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Old June 6, 2011, 10:32 PM   #1
capflyboy05
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Beginners shotgun recommendations??

So I want a 12ga shotgun.
I was told that Mossberg's are good entry level, but wont last forever.
Remington has some good entry shotguns, but last longer.
That didnt narrow much down for me...
And I've always wondered this.
Can you put smaller gauges into a 12ga?
Say a 14, 16, or 20ga...
Any model recommendations.
Price range is less than $300.
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Old June 6, 2011, 11:28 PM   #2
InTheCountry
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Remington and Mossberg both make fine shotguns for that price range. As for the guaging no. the 12 ga. shoots a 12ga, and the 20ga. shoots the 20ga. A 410 shotgun is pretty cool. Would you like a pump gun or an autoloader? I dont see how a Mossberg wouldnt last as long as any other gun though. And the Rem. 870 express and Mossberg 500 are pretty much the same gun.
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Old June 6, 2011, 11:34 PM   #3
capflyboy05
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I feel like I could go either way.
I like skeet shooting.
So autoloader would be a better bet.
But I would probably just use it for trap shooting/plinking.
Pumps make me feel cool when I reload. hahahahaha
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Old June 6, 2011, 11:58 PM   #4
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You say that you like to shoot skeet and you are right that an auto loader is better for skeet than a pump, unless you are an expert, because of the need to shoot doubles, but then you say you will probably use the gun for trap. Do you realize that while both involve shooting moving clay tartgets, they are very different games? $300 is not going to buy any new auto loader but I wonder if it might get you an older Remington 1100. The guys here with experience will know.

Also I don't know if it is just throwing money way but check out the thread just started about the turkish made CZ.

Last edited by TheKlawMan; June 7, 2011 at 12:08 AM.
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Old June 7, 2011, 12:22 AM   #5
.300 Weatherby Mag
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Price range less than $300 puts you in Mossberg 500 Territory.. You cannot get a good autoloader in that price range...
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Old June 7, 2011, 02:06 AM   #6
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Either a Remington or Mossberg would be fine. Both are very good shotguns. You are unlikely to wear either out.

Handle them both and see which one fits you better. Also try out the controls and see if you like one better.

You can't really put smaller gauges into a 12 gauge. They are too small to function. There is such a thing as a subgauge insert, but they are expensive and really only an option for a single shot or double barreled shotgun.

It is possible to fire a shorter shotshell of the same gauge, however.

Make sure you see what other shotguns the store has. If you like one in your price range, feel free to ask us about it. It might also be worth it to check pawn shops.
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Old June 7, 2011, 10:39 AM   #7
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You will get what you pay for with a $300 budget. Shooting clays, that would mean - between targets and ammo - that you will have spent more than your gun in about 30 rounds of trap or skeet, even less with sporting clays.

While a typical Mossberg or Remington pump is not a bad gun neither are ideal for clay games where doubles are part of the routine. It can be done, just not as effectively, resulting in lower scores than if a semi or O/U had been used. Unfortunately, with your limited current budget, those are not part of the possibilities.

IF $300 is the MAX you can go, then get whichever pump feels good to you and go have fun, realizing that if you really want to improve and get into competition, etc., a different gun will be needed shortly.

Trap singles and skeet are completely different from each other, especially when it comes to gun styles. As you begin this path of smoking clays, be prepared to want to upgrade through different guns, lessons, and lots of practice.

Good luck!
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Old June 7, 2011, 10:51 AM   #8
InTheCountry
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You can take the 300 you have currently and stash it. Save up more and more and then get the shotgun you desire the most. And have time to think about what you really want. And im sure you have friends that own a shotgun, see if yall can go shoot one day.
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Old June 7, 2011, 10:55 AM   #9
youngunz4life
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MOSSBERG 500

or

REMINGTON 870 POLICE MAGNUM

if you dont want a pump shotgun get a double barreled shotgun(breaktop)
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Old June 7, 2011, 11:11 AM   #10
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Quote:
You cannot get a good autoloader in that price range...
True if it was going to be NIB, but I was able to get my Remington 1100 for 280 dollars used.
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Old June 7, 2011, 11:12 AM   #11
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Quote:
if you dont want a pump shotgun get a double barreled shotgun(breaktop)
A $300 SxS for skeet shooting becomes a fence post or jack handle rather quickly as they do not last, and cheap ones have very poor swing dynamics
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Old June 7, 2011, 11:20 AM   #12
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oneounceload,

please explain more. I am not doubting you, but I thought the double barreled shotgun was very reliable?
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Old June 7, 2011, 11:31 AM   #13
Dave McC
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Don't buy a gun yet. Check out some local range that offer trap, skeet, Sporting Clays,etc. A well mannered newbie gets questions answered and guns to try out.

