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Old October 24, 2010, 11:14 PM   #1
frogsaw
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Dillon's No B.S. Warranty has too much B.S.

I have been a Dillon reloader since 2003 and had great customer service experiences until the last few years. Dillon has and continues to claim that they have a "No B.S. Life Time Warranty" but all that I get from them is more than my fair share of B.S. when it comes to the bullet puller and decapping pins for both rifle and pistol dies.

I, like many others, have had various items made/sold by Dillon break, but when I call them for repair or replacement parts all that I get is grief. I have been told that my breaking of the occasional decapping pin means that I am inexperienced or not doing something right. I don't see how this is a "No B.S. Life Time Warranty"!

Every time I call to speak with their techs I am always approached in a very rude and condescending manner. I have been called a liar and everything else under the sun. During my last call I spoke with a guy claiming to be a manager, his name is escaping me at the moment, and he agreed that the "No B.S. Life Time Warranty" does not provide an exclusion for anything outside of soft cases and electrical motors. The conversation was ended with this manager maintaining that he was not authorized to warranty the decapping pins. I am currently waiting on a call from Mike Dillon himself, but for some reason I don't think that he is going to call.

I am tired of being bullied by a compay that sells products under false pretenses and expects everyone to just set back and take while their competitiors are honoring similar warranties without pushing their warranty so hard in their sales and marketing. I am considering contacting my congressmen and state attorney general to file a complaint. It is my understanding that their unwillingness to uphold the terms of their warranty may actually place them in a very actionable position due to the interstate commerce clause and other regulating legislation. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?

Thanks,

Frogsaw

Last edited by frogsaw; October 24, 2010 at 11:19 PM.
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Old October 25, 2010, 12:05 AM   #2
azredhawk44
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Quote:
Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
That's EXACTLY why Ruger has no warranty at all, officially.

So that they can offer warranty service for most situations, and use discretion in those others that they feel uneasy about.

I've seen Dillon's warranty in action for two friends as well as myself. I don't drink 100% blue kool-aid (my reloading bench has green, red, blue and orange on it), but the stuff I have bought from them has been pleasant to work with. One of my pieces of dillon gear has gone back for a refurb, and I even bought it used. No fee, no questions asked. Just last year.

I think you need to let a friend handle the warranty call for you... you might have a chip on your shoulder by this point and it's coming across during the support call.
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Old October 25, 2010, 07:50 AM   #3
frogsaw
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I appreciate your thoughts, but...

chip, or no chip the warranty is still the warranty. If there is a chip on my shoulder it is due to being treated badly by these people everytime I call. I unlike many on here, have ordered ALL of my Dillon Equipment from Dillon its self or from an authorized Dillon Dealer. Not saying that this makes me a better customer and it deffinately doesn't make me a better shopper, but I did buy my equipment under the "No B.S. Warranty" pretense. No B.S. means NO B.S.! not No B.S. if we like you.

Do you use Dillon Dies? Rifle or Pistol? If so, do you get decapping pins replaced under the warranty? Rifle or Pistol?
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Old October 25, 2010, 08:21 AM   #4
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My suggestion is to join the Enos forum and ask, because a Dillon factory rep watches the Dillon subforum. But here is one thread on decap pins.

All I ever needed Dillon to replace under warranty was a 45acp sizing die which had a ding on the carbide ring. No clue how it happened, but they replaced it before I could even ask.

Lee
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Old October 25, 2010, 08:48 AM   #5
Dave P
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Are you breaking decapping pins on things like mil-crimped rifle cases?


My interpretation of a no BS warranty is that it will not cover items broken by improper usage.
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Old October 25, 2010, 10:36 AM   #6
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+1 on the mil crimp cases question.

I "bit the bullet" and got one of their primer pocket swagers, and I do my initial decap operation of new brass in my stash with a single stage press and a Lee decap-only die. Then I swage the primer pocket and go through the reloading process.

My Dillon is a square deal B. So, I only do pistol reloading on it. I have to use Dillon dies in the SDB.

I have a tool head for a 550, and it is set up with .223 dies (Lee sizer, Lee powder-thru with a Lee powder measure mounted on it, Lee seating die and Lee FCD for .223 at the end). I go over to a friend's house once in a while and use his 550 for a couple hours.
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Old October 25, 2010, 11:17 AM   #7
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No, I am not using brass with crimped primer pockets. I try to stay away from that stuff unless I am loading a special project on my single stage. I also don't use range pickups either, so there is no chance of running into a burdan primed piece of brass either. What I am observing is the shell plate doesn't always receive the headstamp completely causing a misalignment of the decapping assembly. My brass is cleaned and lubed, there is really no reason for this to be happening. It seems like we are getting a little bit off the point. Regardless of how carefull your reloading practices are, you will eventually break a decapping pin. RCBS, Hornady and several others warranty their decapping pins, but Dillon doesn't. That is the issue.
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Old October 25, 2010, 11:58 AM   #8
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Frog, I'd suggest you simply change out the Dillon size/decap die with a Lee one. To put it succinctly, Lee decap pins DO NOT BREAK.

