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Old January 27, 2011, 12:07 PM   #26
p99guy
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gunsamerica blog is reporting this morning that ATF has flip flopped again and its back to being allowed as a over the counter revolver
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Old January 28, 2011, 08:56 AM   #27
precision_shooter
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Here is a question for ya,

If the 28 guage judge would not be legal becuase of the rifled barrel being over .50", then why is a 20 or 12 guage shotgun legal with a rifled slug barrel that easily measure over .60"? Rifling is Rifling, and form the earlier posts, anything over .50" that is rifled is classified as a destructive device....
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Old January 28, 2011, 09:29 AM   #28
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The never ending courtroom saga of the Judge (Taurus) vs. the jury (BATF). Has all the makings of a new reality show (based on the great movie"My Cousin Vinny" starring the late Fred Gwynn of Herman Munster fame).

Cousin Vinny: You see your Honor these two yoots were bird hunting in Jersey with the 28 gauge Taurus...

Fred Gwynn: Councilor, just what is a yoot?

Vinny:These two (points at defendants) you know yoots!

Gwynn: Oh, yooooths! carry on.

Vinny: Anyhows, these two (PAUSE) yoooooths were bird hunting and were jumped by these wiseguys, so's they whip out their 28 ga. shotgun, er, pistol, er shotgun.....oh what the...., their Blaster!, and defended themselves against these evildoers.

Gwynn: Just what kind of birds am I to believe there are to be in Jersey?

Vinny: Pigeons, your Honor, nasty filthy left wing pigeons!

Gwynn: Why didn't you say that in the first place, Not Guilty! That was the issue before this court, wasn't it?
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Old January 28, 2011, 09:44 AM   #29
Sarge
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This is another one of those unexplainable marketing efforts which to me, defies logic.

Still, the nominal bore diameter of the 28 gauge is .550 inches... and I could have me some fun with brass cases, 425 grain .54 cal Hornady Great Plains bullets and healthy doses of black powder. Ought to be just the ticket for rabbits in Momma's garden
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Old January 28, 2011, 10:23 AM   #30
Jim Watson
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Hamilton Bowen converted a Redhawk to .577 Tranter.
He said it was a fun gun but the paperwork hassle made it too much trouble to do on a regular basis.
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Old January 28, 2011, 10:36 AM   #31
kozak6
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Quote:
If the 28 guage judge would not be legal becuase of the rifled barrel being over .50", then why is a 20 or 12 guage shotgun legal with a rifled slug barrel that easily measure over .60"? Rifling is Rifling, and form the earlier posts, anything over .50" that is rifled is classified as a destructive device....
It can lawfully be over .50 cal if it is suitable for sporting purposes.

We also haven't established that the 28 gauge Judge is over .50, as that clearly puts it into murky territory. 28 gauge, or .55 cal, isn't that far from .50 cal. Chances are, the barrel diameter funnels down to a hair under .50 just to stay on the safe side.
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Old January 28, 2011, 11:04 AM   #32
oneounceload
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Quote:
Here is a question for ya,

If the 28 guage judge would not be legal becuase of the rifled barrel being over .50", then why is a 20 or 12 guage shotgun legal with a rifled slug barrel that easily measure over .60"? Rifling is Rifling, and form the earlier posts, anything over .50" that is rifled is classified as a destructive device....
Because certain exemptions were granted for BP guns and sporting shotguns and dangerous game rifles

Why this isn't classified an AOW, I still don't get - it isn't a SBS as it has no shoulder stock, it is a handgun for which there is no handgun ammunition available.......
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Old January 28, 2011, 11:21 AM   #33
Webleymkv
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Quote:
If the 28 guage judge would not be legal becuase of the rifled barrel being over .50", then why is a 20 or 12 guage shotgun legal with a rifled slug barrel that easily measure over .60"? Rifling is Rifling, and form the earlier posts, anything over .50" that is rifled is classified as a destructive device....
Anything with a rifled barrel over .50" is a destructive device unless the ATF grants a "sporting purpose" exemption. Rifled-barrel shotguns and certain African-game cartridges like .577, .600, and .700 Nitro have been granted sporting purpose exemptions. The ATF does not seem, however, overly willing to grant such exemptions to handguns. The .50 AE Desert Eagle was delayed because of confusion over the bore diameter.
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Old January 28, 2011, 12:20 PM   #34
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Why this isn't classified an AOW, I still don't get - it isn't a SBS as it has no shoulder stock, it is a handgun for which there is no handgun ammunition available.......
AOWs are specifically stated in the law as not having rifling (which the Raging Judge has). The only exception to this definition is for pistols with a vertical forend firing grip added.