After handling and shooting some different shotguns, you'll have a better idea of what will work for you.

A good pump gun like an 870 or 500 is something everyone should have, but there's other good choices out there.

Have fun....
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Old June 7, 2011, 12:28 PM   #14
oneounceload
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Quote:
please explain more. I am not doubting you, but I thought the double barreled shotgun was very reliable?
They most certainly can be; HOWEVER, a SxS that is well built is the most labor intensive gun to make - whether rifle or shotgun. Hence, they tend to cost a LOT more than similar guns that are O/U, pumps or semis which can be easily cranked out on CNC equipment. Quality SxS guns are meant mostly, for fast-handling bird-hunting situations so their barrels, balance, triggers, etc., are all hand done.

Cheap SxS, in order to make a certain price point (and O/U or other for that matter) scrimp and cut corners on every quality aspect they can and still make a gun that goes bang (most of the time). However, their longevity is not certain, therefore their reliability is also suspect. ANY gun can fail early on, but cheap guns (and cheap is NOT the same as inexpensive), will fail more often than a quality built gun.

Example: Michael McIntosh, a noted gun writer, extolled the virtues and longevity of his AyA #2 SxS, stating he had over 120,000 rounds through the gun with no issues. Currently these guns start about $5500. AyA makes a few other models that are less, typically the cheapest is the 4/53 which starts at $3400. The point is this - these guns are meant to be shot a lot in the field and used on fast-moving birds - something they were designed for. These really aren't beginner's guns, but they are the beginning price point for quality.

Stoeger, Yildiz, Baikal, Stevens, etc. are not built to the same quality level (why they don't cost near as much), and while some here will espouse about their "ruggedness, built like a tank" or some other supposedly good feature, the reality is they can't build a quality gun at their price point. This means that reliabilty, longevity, etc. are not typically present. Now if you want one of those for some fun, backyard pest control, informal targets and you don't shoot a lot, they'll probably do fine, because when they break, it shouldn't be at a critical moment - but if you are relying on one of those for competition where the money is on the line or HD where your life is on the line, I would suggest something different
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Old June 7, 2011, 01:01 PM   #15
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The mossberg will last just fine, but the Remington is my favorite. I like my old wingmaster. It has 3 barrels, and has more rounds through it than I care to know. I've never had a problem with it. My friends have Mossbergs and they seem to have done just fine with them.
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Old June 7, 2011, 02:13 PM   #16
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oneounceload

ok thanx. thats some good info to know
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Old June 8, 2011, 03:50 PM   #17
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ive got a stoeger O/U condor, its true that the craftsmanship isnt there as much as say my friends browning citori or similar guns but i also like to think that some of those big price tags are from the hand engraving and gold thats inlayed on the recievers. it makes for an amazing looking gun dont get me wrong but its probably not what you need for a first shotgun.

Ive had mine for a couple years as well as an 870LH and i still like bringing my condor over my remington to the range more. it shoots great and i find its shooter length makes it easier to transition between targets, plus you get 2 shots without having to work the action in between pulls of the trigger
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Old June 8, 2011, 03:53 PM   #18
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Just save your money till you double it and get something a little better you will actually like, the 11-87 is a decent low priced semi auto to start with. They make a sportsmans model for 600 I believe
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Old June 8, 2011, 07:06 PM   #19
oneounceload
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browning citori or similar guns but i also like to think that some of those big price tags are from the hand engraving and gold thats inlayed on the recievers. it makes for an amazing looking gun dont get me wrong but its probably not what you need for a first shotgun.
Believe me, REAL gold and HAND engraving is going to cost you about ten times what a Browning or Beretta costs......their decorations are machine done via computer

