The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Conference Center > Law and Civil Rights

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 9, 2011, 01:18 AM   #1
Gbro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 20, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,056
Discharge of weapon withing municipality

I have a hard time believing that some people believe it is legal to discharge a bow & arrow or related equipment within a city/Municipality.

This comes from a post in another thread,
Quote:
Is it legal to shoot bows in residential areas? It isn't legal here.
Are there any know city's that this would be OK other than one with a large outlying area with forests, farms and such like Hibbing MN.
Quote:
C. Subdivision 4 of this section shall not apply to firing or discharging any gun, pistol or other firearm, air pistol or B-B gun in that portion of the Rural Service District that is not platted.
Except, it shall be unlawful to discharge a dangerous weapon within 500 ft of any structure without the consent of the owner, ...................
And another near by City, Duluth Mn where even the sale of BB Guns is restricted;
Quote:
Sec. 49-8.2. Airguns, paintball guns.
(a) Possession of airguns.
No person shall possess or have in his or her control any airgun in the city except:
(1) Within the home or other residence, or another building accessory thereto as
defined in Section 50-1.1 of this Code, of the person possessing such airgun;
(2) Within any commercial or manufacturing establishment manufacturing, repairing,
altering, modifying or offering for sale in the stream of commerce such airgun;

(3) Within an area zoned as suburban under Chapter 50 of this Code;
(4) On premises for which the chief of police has issued a permit for such purpose
under subsection (c) below;
__________________
Gbro
CGVS
For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, But to us who are being saved, It Is The Power Of God. 1Corinthians 1-18
Gbro is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 09:18 AM   #2
Aguila Blanca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 6,509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gbro
I have a hard time believing that some people believe it is legal to discharge a bow & arrow or related equipment within a city/Municipality.
Why do you find it so hard to believe? Laws relating to the discharge of weapons (typically firearms) are typically enacted at the county or municipal level, not at the state level. There are thousands, if not tens or hundreds of thousands, of municipalities in the United States. Do you believe that they have ALL enacted laws prohibiting the use of bows and arrows on your own property?

I don't think so. In fact, since I know that it's legal to shoot archery in my back (or front) yard, I am absolutely certain that it is not prohibited everywhere in the U.S. And if it's legal in my town, I suspect there must be at least one other municipality in the U.S. where it's legal.
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 09:25 AM   #3
Brian Pfleuger
Staff
 
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Central, Southern NY, USA
Posts: 18,791
The legality of discharging archery within city/village limits is one of those things that is almost entirely ignored in many places.

Personally, I asked the village if it was OK if I practiced in my yard with my bow. They said it was. Technically, it's against village code. They OKed it. I know lots and lots... and lots... of people who practice with archery equipment where it's illegal without asking anyone.

Very few people care at all. It's entirely different that a firearm, both in potential danger and disturbance.

I know one guy who pitches a fit every time some body shoots a gun near his house. He's down the road from my father. Every time someone in the neighborhood shoots he comes out to see if they're 500 feet away. Everybody is except the closest neighbor, who has to edge over onto a more reasonable neighbors property to get the distance. He (the grumpy one) will actually check the distance with a laser range finder. But, that same closest neighbor can shoot all day long with his bow within 50 feet of the guys house and he doesn't care.
__________________
Still happily answering to the call-sign Peetza.
---
The problem, as you so eloquently put it, is choice.
-The Architect
-----
He is no fool who gives what he can not keep to gain what he can not lose.
-Jim Eliott, paraphrasing Philip Henry.
Brian Pfleuger is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 10:13 AM   #4
brickeyee
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 29, 2004
Posts: 3,342
Quote:
I have a hard time believing that some people believe it is legal to discharge a bow & arrow or related equipment within a city/Municipality.
Yet none of the laws poster appear on their face to cover a bow and arrow.
brickeyee is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 02:22 PM   #5
carguychris
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 20, 2007
Location: Richardson, TX
Posts: 5,515
Quote:
The legality of discharging archery within city/village limits is one of those things that is almost entirely ignored in many places.
+1. Although TX state law allows municipalities to regulate archery on private tracts of land under 10ac, I am not aware of a city in the North Central Texas area that prohibits the discharge of arrows on private property. Many TX cities prohibit archery in public parks, but that's not really pertinent to the question, as parks are obviously public spaces.
Quote:
Personally, I asked the village if it was OK if I practiced in my yard with my bow. They said it was. Technically, it's against village code. They OKed it.
FWIW the OP needs to realize a few facts about municipal law.

