The Firing Line Forums
Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Conference Center > S.W.A.T. Magazine

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old December 16, 2008, 11:14 PM   #1
Don Gwinn
Staff Emeritus
 
Join Date: March 9, 2000
Location: Virden, IL
Posts: 5,917
Surplus 1911's for Indiana Deputies--Am I the Only One Who Thought That Was Cool?

I noticed the other day that there's no thread in here on the article about Sheriff Ken Campbell's solution to the expense of issuing quality 1911-style pistols. His Sheriff's Office is getting surplus 1911's (many WWII vintage--many of them would be expensive collectors' pieces if they were transferable) and having them lightly gunsmithed--better sights, a couple of upgrades and some refinishing, and they have excellent fighting handguns for a lot less than even the "inexpensive" new 1911 clones. I thought that was a fantastic idea. I know people have reservations about military equipment going to sheriffs and city police departments, and I have to admit, when the Sheriff speaks proudly of his department's surplus APC, I roll my eyes a little. But when the military has equipment that's clearly necessary for police officers--such as defensive handguns--that they're never going to use for any purpose, common sense should take over.

The Sheriff mentioned feeling conflicted about "ruining" these guns by having them customized when many would have been highly collectible, and I understand. It's not as if Singer or Union are going to be making any more of these pistols. But on the other hand, the U.S. Government wasn't going to sell them to collectors either way (more's the pity.) If the alternative is to leave these old warhorses packed away in some government warehouse next to the Ark of the Covenant until the building crumbles around them in 3008, the idea of giving them new life and letting them continue to serve their purpose looks pretty good.

Cool idea, cool article.
__________________
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don Gwinn: Chicago Gun Rights Examiner
Don Gwinn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17, 2008, 01:06 AM   #2
IZinterrogator
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 8, 2004
Location: Pierce County, WA
Posts: 2,447
I'm usually a big opponent of sporterizing milsurp rifles, but I was okay with the upgrading of these pistols. Probably because I worked with a guy at my last unit who was an MP assigned to an M1911 destruction detail courtesy of the last administration, and he had to catalog thousands of pistols being destroyed. He told me that despite spending the better part of an hour begging to spare it, he had to throw a Singer in a giant shredder.
__________________
"If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!” - Samuel Adams
IZinterrogator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17, 2008, 03:16 PM   #3
Denny Hansen
Staff
 
Join Date: June 29, 2001
Location: Prescott Valley, AZ
Posts: 2,364
It is very cool. I wish more departments would take advantage of the DRMO program and put surplus equipment back on the street instead of writing grants and costing taxpayers more money for gear that, in some cases, in not as good as what they could have had for "free."

Quote:
he had to throw a Singer in a giant shredder
That's just plain sad.

Denny
__________________
S.W.A.T. Magazine
Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World
Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook
Denny Hansen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17, 2008, 03:39 PM   #4
Walther22lr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2000
Location: Arizona Territory
Posts: 295
On one hand I think its a good idea to use them rather than have them shredded.

On the other hand, if the same ones had been sold on the open market to collectors, I think they could have made enough money to buy several more pistols than what they needed. Brand new ones too.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1911 shredded.jpg (99.4 KB, 2118 views)
Walther22lr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 17, 2008, 03:42 PM   #5
buzz_knox
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 2, 1999
Location: Knoxville, in the Free State of Tennesse
Posts: 4,191
A few years back, my agency was disposing of a large number of weapons, including 16s that had been converted to semi (including some that might have been transferable). As the gun guy in my group, I was asked how we could sell them. An exec got twitchy about selling "high powered" weapons and ordered them destroyed instead. I was asked to be the witness and I flat refused.

I read this article and had a moment like Ken's. The idea of altering something that valuable was hard, until you realized that these weapons were being put to their ultimate use: defending the lives of the good guys. If the pistols had souls, I bet they were singing at the chance to get a new change of "clothes" and get back into the fight.

I took an Awerbuck course that included some of Ken's guys. One of these pistols had nothing but problems. The others were flawless (once kept oiled).
buzz_knox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 19, 2008, 08:54 PM   #6
Tamara
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: March 11, 2000
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 15,960
Ken's on our side.

He makes me happy to be a newly-minted Hoosier.

(...and what is it about lawyer gun skul addicts with the same surname? Is there one in every state? Hope to see you next time you're up Boone County way, buzz_. Bring that Delta Elite so I can say "hi!" )
__________________
MOLON LABE!
2% Unobtainium, 98% Hypetanium.
The Arms Room: An Online Museum.
Tamara is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 20, 2008, 12:31 AM   #7
InferriCanis
Member
 
Join Date: August 3, 2007
Location: Indiana , Stohldarten@AOL.COM
Posts: 32
All equipment is cool...........

Middletown P.D. recieved a half dozen of these a few years back, after new barrel bushings and some tweeking, they make great off duty carry guns. Glock 21 is the standard duty carry for now.
InferriCanis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 20, 2008, 01:24 AM   #8
gordo b.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 20, 2002
Location: Peoples republik of Calif.
Posts: 963
Ken is a genius prince of a public servant. The surplus 1911a1s save the tax payer $$ and they are MUCH more likely to go bang when you need it than anything that can be commercial bought IMHO. I've told 2 dept's that I reserve with about the program and showed them the article. They will probably keep on Glockin however.
gordo b. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 20, 2008, 04:36 PM   #9
guntotin_fool
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 18, 2004
Posts: 1,446
At some point, someone in the Gov't is going to realize that there is cold hard cash to be made by selling certain things to legal people.
guntotin_fool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 21, 2008, 04:37 PM   #10
freakintoguns
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 6, 2008
Posts: 496
if there good enough to be used by soldiers to protect america, then by god they are more then good enough for the police to use to protect us good folk
freakintoguns is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 23, 2008, 11:32 AM   #11
buzz_knox
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 2, 1999
Location: Knoxville, in the Free State of Tennesse
Posts: 4,191
Quote:
The surplus 1911a1s save the tax payer $$ and they are MUCH more likely to go bang when you need it than anything that can be commercial bought IMHO.
From what I saw, they functioned about as well as any good 1911. That means that most did quite well (once properly lubed for the hot/dry conditions) and one went down hard (i.e. it had to go back to the smith).

Tam, I don't know why the surname is so popular with lawyer types. Perhaps because it has a certain irony to it.
buzz_knox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 27, 2008, 11:30 AM   #12
Eghad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 28, 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,231
Good idea for law enfrocement agencies. If I had to choose between shredding these fine monuments to our freedom or a law enforcment agency getting them and modifying them the agencies wins hands down.
__________________
Have a nice day at the range

NRA Life Member
Eghad is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:18 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Page generated in 0.12213 seconds with 10 queries