I also get misaligned brass from time to time on my shell plate of my SDB. Usually because the extractor warped the case a bit during extraction on the last firing. On close inspection, there will be a hint of warp to the case head and extraction groove. Most cases like this will not fully insert into the shell plate, which makes it impossible to have the decap pin exit the flash hole.
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Old October 25, 2010, 12:05 PM   #9
frogsaw
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The Lee route is an acceptable alternative, but I have already invested in the Dillion die sets. I shouldn't have to buy another die or die set to avoid this B.S. I appreciate your recommendation.
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Old October 25, 2010, 12:06 PM   #10
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I've been using Dillon equipment since 1989 and I have never had ANY kind of warranty issue with Dillon... Ever. Yeah, you pay a bit more for their equipment, but it just works. It always works. I had a primer early warning buzzer break, they sent me an new housing within 2 days for free. I had a screw hole strip out on the zinc lower housing of the auto priming system, 2 days later I had an entire priming system for free. I dropped a powder measure system and smashed the plastic powder reservoir.. Same thing, got a replacement hopper for free. They have never been anything but courteous and friendly on the phone, they knew the model numbers practically by heart, they didn't try to up sell me anything. They regularly upgrade their designs and are always improving.
Now I'm no fanboy I just use what works. I have (3) 550RL presses and a lee single stage. I just happened to start with Dillon and never had a reason to jump ship. Believe me if I had a reason I would, I'm only as loyal to a company as I perceive they are to me.
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Old October 25, 2010, 12:16 PM   #11
frogsaw
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Call them and ask for a replacement decapping pin for a rifle die... They will tell you that it is not covered. When they tell you this, ask why this information is not covered in their warranty disclaimer, usually on page 4 of the Blue Press, and they won't have an answer. I agree the equipment quality is worth the extra, but the No B.S. Warranty is simply B.S. in regards to decapping pins and select other items such as the kennetic bullet puller. Thanks for you reply.
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Old October 25, 2010, 12:55 PM   #12
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Bad Idea

As suggested by Imccrock, I went to the Brian Enos's Forum and recieved no help. My post was actually deleted shortly after posting. I recieved the following correspondence:

frog,

Your thread has been removed to the Moderator's forum for reference.

As JT correctly pointed out, Brian's forum is not the place to resolve customer service issues. Unfortunately, as the popularity of the forum has grown over the years, it has been seen as an ideal soapbox for consumer issues. That's not what this place is about. We're here primarily to help each other through sharing our experiences with our shooting.

I would add an observation. You stated you were not here just to complain about your experiences with Dillon. That's a hard position to support when you just joined the forums today and within 10 minuted made your first post, which happened to be a complaint about those experiences.

Please refrain from further postings of this nature, and please feel free to stick around, and see for yourself the depth of knowledge that awaits.

Thanks,

Mark R.
BE Forum Moderator

Quote:
My suggestion is to join the Enos forum and ask, because a Dillon factory rep watches the Dillon subforum. But here is one thread on decap pins.

All I ever needed Dillon to replace under warranty was a 45acp sizing die which had a ding on the carbide ring. No clue how it happened, but they replaced it before I could even ask.

Lee
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Old October 25, 2010, 01:10 PM   #13
frogsaw
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I recieved the following correspondence from the BrianEnos forum administrator:

Quote:
frog,

Your thread has been removed to the Moderator's forum for reference.

As JT correctly pointed out, Brian's forum is not the place to resolve customer service issues. Unfortunately, as the popularity of the forum has grown over the years, it has been seen as an ideal soapbox for consumer issues. That's not what this place is about. We're here primarily to help each other through sharing our experiences with our shooting.

I would add an observation. You stated you were not here just to complain about your experiences with Dillon. That's a hard position to support when you just joined the forums today and within 10 minuted made your first post, which happened to be a complaint about those experiences.

Please refrain from further postings of this nature, and please feel free to stick around, and see for yourself the depth of knowledge that awaits.

