.357 Gold Dot Short Barrel

madmag · December 16, 2009, 02:59 PM

I just purchased some Gold Dot .357 mag. 135g Short Barrel ammo. I am a little surprised at the ballasitcs...not disappoointed...just surprised. The table shows the velocity at 990 fps. and muzzle energy at 294 ft. lbs. This is with a vented 2" test barrel. I will be using my Speed Six with 2-3/4" un-vented barrel, so I should get higher velocity & energy.

Anyway, that's lower velocity than I expected for a .357 mag. I guess you could call these down-loaded for .357 mag. But this is about right for me. I wanted ammo hotter than .38 +p for my Speed Six, so this fits the bill.

I have not been to the range to test yet. Anyone shoot this stuff from a snub? Notice any difference in recoil?

Otis311 · December 16, 2009, 03:16 PM

they use a powder to reduce muzzle flash/blast. also the cavities in the bullets are huge to make up for the slower velocities.

mavracer · December 16, 2009, 03:23 PM

Quote:

I will be using my Speed Six with 2-3/4" un-vented barrel, so I should get higher velocity & energy.

when they say vented they vent the test Bbl to simulate cylinder gap.
maybe, maybe not with revolvers there's more to velocity than Bbl length.cyl gap plays a big part.I've also seen some velocity results that defy explination.

I've shot some they're pretty close to 1000fps and recoil accordingly.IMHO they recoil less than the 38+p FBI load.

madmag · December 16, 2009, 03:41 PM

Quote:

they use a powder to reduce muzzle flash/blast. also the cavities in the bullets are huge to make up for the slower velocities.

Quote:

IMHO they recoil less than the 38+p FBI load.

Thanks to both. Good information.

MrTuffPaws · December 16, 2009, 03:42 PM

I've shot a box of the Speer SB GDJHP 357 out of my 327NG and was wholly unimpressed. It is nothing more than glorified 38 special +P IMO.

Speer's standar 357 GD isn't that much worse in flash and recoil, and it is super sonic as well with around 1200 fps out of a 2.5 inch barrel.

madmag · December 16, 2009, 03:44 PM

Quote:

It is nothing more than glorified 38 special +P IMO.

OK, That's kinda what I want. Glorified being just a little hotter than normal.

20nickels · December 16, 2009, 04:27 PM

^^^ at least you don't have to clean the .38 carbon rings out of yer .357 cylinder.

madmag · December 16, 2009, 04:37 PM

Quote:

at least you don't have to clean the .38 carbon rings out of yer .357 cylinder.

I forgot that one....truly a pain at times.

Jim March · December 16, 2009, 05:07 PM

I shot the Speer 135s in both 38+P and 357 side by side one time in the same gun. "Only slightly hotter" sums it up well but as a bonus, the 357 version was throwing 2" groups at 25yds off sandbags, the 38+P around 3". So that's cool. The projectiles themselves looked identical to me. Speer claims there's a slight difference to tune them for their respective speed ranges but if so it's pretty subtle.

Ruger barrels tend to "spit fast" versus a Taurus or a vintage S&W. The newer S&Ws have caught up. So there's a fair chance you'll break 1,050fps and drive them just barely supersonic from your Ruger, or you might not. Probably not...hard to say.

These aren't at all bad loads, they're very useful for some situations. Just don't take the "357" part very seriously

.

The next step up in mild 357s would be Cor-Bon's DPX 125gr. It's based on the Barnes all-copper hollowpoint and is pricey but has a rep for excellent accuracy and expansion. It should break 1,200fps in your gun, so overall energy is a tad higher. Still won't be a wrist-breaker.

Past that, Winchester's 145gr Silvertip will be about the same speed as the Cor-bon, so energy is up a bit more. Still not "full house". The projectile is a bit dated but still seems to work pretty well.

B. Lahey · December 16, 2009, 06:07 PM

Quote:

So there's a fair chance you'll break 1,050fps and drive them just barely supersonic from your Ruger

So do you live on a mountain or a cold location?

The speed of sound at sea level, with the temperature in the 70s is closer to 1,200fps.

j-framer · December 16, 2009, 07:44 PM

Like Jim, I have fired Speer's .38 +P and the .357 (both "short barrel" loads) from the same gun, in my case the stainless S&W 640.

For me, the .357 SB is the perfect snubby load. Recoil is right at the limit of what I can tolerate while still shooting quickly and accurately. For what it's worth, however, I also have full confidence in the .38 +P SB to do the job - it's a pretty brisk load in its own right.

To add to Jim's list of "mild" candidates for .357 carry, don't forget the Remington 125-grain Golden Saber.

Jim March · December 16, 2009, 10:00 PM

huh? Ummm...OK...now I gotta look it up...

Ah. OK, I see what I did. At 0deg. F. the speed is 1,050fps. It goes up by temp all right - at 70f it's 1,128fps per:

http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-speedsound.htm

According to him, altitude (mostly?) doesn't matter, although of course at some point it must when you get close enough to outer space.

Huh.

Well that's...hmmm...nice. I means we can run higher velocity than I thought without hitting the sound barrier.

Model-P · December 16, 2009, 10:15 PM

Quote:

I shot the Speer 135s in both 38+P and 357 side by side one time in the same gun. "Only slightly hotter" sums it up well but as a bonus, the 357 version was throwing 2" groups at 25yds off sandbags, the 38+P around 3".

Jim, couldn't the loss in accuracy be attributed to shooting .38 Special in a .357. .38s are always more accurate in a .38.

madmag · December 16, 2009, 10:21 PM

Quote:

To add to Jim's list of "mild" candidates for .357 carry, don't forget the Remington 125-grain Golden Saber.

I just looked it up. Good choice. I have Golden Saber in other calibers. I think will get some of the .357 125g next time.

