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Old March 21, 2009, 05:24 AM   #51
gc70
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I have racked my brain trying to think of firearm regulations I believe would actually work. I am not talking about tougher consequences for illegal actions, but bans or restrictions that might slow down the flow of illegal guns.
The problem with a floor on gun prices is that it would increase, rather than decrease, the flow of illegal guns. Pick a number - $250, $500, $1,000 - as a floor price and it will limit legal sales of new guns percieved as not being worth that amount. But there are plenty of Lorcins, Ravens, and other inexpensive guns already in the marketplace that will simply be sold illegally. Even without the existing supply of inexpensive guns, there are plenty of cheap guns around the world that could, and would, be illegally imported to meet the demand.
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Old March 21, 2009, 07:47 AM   #52
Mike Irwin
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Thoughts?

You mean have the government step in and set price controls on the sales price of new firearms?

Doesn't anyone ever take "If the government is the answer, it was a stupid question" to heart?
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Old March 25, 2009, 05:09 PM   #53
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the problem with a floor on gun prices is that it would increase, rather than decrease, the flow of illegal guns.
Living in a country with very strict guns laws AND high prices for firearms, I totally agree with this. It is significantly cheaper to buy illegal black market stuff than it is to get anything legally here.

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The anti-gun crowd sees a compromise as a situation in which gun owners give up some more rights willingly, and the anti-gun side simply takes more control of the issue. Their aim is to remove guns from society, not allow easier access to full auto weapons.
True also, we only have bolt action and single shot left, and they anti-gun lobby wants them removed as well. Doesn't affect the criminals in the slightest of course.. Pre-firearms ban, prices were significantly cheaper.

From Australia looking over to America, they cant take away your guns because you have your right to bear arms, but they can sure as heck overprice them to stop you buying them legally.
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Old March 27, 2009, 11:14 AM   #54
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Doesn't affect the criminals in the slightest of course.. Pre-firearms ban, prices were significantly cheaper.

no matter what kinda of "control" you put on firearms themselves, this quote from Telgriff, will always prove to be true. they are called criminals for a reason, they break the law. a minimum price will only serve to fuel the illegal gun market, IMHO. criminals will always have their ways of getting guns, be it through gun runners, b&e or whatever means necessary. a minimum price they will never have to deal with.

Last edited by Glenn E. Meyer; March 27, 2009 at 01:01 PM. Reason: Irrelevant
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Old March 27, 2009, 11:34 AM   #55
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I may be wrong (I often am) but I have the impression that some law enforcement officials believe that criminals actually use certain kinds of guns. That is, there are "good guns" and there are "bad guns." That's where the Saturday night special idea comes from. I think I recall a quote referring to a Colt Detective Special where a policeman said they are never involved in shootings. True or not, such photos I've seen of police firearms rooms suggest that all kinds of handguns are used in crime, even including stag handled single actions.

Even if we can't do anything to keep the bad guys from getting their hands on guns (even stag handled ones), perhaps we could do something about good people shooting one another. Then perhaps we could do something about people ignoring the speed limit. Do you suppose raising the speed limit is the answer?
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Old March 27, 2009, 08:53 PM   #56
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FYI

Police evidence "gun rooms" hold guns involved in crimes, not just guns used in the commission of a crime. If your guns are stolen, and then recovered, they will be in the evidence room, until final disposition of the case. In some cases, this can take (literally), years. Your stag handled single action might be phototgraphed many times over months/years while waiting for final disposition. You might get it back, you might not, depending on the jurisidiction, and the judges.

It might wind up in the evidence room because little Jimmy had a bad day and sent a threatening e-mail to someone. Or because Cousin Freddy was in your garage when he sold dope to an undercover cop. Or many other reasons. A gun's use in the hands of a criminal during the commission of a crime is just one of the ways they get into the evidence locker. But, as you noted, the pictures do suggest that.

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perhaps we could do something about good people shooting one another.
No need. Outside of actual accidents (which are rare), good people don't shoot one another.
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Old March 27, 2009, 10:34 PM   #57
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When I lived in Illinois, I had an FOID card, so my purchases could be tracked more easily. In California, there was a very long waiting period. In Tennessee, it was a shorter waiting period. In Michigan, until recently, I had to get permission from my local police dept. to purchase a handgun, buy it, return it to the police dept., and wait for a "safety check" to be performed. Now, I merely have to ask, "Please, Sir, may I have some more?" I must also keep my permit-to-purchase paperwork with me for at least a month, even if I don't have the weapon with me, or so I have been "advised."