First, many municipalities have ordinances on the books that are routinely violated by numerous residents, e.g. parking a non-functional car in a location that's visible to the public, or leaving grass clippings in a city street. In most cases, the city staff does not go after every single violator, nor do most of them ever intend to; they only go after egregious violators who are creating a legitimate public nuisance.

Second, much municipal law is essentially written by eager volunteers who may not be operating under very close supervision. This occasionally results in bad law that is not feasibly enforceable, overly broad, and/or well beyond the scope of the municipality's authority under state or federal law. In an ideal world, such ordinances would be stricken from the books, but since we don't live in an ideal world, many of these laws remain because the municipal council has bigger fish to fry. (FWIW some municipal codes are truly staggering in length and scope, and undoing the useless parts would be a momentous undertaking.) The city staffers who are actually charged with enforcing these ordinances, on the other hand, are often well aware that certain provisions in the municipal code are unworkable, and these sections are often ignored. When in doubt, call and ask.
__________________
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules... MARK IT ZERO!!" - Walter Sobchak
carguychris is online now  
Old January 9, 2011, 03:05 PM   #6
Gbro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 20, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,056
Quote:
FWIW the OP needs to realize a few facts about municipal law.
I am aware of municipal law, I have gone a few rounds with city hall in the past and came out OK.
And I am sorry you look at discharging archery equipment in the same class as discharging grass clipping onto the street.

Quote:
Yet none of the laws poster appear on their face to cover a bow and arrow.
Am I misreading your post??

Just in case you didn't open my link,
Quote:
SEC. 10.20. DANGEROUS WEAPONS AND ARTICLES.
Subd. 1. Definition. "Dangerous weapon" means any
firearm, weather loaded or unloaded, or any device designed as a
weapon and capable of producing death or great bodily harm
,.....
Quote:
And if it's legal in my town, I suspect there must be at least one other municipality in the U.S. where it's legal.
I would like to have more than an opinion on this with all due respect and I have posted where an exception was made because of large outlying city limits.
The intent of my post is to find out if there are municipality where this is a legal act to discharge archery equipment and not scuttlebutt about nobody cares that there is a law restricting such acts.
As an example;
Someone is killed in a incorporated residential neighborhood because William's arrow deflected off the top of his backstop and when clear over the garage striking victim in the back and no charges could be made because there is no law on the books to restrict shooting archery equipment in this municipality.
__________________
Gbro
CGVS
For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, But to us who are being saved, It Is The Power Of God. 1Corinthians 1-18
Gbro is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 06:36 PM   #7
carguychris
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 20, 2007
Location: Richardson, TX
Posts: 5,515
Quote:
And I am sorry you look at discharging archery equipment in the same class as discharging grass clipping onto the street.
According to the city of Hibbing, MN, it's apparently in a similar class, considering that it appears after the section titled "Feeding of Pigeons" and before the "Dog Regulation" and "Cat Regulation" sections.
Quote:
I would like to have more than an opinion on this with all due respect and I have posted where an exception was made because of large outlying city limits... The intent of my post is to find out if there are municipality where this is a legal act to discharge archery equipment and not scuttlebutt about nobody cares that there is a law restricting such acts.
GBro, perhaps it would be better to ask about a particular geographical area. Municipal ordinances vary from state to state according to the powers granted to municipal governments under state law. Cities often follow prewritten model ordinances written to comply with state law, and they frequently copy one another in the same vicinity.

Since you want an example, Richardson, TX does not prohibit archery outside of public parks.

http://library.municode.com/index.as...tateName=Texas

OTOH if you're looking for cities where archery is specifically allowed, you're probably only going to find a handful of them, because American law is generally written under the assumption that private conduct is allowable unless specifically prohibited.
Quote:
As an example;
Someone is killed in a incorporated residential neighborhood because William's arrow deflected off the top of his backstop and when clear over the garage striking victim in the back and no charges could be made because there is no law on the books to restrict shooting archery equipment in this municipality.
This is not a good example because the shooter would probably be charged with reckless endangerment (or, if the shot was fatal, involuntary manslaughter) under state law. The victim could probably also sue the shooter in civil court. Whether or not archery is legal under the local municipal code would have little or nothing to do with it.

