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Old October 25, 2010, 09:20 PM   #1
Rosko Packer
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338 Federal

Hi Gang, been busy and haven't had time to look in on ya.
Got a question about load data (or lack of it) for the 338 Fed. I would think 4007ssc would be worth a try, but I don't see data any where just a good (safe,but not wastful, starting point for 215,225gr etc.). Also, does anyone have opinions on what workes well in the Tikka T3 ?
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Old October 25, 2010, 09:34 PM   #2
TXGunNut
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Why 4007ssc? Hodgdon website has a few loads, be aware that their max loads really are MAX, IMHO. No 4007ssc tho.
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Old October 25, 2010, 10:05 PM   #3
Rosko Packer
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It's easy to move (meter), it has worked very well for me in a couple others (30-06, 243), and I just read an article on the 338RCM where one load was with 4007ssc. It seems to be in the right range, but mostly, I have a small "surplus" of it (no such thing as U know ). I like to test a lot of different combo's looking to stumble on "perfect" (also no such thing ) I purchased bullets that are too heavy (like heavy for cal, but 250 is, I think, way too much for this case,-and maybe twist) As a science guy, I wondered about running ratios of all the powders listed in load data with the 4007, then using that ratio (actually partly from other cartridges such as the ratio of 4064 to 4007 for 338 RUM), then using the ratio to find a start with the 4007 in the Fed. Don't know if that makes sense, but the people who first develope loads must do something similar. I am not them however, and I have other powders. Any loads of suggestions would be appreciated
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Old October 26, 2010, 09:09 PM   #4
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Interesting, RP. I was intrigued by the 338 Fed when it came out, am disappointed that it doesn't seem to be working out. If the powder works in 243 and 30-06 it should be worth a try if you could find good data. Lyman lists loads for H335, it meters quite well IIRC. Dunno why I didn't see tham last night. You referrring to the Lane Pearce article on the ST site?
Agreed about "surplus" powder, same concept as "extra" money.
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Old October 27, 2010, 07:56 AM   #5
Rosko Packer
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I was given a pretty good supply of 30-06 brass of about every stripe (from factory to all types of military). I know that I can form the 338 fed from 06 (have made a couple just to see), I've been told that my necks will be way too thick. Making a single 338 case this way is a lot of effort. It gives a feeling of accomplishment tho, but one more step may be a bit much. I know that 308 cases are the way to go, but I would like to use my 308 brass to load 308. Can you or someone out there give me one of those great tutorials on squeezing brass this way. I made some 8mm Mauser ammo using 06 and didn't know about the over-thick wall. They were accurate but I only made and shot 20.
The article you mentioned is the one I just read. I have the 335 powder too and am making a "batch" today with it. Lyman's lists 40-44.5g with the 215 bullets I have. I have a Tikka Lite synthetic. These in my opinion are fantastic, but at only 6 and a half pounds or so, and even with the so-called light recoiling 338 fed., when you fire it, you know you fired it. This 338 is new and I have only shot a box of 220g Fusion. It shoots like a Tikka (I have others) which is very good (sub 1").

Last edited by Rosko Packer; October 27, 2010 at 08:14 AM.
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Old October 31, 2010, 07:50 AM   #6
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I can't help you on the powder question but you had some interesting comments about your brass re-forming experience.

I re-form 30-06 to 25-06 and 223 to 221 Fireball. In both cases (no pun intended) I prefer to work with military brass with the thicker walls. For the 221 Fireball I have to neck turn the brass to get it to chamber properly in my Rem 700. For the Ruger 25-06 I get better neck/shoulder seal by not neck turning, simply going through the sizing die is all that is needed.

If you measure the OD of a few fired factory brass (fired in your gun of course) it will give you a good idea of you guns chamber without making a casting of it. Assume it shrinks back .002" OD. Measuring the same cases once loaded will tell you how much you are sizing the neck to put tension on the bullet.

You mentioned you had a lot of different kinds of 30-06 brass to work from. I'm sure you are aware they will have different wall thickness. If you measure a few during the re-forming process and compare that to a fired factory case you may find one type that is optimized to your gun.
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Old November 10, 2010, 11:28 AM   #7
Rosko Packer
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necks

I have made 8mm Mauser from 30-06. I made some without any regard to thickness (didn't know better). I must have lucked out?-they shot great, but I only made 20. Question: is the problem with rounds not chambering, or is it other hidden things like accuracy? I have made-up a few 338 Fed by cutting off 30-06,sizing,trimming. I first loaded a couple with no primer or powder, then removed the bullets to see if they were damaged from a too tight neck. These rounds chamber and I will try them when the weather settles down. I sort my brass by brand, and then by weight. I accept 2% weight difference. I think I may have realized what might have been happening when I had some of these "from '06" 243 brass that a few of actually slightly warped the case where the neck and shoulder meet. I put those away (the whole batch,not just the warped ones). I didn't yet do my bullet pull/inspection. maybe when I check those and the pulled bullets I will see that my necks are too thick?
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Old November 10, 2010, 12:15 PM   #8
Brian Pfleuger
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Load Data

QuickLoad suggests that you can barely get enough IMR4007ssc under a 225gr Hornady SP to reach max pressure. A 109.8% compressed charge is predicted to be almost exactly max pressure. Now, there's no way I'd start with a compressed charge, or even close, if it were me. Problem is, a 95% fill of 40.4gr is predicted to produce just 37k psi.

I'm no expert, but I'd be worried about either a flame-out and squib or "secondary explosive effect".

Short Answer: 4007ssc is not really a good choice for the 338 Federal.
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Old November 10, 2010, 12:51 PM   #9
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On the brass, just get some 308 cases and be done with it. On the powder, medium cartridges take medium burn rates. My 338-06 does the best with 4320. I would try RL-15, 4064, 4320, and Varget in the Fed.
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Old November 10, 2010, 10:04 PM   #10
Rosko Packer
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messing around with 30-06 brass is just to see if I can do it as much as anything. Y R right tho, it is way too much work to really do much of.
No one said anything about what "too thick" neck does. Is it only about fitting into the chamber? I have the stuff to load for my 308,25-06,243,270,30-06,338Fed,35 Whelen. I have made all of these from my '06 pile, including using the old milt stuff. I have found great shooting loads with all of these, but I haven't made and shot many of "the" load I find. I wonder now if I have just been lucky with the accuracy (I have some SUPER shooting rifles which I can't take any credit for).
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Old November 10, 2010, 10:22 PM   #11
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As I understand it thick case walls raise chamber pressures. If the case mouth doesn't have room to expand in the chamber to release the bullet the pressures will rise until something gives.
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