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Old August 21, 2010, 02:39 PM   #26
EricReynolds
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Magnum PI: I say yes for the simple fact if the bad guy has a partner, you may be in for further problems. BUT...I don't about anyone else, but if I get up to investigate a noise in the middle of the night, I don't bring an extra clip. (maybe I should) I wouldn't take my eyes off the guy to run back to my room for a magazine. Your thoughts?
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Old August 21, 2010, 02:55 PM   #27
cole k
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This has been an interesting discussion.
I’m not a LEO. My training was military.
I was trained to reload at the first opportunity.
I carry a J-frame either in my pocket or IWB and 2-4 speed strips.
I’ve felt a need to carry more than 15-25 rounds.
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Old August 21, 2010, 02:59 PM   #28
Six_Rounds
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In the above home break in scenario, I would have had my 6 shot .38 in hand. a reload would have been left in the drawer the gun was in, because I wouldn't have likely had pants with pockets on. With 4 of my 6 shots gone, fetching the reload would be tempting. I would most likely call on the other members of my family to call the police, and maybe quickly bring me my reload.
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Old August 21, 2010, 11:05 PM   #29
Hook686
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WC145 wrote:

Quote:
These are just a few examples that I have pics available for of some of my off duty carry stuff. On duty it's at least two spare reloads, a BUG, two knives, and a rifle in the truck. There is no excuse for not being prepared. Step up and put in the effort to equip yourselves, at least minimally, there's no excuse for not being ready. It's only your lives in the balance, no big deal. Right?
Very pretty rigs you have there WC145. Let's see: 1)strap your left arm in a sling tied to your belt, 2) strap your two legs together just above the knees, 3) put a patch over your left eye, and 4) put a mitten on your left hand. Now have someone do a viseo of you reloading your pistol, then post it for me on this site (or a link). I'm really interested in your technique for accomplishing that which I find pointless to even worry about.

I am serious. I belong to a gun club. I go to the range. I take the CCW class three times a year. I did three gun at the club for a while, until my reloading was decided to be too risky. None of the club trainers came up with a workable solution for me. The best I could do was pop the cylinder of a revolver, prop the revolver with open cylinder on my foot after emptying the cases by pushing the ejector rod with the heel of my left hand, then inserting a reload using a speed loader that I got out of a holder on my belt, right side just behind my cell phone and the pocket that holds my revolver. It gets a little crowded on the right hip.

I'd sure like to see your video.
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Old August 22, 2010, 12:19 AM   #30
ClydeFrog
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X, tactical training, pistol reloading, tactics...

X:
This topic is a good example of why formal skill training or learning proper methods is so important.
If you can afford it or if you can arrange it, real in-depth classes or workshops with top instructors is worth the $$$. You not only get practical skills for dealing with a violent attack or critical event but documented training can support your acts in later court actions or law enforcement investigations.

To the point of a pistol reload, I'd suggest a plan to do a magazine reload ASAP when you fire at a violent felon. In a real gunfight, you may or may not know how many rounds you fired. To know 100% sure, that you have 13 rounds is better than a pistol mag with 8-10 rounds.

I'd add that for spare carry magazines, you may want to use Federal EFMJ(expanding full metal jacket) rounds or the Corbon PowRball load.
FMJ rounds can go slightly deeper in common barriers like glass, plywood, metal etc. These rounds feed & cycle great too.
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Old August 22, 2010, 09:30 AM   #31
WC145
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Quote:
Very pretty rigs you have there WC145. Let's see: 1)strap your left arm in a sling tied to your belt, 2) strap your two legs together just above the knees, 3) put a patch over your left eye, and 4) put a mitten on your left hand. Now have someone do a viseo of you reloading your pistol, then post it for me on this site (or a link). I'm really interested in your technique for accomplishing that which I find pointless to even worry about.

I am serious. I belong to a gun club. I go to the range. I take the CCW class three times a year. I did three gun at the club for a while, until my reloading was decided to be too risky. None of the club trainers came up with a workable solution for me. The best I could do was pop the cylinder of a revolver, prop the revolver with open cylinder on my foot after emptying the cases by pushing the ejector rod with the heel of my left hand, then inserting a reload using a speed loader that I got out of a holder on my belt, right side just behind my cell phone and the pocket that holds my revolver. It gets a little crowded on the right hip.

I'd sure like to see your video.
Well, your sarcastic video idea/comment is foolish and if you think a reload is pointless, fine, do or don't do whatever you want. Personally, I always carry a reload, we train on different methods of reloading one handed and I practice them. When I carry two guns I carry one on each side so that I can access a gun with either hand. My BUG is a revolver modified to use moonclips in order to make loading/unloading easier.

My stance on the original question is still the same -
Carry a spare reload so you have it if you need it. If you fire your gun, reload at the first safe opportunity, whether you fire one round or empty it.