Now for hotter stuff to use in my 4" GP100 I am OK. I have everything from 110g to 185g loads that are in the mid 500 ft. lbs.

Anyway, good replies. Makes me think I made a good choice. I feel pretty good about carrying the .357 Short Barrel ammo in my Speed Six....Thanks, and thanks to those with the first hand shooting information.

rantingredneck · December 16, 2009, 10:47 PM

madmag,

My 2.25" SP101 and 3" GP100's love the Gold Dot short barrel .357's. They shoot nice and recoil is not enough to beat you up on quick pairs. Seems like plenty of oomph for a good carry load.

RR

Jim March · December 16, 2009, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Jim, couldn't the loss in accuracy be attributed to shooting .38 Special in a .357. .38s are always more accurate in a .38.

Sure. Shells that fit your chamber work better. The point is, Speer has given us that option.

madmag · December 16, 2009, 11:33 PM

Quote:

My 2.25" SP101 and 3" GP100's love the Gold Dot short barrel .357's.

Yet another reason to think my 2-3/4" Speed Six will also love them. Thanks.

December 16, 2009, 02:59 PM	#1
madmag Senior Member Join Date: February 7, 2007 Location: The South Posts: 3,361	.357 Gold Dot Short Barrel I just purchased some Gold Dot .357 mag. 135g Short Barrel ammo. I am a little surprised at the ballasitcs...not disappoointed...just surprised. The table shows the velocity at 990 fps. and muzzle energy at 294 ft. lbs. This is with a vented 2" test barrel. I will be using my Speed Six with 2-3/4" un-vented barrel, so I should get higher velocity & energy. Anyway, that's lower velocity than I expected for a .357 mag. I guess you could call these down-loaded for .357 mag. But this is about right for me. I wanted ammo hotter than .38 +p for my Speed Six, so this fits the bill. I have not been to the range to test yet. Anyone shoot this stuff from a snub? Notice any difference in recoil?

December 16, 2009, 03:16 PM	#2
Otis311 Member Join Date: November 12, 2009 Posts: 57	they use a powder to reduce muzzle flash/blast. also the cavities in the bullets are huge to make up for the slower velocities. Last edited by Otis311; December 16, 2009 at 03:23 PM.

December 16, 2009, 04:27 PM	#7
20nickels Senior Member Join Date: July 2, 2007 Posts: 274	^^^ at least you don't have to clean the .38 carbon rings out of yer .357 cylinder. __________________ Hillary is a bum.

December 16, 2009, 05:07 PM	#9
Jim March Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 1999 Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA Posts: 5,366	I shot the Speer 135s in both 38+P and 357 side by side one time in the same gun. "Only slightly hotter" sums it up well but as a bonus, the 357 version was throwing 2" groups at 25yds off sandbags, the 38+P around 3". So that's cool. The projectiles themselves looked identical to me. Speer claims there's a slight difference to tune them for their respective speed ranges but if so it's pretty subtle. Ruger barrels tend to "spit fast" versus a Taurus or a vintage S&W. The newer S&Ws have caught up. So there's a fair chance you'll break 1,050fps and drive them just barely supersonic from your Ruger, or you might not. Probably not...hard to say. These aren't at all bad loads, they're very useful for some situations. Just don't take the "357" part very seriously . The next step up in mild 357s would be Cor-Bon's DPX 125gr. It's based on the Barnes all-copper hollowpoint and is pricey but has a rep for excellent accuracy and expansion. It should break 1,200fps in your gun, so overall energy is a tad higher. Still won't be a wrist-breaker. Past that, Winchester's 145gr Silvertip will be about the same speed as the Cor-bon, so energy is up a bit more. Still not "full house". The projectile is a bit dated but still seems to work pretty well. __________________ Jim March

December 16, 2009, 10:00 PM	#12
Jim March Senior Member Join Date: February 14, 1999 Location: Pittsburg, CA, USA Posts: 5,366	huh? Ummm...OK...now I gotta look it up... Ah. OK, I see what I did. At 0deg. F. the speed is 1,050fps. It goes up by temp all right - at 70f it's 1,128fps per: http://www.sengpielaudio.com/calculator-speedsound.htm According to him, altitude (mostly?) doesn't matter, although of course at some point it must when you get close enough to outer space. Huh. Well that's...hmmm...nice. I means we can run higher velocity than I thought without hitting the sound barrier. __________________ Jim March

December 16, 2009, 03:42 PM	#5
MrTuffPaws Member Join Date: January 7, 2008 Posts: 74	I've shot a box of the Speer SB GDJHP 357 out of my 327NG and was wholly unimpressed. It is nothing more than glorified 38 special +P IMO. Speer's standar 357 GD isn't that much worse in flash and recoil, and it is super sonic as well with around 1200 fps out of a 2.5 inch barrel.

December 16, 2009, 07:44 PM	#11
j-framer Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2006 Posts: 358	Like Jim, I have fired Speer's .38 +P and the .357 (both "short barrel" loads) from the same gun, in my case the stainless S&W 640. For me, the .357 SB is the perfect snubby load. Recoil is right at the limit of what I can tolerate while still shooting quickly and accurately. For what it's worth, however, I also have full confidence in the .38 +P SB to do the job - it's a pretty brisk load in its own right. To add to Jim's list of "mild" candidates for .357 carry, don't forget the Remington 125-grain Golden Saber.

December 16, 2009, 10:47 PM	#15
rantingredneck Senior Member Join Date: January 12, 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 4,333	madmag, My 2.25" SP101 and 3" GP100's love the Gold Dot short barrel .357's. They shoot nice and recoil is not enough to beat you up on quick pairs. Seems like plenty of oomph for a good carry load. RR __________________ NRA Member NC Hunter's Education Instructor