wrong or defective, I fix the problem. I expect the companies I deal with to do the same. I don't sell an item then tell the customer to call someone else in the event of a problem. It's just bad business.

I do believe that if you had been involved on a personal level, things would have been different. Further, I will have trouble finding a replacement for your fine products.
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Old November 9, 2011, 05:37 PM   #15
amamnn
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I don't see why the OP had a problem with going to Wilson for redress---Berry did not make or package the product. Following his (ill) logic then any item bought in any store anywhere is the responsibility of the retailer--which is silly. If this kind of nonsense were the rule--you would only be able to buy a wilson gage from Wilson--which is more expensive.
You would have to drive out to the farm to get your radishes and corn and let''s get real here.

All the retailer does for you is make the product more easily available and cheaper for you by taking the financial risk of stockpiling it. He does not MAKE it. I've operated retail stores in the past and I've dealt with Berry for a long time. I will continue to buy Berry products. I've also dealt with Wilson over a period of time and I am sure that they would have done right by the end user here as they have in the past, but this fool never let them have a chance.
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Last edited by Shane Tuttle; November 9, 2011 at 09:59 PM. Reason: Removal of name calling and language skirting...
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Old November 9, 2011, 06:38 PM   #16
David Bachelder
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I don't buy product from Wal-Mart and return it it to Target. I don't buy a Chevy and return it to Ford. I buy radishes from the grocery store that buys them from a warehouse. If the radishes are bad I dont't take them to the warehouse, I take them back to the grocer.

Give me a break. I'm not and I never have dissed Berry's or their products.
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Old November 9, 2011, 06:39 PM   #17
David Bachelder
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A Mutual Agreement

Berry's and I have reached a mutual agreement. One that appeals to both of us.

I have to admit, I'm relieved.
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Old November 9, 2011, 06:49 PM   #18
Berry's MfG
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I hate managers meetings anyway and am going to show that if I were at my desk when David needed my help this all would have been averted. I see it as a Win/Win situation, thanks for the help David.
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Old November 9, 2011, 10:18 PM   #19
Shane Tuttle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Berry's MfG
Now you've got me worried, I haven't read the rules of posting in this thread and hope I haven't gone awry.
What Sevens is clarifying is, per the rules in Retail Deals and Feedback, if there's a dispute between members or a member and a business, then those that haven't done business with the accused is to butt out of the thread.

Keeps the unnecessary cheerleaders and dogpilers getting in the way of actually resolving the issue.

You have every right to respond and provide your side of the story.
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