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Old February 16, 2009, 11:35 AM   #1
Prince55
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Re-lining a .224 barrel ???

What can be done to a .222 Remington 24 inch rifle barrel that has some
pitting about midway in the bore?
I've heard about re-lining a bore. Would it be about as accurate as when
it was new and about what would it cost ?
Would it show a lot after finished that it had a lined bore ?


Thanks
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Old February 16, 2009, 01:05 PM   #2
sadsack
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Prince: Its really not safe to reline a high pressure cartridge barrel. Relining is pretty much limited to low pressure rimfire and black powder cartridge firearms.
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Old February 16, 2009, 03:05 PM   #3
Prince55
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I talked to a local gunsmith and he said he had lined a few .22 rimfires
and when he checked he couldn't find a reamer for .22 centerfire but
could find them for bigger calibers.
Maybe the only choice is to change the barrel.

Thanks
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Old February 16, 2009, 03:40 PM   #4
Jim Watson
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Just as well to rebarrel. Relining of centerfires is best limited to low pressure calibers and guns with some collector interest that you still want to be able to shoot.

Do you load for .222 with brass and dies on hand? If not, the ammo or even reloading situation would be easier if you made it a .223.
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Old February 16, 2009, 03:49 PM   #5
Prince55
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I reload .222 & .223. Don't really care for .223 short necks that much,
but the rifle is a very beautiful Sako .222 and I'd like to try and get it
back like it was before somebody messed it up.
There's probably not much chance of finding a Sako barrel.

Thanks
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Old February 16, 2009, 11:34 PM   #6
Ruger4570
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Prince... you aren't listening to folks. Just rebarrel it. I doubt you can even FIND a gunsmith willing to reline your barrel. Remember, it is ONLY a rifle among 10's of thousands out there. It may be "important" to YOU for some reason, but nonetheless the value is actuallly what someone else determines that he is willing to part with / money.
Rebarrel it, get it reblued and enjoy it.
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Old February 17, 2009, 12:23 AM   #7
DBotkin
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I do see Sako barrels for sale on Gunbroker occasionally, they can't be *that* rare. A good quality replacement and a decent bluing job, and it will look just as good as new -- jut not the exact same stamping on the barrel. Small enough price to pay for a nice rifle like that. Give it the quality steel it deserves.
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Old February 17, 2009, 01:35 PM   #8
Scorch
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Quote:
Its really not safe to reline a high pressure cartridge barrel.
Not so, Grasshopper. Please be careful about dispensing advice without the facts. We reline high pressure cartridge barrels in our shop all the time. The liner is larger in diameter than a 22 liner (about as large in diameter as a #1 profile barrel) with an enlarged portion in the chamber area, the barrel is reamed and the liner is inserted, then the barrel is chambered and crowned. What you end up with looks just like the original barrel and is completely safe to fire. Many times it will actually shoot better than the original barrel because of the closer tolerances of the barrel liner vs a 50-year-old barrel. You cannot tell the barrel has been lined after the work is done.

As far as the cost compared to rebarreling, the comparison is only as good as the price of whatever barrel blank you would use. Relining a barrel will typically cost about $300, rebarreling with a cheap barrel like a Adams & Bennett would be about the same price (because of threading the barrel and cutting the breech recess), but many barrel blanks will actually cost as much or more just by themselves than the whole relining job. Before you decide which you want or need, decide what you want as a result, then find out about prices. You can PM me if you are interested in relining your barrel.
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Old February 17, 2009, 06:33 PM   #9
sadsack
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Scorch: I have thirty-five + years experience in gun work and I'm still learning something on about every gun that I work on. I was giving advice based on the facts as I knew them. I'm not disputing your word about the work you do in your shop, but yours is the only one I've heard of that does this. I stand corrected.
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Old February 17, 2009, 09:25 PM   #10
James K
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Hi, Scorch,

Where do you get your liners, or do you turn down barrel blanks?

I am no longer in the business, but I was never able to locate barrel liners thick and strong enough to contain high pressure, and the people who did that kind of work told me they made their own drills and reamers and just bought barrel blanks that they profiled to use as liners. I never tried that work, but have seen some good results. Naturally those "liners" were a lot heavier than the low pressure liners sold by Brownells and others. The big advantage is that the original barrel, though reduced to a shell, retains all the original markings, a big point with collectors.

Generally, when people talk about "lining a barrel" they are not talking about restoring a collectible to shooting condition; they don't want to pay for a new barrel and want a $40 job, not a $300 one. I can't see doing that for something like a Remington 700, with new threaded barrels available. That is why I usually say lining a barrel for a high pressure round is not feasible.

Jim
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Old February 17, 2009, 11:54 PM   #11
Prince55
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Thanks for all the information.
Scorch - I sent you a pm.
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Old February 18, 2009, 01:47 AM   #12
Scorch
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Jim-
We have several sources for barrel liners. Some come from barrel makers and are basically button-rifled barrel blanks that are 1/2"-3/4" in diameter, others are made specifically as liners on a hammer forging machine from suppliers that just make liners. These are not like the aircaraft tubing 22 liners you get from Brownells, they are truly rifle barrels, just very skinny. We drill out the original barrels, ream them, fit the liners so no joining lines are visible, crown/chamber, then reblue. For a collectible or a rifle that screw-in barrels are not available for, it is a good option.

As you said, most people who want a barrel lined have a collectible or heirloom rifle they want to keep original in appearance and restore to shooting condition, others simply want the rifle returned to service. For many years, barrels were cheap, cheaper than or close to the price of paying to have the barrel drilled and reamed. liner installed, then chambered and crowned, but barrel prices have headed north over the past few years with the increase in metal prices. We used to do just a few a month, but now we do several a week. I relined two just today, both collectibles, but I did one last week that was a relatively common rifle in 30-06. Just happened that the price for a relining was the price we got back for just a barrel blank, almost to the penny. And for folks that want a less expensive option to rebarreling, we also rebore and re-rifle barrels, mostly for BP cartridges, and that is another thing few people do any more.

Some folks don't bat an eye at dropping $250 to $450 for a barrel blank, $200-$300 for installation, and then shoot factory ammo in the rifle, others don't see the value in that. We serve both groups.

And sadsack, I wasn't trying to be harsh, so I am sorry if it came across that way, but there are a lot of gunsmiths nowadays that only know how to replace parts, they know very little about actual gun smithing and making guns and parts, and that is what we do. I hope you won't hold it against me.
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Old February 18, 2009, 09:15 AM   #13
sadsack
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Scorch: No offense taken. I had no idea that barrel liners of this sort were even available.
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Old February 18, 2009, 09:27 AM   #14
Jim Watson
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Valuable information. I did not know anybody was doing relining on high intensity calibers. We can plug your shop all over the place, now.
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Old February 18, 2009, 03:57 PM   #15
James K
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Thanks, Scorch.

I don't think there was anyone supplying those liners when I was working or if there was, I didn't know about it. What you describe would have no problem containing the pressures involved for nearly any conventional round, and makes that kind of thing much more feasible.

Another approach is the composite barrel, like was used on a lot of M1 rifles when new barrels were unavailable and M1903 barrels were $5. They cut the rear off the M1 barrel, drilled out the stub, then turned down the M1903 barrel and fitted it into the stub. Then they cut the front threads and spline cuts and Voila! a new M1 barrel. Collectors have blue horrors over them, but I never saw one blow up or come apart, and they generally shot OK.

Jim
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