If anyone is remotely close to wanting to shoot clays in competition, then the Beretta or Browning is the minimum way to go..........even if you do not like it and decide to stop down the road, you'll get most, if not all, of your money back - something that won't happen with the cheap guns
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Old June 8, 2011, 07:30 PM   #20
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Actually, I'm looking at pump actions.
Sorry if I didnt make that clear.
I just like to shoot clays... one at a time.
Hand thrown or thrown using the machine.
The Mossberg 500 or them Remington 870 are the ones I'm looking into.
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Old June 8, 2011, 07:33 PM   #21
oneounceload
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Actually, I'm looking at pump actions.
Sorry if I didnt make that clear.
I just like to shoot clays... one at a time.
Hand thrown or thrown using the machine.
Then hand-thrown rocks can work too....................
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Old June 8, 2011, 07:37 PM   #22
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Greetings
The Mossy pump has been used by our military for 25+ years. Reports of Mossy,s having fired 50,000 rounds in training without any gun malfunctions are pretty good evidence they keep on chunking.
Police dept´s use Mossy´s and I see nothing in print that says they have a unacceptable failure rate. I have several 25 year old ex-police model 500´s and they function without flaw. I have one here in Peru and I am staking our home proctection on it without any concern of firearm failure. It has consumed some rather high pressure round ball loads without any problems.
Mike in Peru
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Old June 8, 2011, 07:40 PM   #23
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Ok pump guns is where your at and you want to go 300 bucks, still save the money and buy a wingmaster 870 once you have the money. The express 870s are just not a 870. The 500s are ok and work well for the money but once you start getting into it you wont be satisfied
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Old June 9, 2011, 01:23 PM   #24
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@capflyboy05

To quote someone else on this forum who previously posted this:

"Remington vs Mossberg is like Ford vs GM"

Go in the store, handle both, see which one you personally like better.

Or go out to a place that rents them, rent both, see which one you like shooting better.

I was in your boat not long ago.

Start touching the things in person, you'll form an opinion.

But don't touch them like Anthony Weiner :P
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Old June 9, 2011, 02:42 PM   #25
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In shotguns - you often get what you pay for ....and you can't just look at a gun ...its in the internals, the steel, the quality of the parts, how they fit, etc ...that makes up a lot of cost. It isn't just fancy wood / or machine engraving - that makes up the cost ...although that is part of it ...

There are a lot of good pump guns on the market - Remington 870 Wingmaster and Browning BPS are 2 of the better ones ( selling in the $ 600 price range) ...the lower end of the 870's is the Express models...and there is Mossberg, etc ...Benelli Nova is another gun worth looking at. On a $ 300 budget, I think I'd stay with one of the Rem 870's.

O/U's cost a lot more to produce - if they're done right / and Browning and Beretta have set the market for a long time with solid guns for the money and long term durable ( 250,000 shells or more ).... but to get into that arena means an investment of $ 1,500 - $ 3,000 depending on the model. But Browning makes about 25 different models of their Citori O/U ...and some of them may fit you / some of them may not. I like the Citori's a lot - but only 3 or 4 models - fit me personally.

In Semi-auto world there are gas guns and Inertia guns. A lot of the gas guns will cost you from $ 800 - $2,000 and there are good guns from Beretta, Browning - Winchester basically the same now, and Remington - and Benelli on the Inertia gun side. There are other mfg's out there ...but they have very spotty reputations for the most part. There are pros and cons to gas or inertia / but at least look at them as you get into this hobby.

Heed OneOunce's advice - and stay away from the SXS's for now...

Be careful what you hear from gunstore sales guys ...many of them have little to no experience. Go to your local club ...talk to some of the shooters, see what they're shooting, and why they decided to buy and shoot that gun ...look for some good used guns on their boards....

I wouldn't be in a rush to buy a gun until you really know more about the various mfg's and models / see what fits you ...

There are a lot of guns being imported from Turkey these days ...and a lot of them look pretty good / but they are not holding up to reasonable target usage ( a few thousand shells a yr ) ...but you might get one of the 3 of 10 that are ok / or you might not ---its hard to tell. One company that is selling a lot of guns is Cabelas - a TriStar brand / priced right - and they come with a 5 yr warranty ...so if you're looking for a gun on a budget / give their offerings a look.
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