Thanks,

Mark R.
BE Forum Moderator
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It was suggested by another member that I bring my questions here, as that this is a huge dillon chat location. I agree that I wasted no time posting my question, but that was just that a question.
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frogsaw, on 25 October 2010 - 10:52 AM, said:

It was suggested by another member that I bring my questions here, as that this is a huge dillon chat location. I agree that I wasted no time posting my question, but that was just that a question.

Not just a question.

You spent 4 paragraphs complaining about your interactions with Dillon, made your threats to engage civil action, and then the only question youn asked was whether anyone has any thoughts on this.

Check it at the door, mate. We don't do that here.

Thanks,
...Mark
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Why not do that here? There is nothing but thread after thread of praise of Dillon. It sounds to me like you or someone else related to this forum has their hand in Dillon's pocket. If so this seems very foolish to not try to help resolve this issue and keep it form escalating beyond that which is reasonable. Instead you have chosen to outright confront me as if I am the bad guy. Please remove me from this forum. Thanks
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Old October 25, 2010, 03:37 PM   #14
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Ive always had good luck with the people at dillion, Ive broke pins in the past and simple said "hey I need a pin for ....." and they have always offered to replace it. If you treat them with respect they tend to do very well by their customers.

If you tried decaping Berdan Primed Cases or something like that then your probelly out of luck.

I hope it works out for the OP.
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Old October 25, 2010, 03:49 PM   #15
frogsaw
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I have not tried to decap berdan primed cases, as I stated in a previous post. As I also stated in a previous post, try to get them to send you a decapping pin for a rifle die. See what happens and then let me know. They will tell you the same thing that they have told me. Try it and see. I always treat them with respect.
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Old November 30, 2010, 09:27 PM   #16
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Throw away the decapping die that you have, and buy a Lee decapping die for $10. I believe that's what they cost at MidwayUSA.

I had an RCBS decapping die (not the Dillon, but more costly than the Lee), and I bought extra pins because I broke a few. I was determined to make it work. I finally got fed up and decided to try the Lee. It wasn't worth it to me to keep trying to get the RCBS to work all the time.

With the inexpensive Lee, I've deprimed thousands of cases. I did actually break the decapping rod once, but it was because I forced it on a Berdan primed case to see if the rod would back out under excessive pressure. It didn't.

The rod didn't back out when the pin bottomed out on the bottom of the Berdan primed case because I torqued the nut that holds the top of the decapping rod in the die as hard as I could. That was my mistake. It couldn't back out when it hit the bottom of the case like I thought it would as I continued to apply pressure. The good thing was that I learned how it really worked and it only cost me $2 for the lesson. Since this test, I haven't broken another.

When I feel a Berdan primed case on the down stroke, I ease up and toss the case into my scrap bucket. It's simple. Crimped primers are another story, however. The Lee Universal Decapping die handles them without a problem and pops all of the primers out.

If you want it to just work, try the Lee, and put the other die on the shelf. I've put many thousands of crimped cases of military brass through without a problem.

This works for me, and I wish you good luck!
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Old November 30, 2010, 11:48 PM   #17
rickdavis81
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I've broken decapping pins but they were my fault. I always paid for them myself. I don't think Dillion is in the wrong on the pins but that's just my opinion.
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Old December 1, 2010, 07:39 AM   #18
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I once called up RCBS to get a replacement decapping rod. I could not find it online, I had to make a call to the company to get it. I was willing to pay whatever. They sent me a free rod and a FREE package of pins. That's a no BS warranty. And I bought the die on eBay second hand, with the rod already bent!

Glad I don't own a Dillon, although it is fun to look at the girls on the cover of their Blue Press. I guess I'm just not susceptible to spend money when I see girls in skimpy attire....
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Old December 1, 2010, 09:18 AM   #19
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Decappin pins

I`ve worked on vehicles all my life & I saved some roller bearings from universal joints .

I slip em in & lock em down or epoxy em in the screw on head with the nub pins .

I`ve never broken 1 but have pulled a couple loose .

I`ve never pulled on the blue kool aid lever .

How much can a pack of pins cost ??
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Old December 1, 2010, 12:00 PM   #20
Edward429451
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This is all about the principle of the matter and not a few bucks. If Mike Dillon says No BS Warranty then by God I want em. Right?

But if you expect Dillon to man up and send the pins for free, as a principle, then should your guiding sense of the requirements and obligations of right conduct also guide you to the personal responsibility of breaking your own pins?
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Old December 1, 2010, 08:08 PM   #21
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Folks, go read the Feedback rules posted in the Sticky Posts. I know, sticky posts somehow hide themselves so well that they never are seen...

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