And yes, all it would take is a decision from the Treasury Secretary to make every shotgun over .410 into a destructive device. Shotguns over .5" bore are all DD's by virtue of bore diameter,but are granted exemption via the sporting purposes clause which allows exemptions for shotguns (but does not require them).
Note: A DD does not need rifling to be a DD.
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Old January 28, 2011, 06:07 PM   #35
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The ATF announced this past Monday that they are blocking the new Judge because Taurus lied on the import application, labeling it a revolver instead of a SBS...
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Old January 30, 2011, 07:39 PM   #36
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Do you have an authoritative link?
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Old January 31, 2011, 05:06 AM   #37
garyhan
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The death of the Raging Judge was pure internet rumor. ATF approved and good to go. http://www.americanrifleman.org/blog...g-judge-rumors.

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Old January 31, 2011, 05:17 AM   #38
gyvel
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The bottom line here is: Who needs it? Just another stupid marketing ploy.

But then, hey!, we're the nation that buys pet rocks, Elvis collector plates, beenie babies and Lincoln pickup trucks.
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Old January 31, 2011, 05:31 AM   #39
everragenepa
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The bottom line here is: Who needs it? Just another stupid marketing ploy.
Everyone a firearm is a firearm and this is the United States of America the more the merrier. I dont care that is something that dont grab my interest it will somones and that someone might just be a new firearm owner.

I also HATE that everyone just accepts the "sporting purpose" game. Were in 2nd admendment does it say anything about sporting purpose.
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Old January 31, 2011, 12:42 PM   #40
natman
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I also HATE that everyone just accepts the "sporting purpose" game. Were in 2nd admendment does it say anything about sporting purpose.
Nowhere.

However, the Gun Control Act of 1968 bans the IMPORT, let me repeat, IMPORT of ALL firearms into the US unless the BATF decides that it has "sporting purpose".

If it's made in the US, then it's more open. If it's IMPORTED, then the BATF gets to decide if it's sporting.
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Old February 2, 2011, 12:02 AM   #41
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Threat tagged. Cause I also don't get how this can be imported.

On a side note. If this could be sold as a "regular" pistol firing conventional 28ga shot shells - it might do alright sales wise here in the USA.
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Old February 2, 2011, 12:22 AM   #42
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I simply do not believe the American Rifleman link, as the 28ga Judge is clearly over .5" bore... BATFE wouldn't issue an exemption for a shotgun pistol, there is no precedent.
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Old February 2, 2011, 09:39 AM   #43
Skans
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I've got a question about this Taurus Judge .28 gauge. Assuming that it was a smoothbore, and assuming that legality was not an issue, is there really that much difference between it and a .410 gauge in a pistol format? Would it make a bigger "boom", a bigger hole or a more devistating impact?
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Old February 2, 2011, 11:36 AM   #44
Poodleshooter
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Quote:
I've got a question about this Taurus Judge .28 gauge. Assuming that it was a smoothbore, and assuming that legality was not an issue, is there really that much difference between it and a .410 gauge in a pistol format? Would it make a bigger "boom", a bigger hole or a more devistating impact
If it was a smoothbore, it would be an AOW or SBS most likely. Its only chance for Title I status is with a rifled barrel and getting sporting purpose exemption from the DD definition.
Anyway, assuming it's an easily procurable Title I weapon, it would lose the .410 Judge's ability to use .45 Colt,which is the most effective load that pistol has. Unlike .410,there are no slugs or buckshot made for the 28ga that I know of. So users would have to use the few 28ga bird shot loads available, making the weapon even more useless for self defense.
It is pure marketing genius!
I for one look forward to more unique Taurus self defense products, like "The Bailiff", a unique 17 pound, 50 shot .22 short pepperbox, and "The Juror" a 10ga, 2 shot, lightweight side by side derringer.
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Old February 2, 2011, 11:54 AM   #45
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I for one look forward to more unique Taurus self defense products, like "The Bailiff", a unique 17 pound, 50 shot .22 short pepperbox, and "The Juror" a 10ga, 2 shot, lightweight side by side derringer.
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Old February 2, 2011, 12:42 PM   #46
Skans
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"The Juror" a 10ga, 2 shot, lightweight side by side derringer.
Oh, that was funny!:
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Old February 2, 2011, 12:54 PM   #47
abelacres
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"The Juror" a 10ga, 2 shot, lightweight side by side derringer.
I'd buy 2 of those.
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Old February 2, 2011, 12:56 PM   #48
Skans
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I'd buy 2 of those.
Yeah, but would you shoot them? For that matter, has anyone ever seen a short barrel 10 gauge?

Follow up: Well, I had to go and google SBS 10 gauge, and of course I found one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypnqXJN6H2k

Last edited by Skans; February 2, 2011 at 01:01 PM.
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