This reminds me of a story, which I will attempt to relate, probably poorly:
During WWII, a priest was lamenting, "When they came for the Communists, I didn't speak up. When they came for the homosexuals, I didn't speak up. When they came for the Gypsies, Masons, and Jews, I didn't speak up. Now that they've come for me, there's no one left to speak up."

You see, we may not all agree with one another about revolvers v. semi-autos, or 9mm v. .45ACP, or stainless v. blue. We come from different backgrounds, faiths, and philosophies. We can all agree on this, though: WHETHER IT'S A GUN, OR A BOOK, OR A THOUGHT, WHEN SOMEONE TAKES IT AWAY FROM ONE OF US, IT IS TAKEN FROM ALL OF US!

A little over-the-top? Maybe, but totalitarianism seeps in through the cracks of the democracy in which the ruled are distracted when their basic freedoms are being confiscated, rendering them defenseless. See what happened in the last century in Europe and Asia as they were caught between the hammer of communism and the anvil of facism.

OK, the soapbox is straining from the weight, so I guess I'm finished.
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Old March 27, 2009, 10:46 PM   #58
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What kind of elitist jerk would want to make it more difficult or impossible for people on a limited budget to be able to exersise thier Constitutional Right to keep and bear arms, and their God-given right to self-protection?

Maybe we should also limit the First Amendment Rights of the unwashed masses. Let's require that no newspaper be sold for less than $5 an issue, and make typewriters, TVs, radios, and computers all require an expensive annual license.
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Old March 28, 2009, 05:33 PM   #59
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Leave the Free Market alone. It works.

Having a minimum price on anything does not work. Just like raising the minimum wage, everything else goes up with it.

And by the way who would get the remaining $200 when someone pays $300 for a $100 gun? Uncle Sam? They sure need some more of our money.
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Old March 29, 2009, 03:18 PM   #60
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The trouble with free markets and free trade is that they aren't free. The trouble with capitalism is that it is for enriching capitalists. Where does that leave the rest of us.
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Old March 29, 2009, 05:17 PM   #61
raimius
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Nope, there are those (law-abiding) people who want a firearm, but either cannont or will not pay for an mid-high priced one. It is not our place to determine how much disposable income one should have in order to have access to firearms.
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Old April 5, 2009, 11:03 PM   #62
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Its funny i have been using high-point for many years now and prefer them to many higher priced firearms they also have reached in the 250.00-300.00 range for the carbines yet they still sell, i think this minimum is a bad idea ill-concieved gun restrictions especially ones like this only hurt the good law abiding citizens. why put stricter laws on us when it would be smarter to put stricter punishment on those who brake the law, which are really the only legit reason people ever come up with regarding harsher gun control laws is that it will take guns off the streets when it simply isn't true it will take them out of the houses of the good true law abiding red blooded americans who have every right and deserve to have them.
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Old April 6, 2009, 07:02 AM   #63
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Old April 6, 2009, 04:29 PM   #64
johnwilliamson062
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I didn't realize this was still being kicked around.

Quote:
but I think there's some pertinence to the idea of a floor on gun prices will affect the market in a way that the manufacturers can be damaged
Well, yeah, Hi-point would go out of business. The guns already in that range with a higher quality would probably see a rise in sales.

Quote:
So what you're saying is that poor people shouldn't be allowed the means to defend themselves.
No I am not saying this. I am saying that the bleeding heart liberals who want gun control don't give a crap about anyone second amendment rights and have long been pushing the poor people into this country to be reliant upon them for everything. You think they don't want to add protection to that list? Saying it is infringing on their 2A rights won't get us anywhere at all.
I know quite a few people who own firearms who have minimum wage or slightly higher jobs. In y experience they all own medium grade firearms. Taurus, Mossberg, etc. Actually the only people I know who own hi-points are people who own multiple firearms like myself and keep them for cheap guns they don't have to worry about.

Some shady contractor is trying to rip off one of my clients, GTG.
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