If you choose not to carry a reload that's up to you, however, keep in mind that the magazine is the weak link in any magazine fed weapon, and if you have to face another adversary you're better off doing it with a fully loaded gun.
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Old August 22, 2010, 02:27 PM   #32
Don P
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I still don't see the point of dropping a mag with rounds left in it.
My point and question is this, after doing a re-load say you fire 3 rounds. Now what are you going to drop the mag and insert the original? Why do mag changes when unnecessary? What are you going to do if per say you drop the fully loaded mag after dropping the mag from the gun?
I have seen many a shooter in IDPA drop mags, fumbling with them trying to do a re-load WITH NO ONE SHOOTING BACK!
I still say stay in the fight and shoot to slide lock, then re-load. Why run the risk of screwing up a re-load with rounds still left in the mag.
All I can see is a ton of stress causing problems with doing a unnecessary re-load. Just my opinion and that is what the OP is asking for.
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Old August 22, 2010, 03:01 PM   #33
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don P
...I have seen many a shooter in IDPA drop mags, fumbling with them trying to do a re-load WITH NO ONE SHOOTING BACK!...
That's what training and practice is all about.
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Old August 22, 2010, 03:40 PM   #34
EricReynolds
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The first time I heard of reloading when I still have rounds in the clip, I also thought "what's the point?" There is a very sound reason behind it though. You only do this if there is a lull in any activity. If I have 15 rounds and I fire 4 shots, I want to be at optimum readiness before I need to re-engage. I don't want to be 1 shot short after 11 shots. If I can pick a moment to re-load, it's a much better option than having the moment I need to reload picked for me...
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Old August 22, 2010, 10:59 PM   #35
WC145
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Quote:
I still don't see the point of dropping a mag with rounds left in it.
My point and question is this, after doing a re-load say you fire 3 rounds. Now what are you going to drop the mag and insert the original? Why do mag changes when unnecessary? What are you going to do if per say you drop the fully loaded mag after dropping the mag from the gun?
I have seen many a shooter in IDPA drop mags, fumbling with them trying to do a re-load WITH NO ONE SHOOTING BACK!
I still say stay in the fight and shoot to slide lock, then re-load. Why run the risk of screwing up a re-load with rounds still left in the mag.
All I can see is a ton of stress causing problems with doing a unnecessary re-load. Just my opinion and that is what the OP is asking for.
You don't drop a partially loaded mag and walk away from it, when you're fighting/shooting, you fire to slide lock then reload, if the action stops and it's safe you reload with a full mag and retain the partially loaded mag.
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Old August 22, 2010, 11:46 PM   #36
Amin Parker
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Gun fights are complicated and no 2 are the same.

If you are in a line of work that will get you the attention of criminals then you should have multiple weapons as well as spare mags.

Our family business generates up to $us100 000 a day in turnover, 99% in cash and is in a terribly dangerous area in South Africa so we have seen lots of action.

There have been 8 attempts and we won everytime. Bad guys over here usually have some sort of military training so they not the usuall drug addict. One has to be smart to win.

That being said, when i am not doing things that could attract the attention of criminals like going to a restaurant, i will usually only carry a 38 snub, no gang is gonna use their resources to attack one guy sitting in a restaurant. One or 2 low level wanna be bad guys maybe, not a gang.

If you fire 3or4 shots keep the mag in your gun. A tactical reload, while it makes sense only opens the risk of fumbling and having to pick up your mags from the ground. What happens if the base plate splits and the rounds, spring and follower fly all over the place?
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Old August 25, 2010, 08:14 AM   #37
Don P
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Quote:
You don't drop a partially loaded mag and walk away from it, when you're fighting/shooting, you fire to slide lock then reload, if the action stops and it's safe you reload with a full mag and retain the partially loaded mag.
Let me rephrase my writing. I did not mean to insinuate that the removed magazine be left behind. My point as you stated is shoot to slide lock.

Quote:
That's what training and practice is all about.
Absolutely correct and have seen experienced shooters at the Master and Grandmaster level screw up a re-load. My point being it can happen to anyone any time regardless of the amount of practice and training one does

Quote:
This has been an interesting discussion.
I’m not a LEO. My training was military.
I was trained to reload at the first opportunity.
I carry a J-frame either in my pocket or IWB and 2-4 speed strips.
I’ve felt a need to carry more than 15-25 rounds.
Now I'll ask when would you re-load, say after 2 rounds, 3 rounds? Now you would have loose rounds not in speed strips. Just curious
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Old August 25, 2010, 07:39 PM   #38
Glenn Dee
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IMO... No matter what the capacity of my firearm I always carry at least one reload. My Auto carry gun's are either a Glock 23, or a Styer M40. I carry the reload more in case of a malfunction. I most often carry a 5 shot J frame smith, or once in a while a K frame smith... With the revolvers I carry two reloads because of the limited capacity of revolvers.

I am sure that most gunfight's happen within 10 feet, and about three shots are fired. I said MOST. I also know that sometimes it can be closer, or further. And that I may need more ammo. For me extra ammo is as easy to carry as not.

One can never have too many BB's. (Lee)

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Old August 25, 2010, 08:18 PM   #39
B.N.Real
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With ten rounds or more in the pipe,I fail to see why you would take the time to disarm yourself temporarily to reload a gun that is still very loaded.

You could be in the middle of reloading and the bad guy was just waiting for you to stop shooting him to kill you.

Just my opinion.
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Old August 25, 2010, 08:40 PM   #40
Hard Ball
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"is it worth reloading with a different magazine?"


Yes it is.
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Old August 25, 2010, 10:25 PM   #41
Terry A
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Quote:
If you remember the basics: you'll get along OK.

If you are not moving, . . . shoot or reload

If you are not reloading, . . . shoot or move

If you are not shooting, . . . move or reload

It's kinda the unwritten process by which you can keep your body more or less in one piece. Murphy can still get a piece of you, . . . but he has to work harder if you follow the above.

In your instance, it is inferred that the bg is down and bleeding, . . . you are waiting for the cavalry to arrive, . . . reload AND move away from the bg. Also observe 360 threat scan for his compadres.

May God bless,
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Great post Dwight, as per usual!
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