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Old March 7, 2009, 07:40 PM   #1
BMARM4
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Colt Gold Cup Really Bad Throw

I was out target shooting today with my .45s. During my session with my Colt Gold Cup, I was hit under my left eye with a case extraction. I was hit hard enough to draw some pretty good blood. My stance was a two handed triangle grip with the gun out directly in front of my eyes. The shell flew straight back, caught me under the left eye, and ended up bouncing off my face landing in front of my position. And yes, I was wearing eye protection.

After gathering my composure, I finished off the magazine with no further malfunctions. I noticed the pattern of the other cases was where it should be, right and to the rear.

My question is, what would cause such a dangerous malfunction. Is this a sign of the extractor going bad? There has been nothing done to the stock gun.
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Old March 7, 2009, 08:24 PM   #2
Casimer
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I honestly don't know. From what you're describing, it seems like the case would have to fly back over the rear of the slide at an acute angle both vertically and laterally.

Did the case show any damage to the head? - some reason that the ejector may not have caught it? Is there any deformation of the ejector nose?

What I'm wondering is whether the case was extracted but then pushed up by the subsequent round - rather than ejected - so that it flew rearward when it was hit by the hood as the pistol returned to battery.
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Old March 8, 2009, 08:39 AM   #3
BMARM4
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I examined the case to see if there was any damage or deformation. There was none. I'll examine the extractor and the ejection port more closely today.
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Old March 8, 2009, 09:02 AM   #4
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If it only happened once, I would think the case partially or completely pulled free of the extractor claw before the the case contacted the ejector.
The cause of this may very well be the case itself or the round the case came from.
If it's gun related, check the extractor to see if it's clocking and check the extractor for proper tension.
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Old March 8, 2009, 09:48 AM   #5
kraigwy
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You can adjust the extraction of brass by changing/adjusting the ammo, and/or the recoil spring.

In my Gold Cup, I went to 200 grain SWCs. I use a fairly moderate spring and the brass just seems to roll out and lay at my feet.

If all your brass except one, went to where you wanted it, then the one had to be loaded a bit differant, probably a bit hotter.

I would bet the offending round was a flyer on your target too.
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Old March 8, 2009, 09:51 AM   #6
Alleykat
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Since it only happened once, chances are the OP limpwristed once.
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Old March 8, 2009, 05:49 PM   #7
digisol
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Recoil spring, or old worn rim
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Old March 8, 2009, 06:55 PM   #8
Dfariswheel
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This was probably just an anomaly.
In other words, stuff occasionally happens for no particular reason.
If it continues to happen, then you should have the gun looked at by a pro gunsmith.

This is also why you wear safety glasses when shooting.
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Old March 8, 2009, 07:25 PM   #9
Tom2
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Can't you affect the ejection pattern with the extractor, by reshaping the hook? For that matter, does the hook of the extractor look odd? Any debris or crud built up in it's cavity?
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Old March 8, 2009, 09:28 PM   #10
oldcspsarge
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Sounds not untypical of a stock Goldcup.

Recommended actions:
Complete disassemble of slide and remove extractor. Clean it and the inside of the bore where the extractor sits inside
with a Q-tip with cleaning solvent. You will probably be suprised with the gunk you remove.

I would replace the recoil spring with a Wolff 18.5# spring.

Reassemble and test fire.
If brass coming back toward the shooter, next step is to replace the ejector. Stock ejector is really set-up for 185 SWC target loads.
Put a new Commander length ejector in and you will find the brass is gone much earlier in the cycle...out to the right of the shooter .

Try these simple steps and you should be good to go.
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Old March 9, 2009, 08:05 AM   #11
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When it comes to recoil springs the 16.5 will work fine with 45 loads, including the +P loads.
I ran a 16.5 recoil spring when I was shooting my heavy pin loads that were making a 218.5 power factor, my pin loads were like a +P+ load.
If a 1911 is ejecting brass to far there's better ways to solve the problem then over springing the gun with a heavy recoil spring.

Now as for the issue with the Gold Cup, the stock ejector should work just fine with a polished & tuned extractor. I would start with 24 ounces of tension on the extractor, add more if needed.
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Old March 9, 2009, 09:07 PM   #12
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Thanks for all the replies and help. I'll keep an eye on it, hopefully not literally this time, and see if it happens again.
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Old March 10, 2009, 10:23 AM   #13
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A heavier recoil spring will exacerbate the problem.
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Old March 10, 2009, 11:08 PM   #14
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Quote:
Did the case show any damage to the head?
His head..

Quote:
I'll keep an eye on it
That may not help, those suckers move fast.


All joking aside. You can guess what I do for a living by my name... It's great to hear that you had adequate eye protection in place. I couldn't work without my peepers.

Still though, that had to hurt and will probably bother you whenever you shoot that gun. I'm puzzled by how it could happen unless the slide clipped the case somehow. My XDm put a case on the back of my neck recently, waking me right up. It was really odd since it usually throws them 10 feet to the right and 4 feet back. I just figured the slide kicked it in the rear.
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Old March 13, 2009, 03:52 PM   #15
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Me To

THAT IS WHY YOU WEAR SAFTY GLASSES
I have a 45 caliber 70 series, a standard model (not a gold cup) I wish. That every now and then, at least once out of a 10 round string would hit me in the face with an empty . It would also flip emptys down my shirt. I was shooting fairly light loads. I tried different spring weights a new extractor nothing seemed to change it's ways. I finaly went to a ejector for a 9mm that extend out over the mag well. This solved the problem compleatly and the gun ejects like it should with every load I have tried. The only pit fall is it is hard to extract a unfired round with this ejector without removing the clip first and letting the unfired round drop down below the ejector and drop out the bottom threw the opening for the clip. While this solved the problem I never realy figured out why the gun diid what it did I have other 1911s that don't have this problem and they all run on the same amo and are held the same way by the same shooter.

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Last edited by Buzzard Bait; March 13, 2009 at 03:54 PM. Reason: slow thinking
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Old March 19, 2009, 12:12 AM   #16
dogzilla
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Gezzzzzz

this happens becuase the case got stuck in the chamber and the extractor jerked it out instead of pulling it out..so it forces it to fly out the port differently... it was a mis-manufactured
round of ammo, i got one directly into the eye from a big, mean, 45 win magnum grizzly auto, it made a half moon cut in the white of my eye under the pupil, had the eye doc look at it.. he said..wow cool..never seen that
one before..but said give it two weeks...be easy with it..and it will heal right up.. and it did.... and he also gave me a free pair of safety glasses..

why is everyone so quick to blame the gun ? gezzzzzz
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Old March 20, 2009, 09:13 AM   #17
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1911

I have three guns.2 AMTs and a FED ord that I made.all have standard springs and drop the cases next to the gun.my load is 3.6 of 700X with 200 gr SWC.all my 1911s have the ports lowered.I want accuracy to 50yrds,not power.
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