Municipal law generally prescribes civil fines or minor misdemeanor charges for actions that create a public nuisance. Behavior that causes direct and grevious harm to another person or their property is generally covered by criminal law, which is usually a state or federal matter.

FWIW Section 10.99 of the Hibbing municipal code states that violations within Chapter 10, including violations of Section 10.20 "Dangerous Weapons and Articles", are misdemeanors.
__________________
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules... MARK IT ZERO!!" - Walter Sobchak

Last edited by carguychris; January 9, 2011 at 06:48 PM.
carguychris is online now  
Old January 9, 2011, 06:37 PM   #8
Aguila Blanca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 6,509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gbro
The intent of my post is to find out if there are municipality where this is a legal act to discharge archery equipment and not scuttlebutt about nobody cares that there is a law restricting such acts.
If that was the intent of your original post, you concealed it well. With all due respect, you made a blanket statement implying that discharge of archery equipment is illegal everywhere within municipal limts. You did NOT ask for examples of where it is legal.

I gave you one example. I won't state where I live because I don't give out that information on the Internet. But ... I do know that shooting archery equipment is not illegal in my town (a "municipality," albeit a small-ish one). In fact, it is also legal to discharge a firearm as long as you are at least 500 feet from any occupied structure not on your own property. But that ordnance applies only to firearms, not bows and arrows.
Aguila Blanca is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 06:58 PM   #9
MLeake
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 15, 2007
Location: Outside KC, MO
Posts: 10,128
I've lived in a few places...

... where neighbors shot bows and arrows with some regularity, in their yards.

Don't know if it was illegal, but they did nothing to hide the activity, and it didn't bother us. Outer suburban areas, reasonably big yards.

But if this is a tie-in to the thread on the guy who got arrested in Lincoln, NE, the video shows their neighborhood as being a postage-stamp yard, mobile-home park type place. I couldn't imagine anybody in their right mind shooting arrows or bolts in that environment, legal or not (and apparently it was not legal).
MLeake is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 09:03 PM   #10
wally626
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 31, 2009
Posts: 635
Yorktown, VA does not prohibit bow and arrow shooting or even guns for that matter on private property. As long as it is done in a safe manner. Up till last year they did restrict firing firearms and air guns in certain subdivisions, but that was repealed this year. Bows were never covered.
wally626 is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 10:25 PM   #11
Gbro
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 20, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,056
Quote:
Yorktown, VA does not prohibit bow and arrow shooting or even guns for that matter on private property.
I corrected my initial post as, Yes it was to broad.
Quote:
incorporated residential neighborhood
I am aware of the lac of restrictions in small un-incorporated community's.
Yorktown is a census-designated place (CDP) in York County, Virginia, United States.
__________________
Gbro
CGVS
For the message of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, But to us who are being saved, It Is The Power Of God. 1Corinthians 1-18
Gbro is offline  
Old January 9, 2011, 11:25 PM   #12
bassfishindoc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 19, 2010
Posts: 166
I live in a neighborhood in a city in TN. I have about a 1/3 of an acre with homes on either side of me. There is a steep incline in my back yard and I have an archery and air rifle target set up on the hill so all pellets and arrows go straight into the hill if I miss the target and it is perfectly legal, I have a cop living two doors down and he occasionally joins me.
__________________
2LT United States Army
NRA Life Member
GOA Life Member
East Tennessee State University Quillen College of Medicine
bassfishindoc is offline  
Old January 10, 2011, 09:16 AM   #13
xMINORxTHREATx
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 25, 2010
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
Posts: 286
I have an acre of land on a long narrow lot, the back of which meets up with the back of a brick building. One side is an open field, the other is a alley way leading back to the brick building. (Movie theater)

My girlfriend and I shoot our bows in the backyard, and my nephew got his first shooting lessons with my old pellet gun back there. I also have a pretty awesome airsoft sniper rifle that I plink around with when my nephew is here. Cops drive by all the time, granted I know most of them on a first name basis, and don't give us a second look. Except when I have the airsoft rifle out. It looks pretty darn real, until you see the bright orange tip on the barrel.

That being said, I've never had a problem with police here in Ohio. In Arizona, I lived next door to the Phoenix PD firing range, and cops drove by all the time while I was shooting my bow there, still no issue.
__________________
Glaine ár gcroí
Neart ár ngéag
Agus beart de réir ár mbriathar
xMINORxTHREATx is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.12926 seconds with 9 queries