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Old February 22, 2008, 02:28 PM   #1
Uncle Ben
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common CAS calibers?

Reading some of these threads, I see that the calibers used in CAS are not the little guys, and certainly nothing near as small as .22, yet videos I have seen for these types of competitions seem like they are shooting .22, due to their rifles and 6'ers seeming to have no recoil and a very quiet round. Was I just seeing the exception, or am I missing something about this?

Thanks.
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Old February 22, 2008, 02:59 PM   #2
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What you are seeing are gamers shooting mouse fart loads ..trying to win at the game ....If you ever get a chance to go to and watch a match ..the black powder shooters , are makeing thunder , smoke and fire ..and haveing a ball ....now thats winning ! Watch the shooter with the dubble hand full of Walkers !
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Old February 22, 2008, 03:39 PM   #3
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That explains it...
So they are probably shooting firearms chambered for .45 colt, etc, but reloading them really light?

I can't seem to find the video with the actual shooting in it, but by searching in youtube for "cowboy action", a series from Expert Village comes up (along with other stuff of course). There are probably 8 or 10 videos from them. Most of them are explanation, and not shooting, and I can't find the one where the instructor himself actually shoots the course.

Thanks for the input.
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Old February 22, 2008, 05:27 PM   #4
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Eaither 45 or 38`s ..but light loads indeed ..and their guns are tricked out with special springs to make the action lighter . I only watch it on TV when they are showing the black powder shooters . The first match I went to and watched ..there was a guy shooting a pair of Walkers ..Gunfighter style ..one in each hand ...he didn`t break any fast time records ..but he sure looked like he enjoyed his job.
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Old February 22, 2008, 05:39 PM   #5
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Currently popular loads are 125 grain .38 specials and .45 Colts as light as 160 grains at low velocity. There ARE the "Warthogs" who pride themselves on shooting standard power ammunition, preferably with full case loads of black powder for the real feel of the guns.
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Old February 22, 2008, 05:42 PM   #6
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Almost makes you wish they had a "Major" and "Minor" load specs like in IPSC so you'd get points knocked off if you shoot a less powerful load.
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Old February 22, 2008, 06:14 PM   #7
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Almost makes you wish they had a "Major" and "Minor" load specs like in IPSC so you'd get points knocked off if you shoot a less powerful load.
Too many recoil sensitive wimps and whiners that can't even handle .38 special service loads but they scream the loudest and you know the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
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Old February 22, 2008, 06:28 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawg Haggen
Too many recoil sensitive wimps and whiners that can't even handle .38 special service loads but they scream the loudest and you know the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
Kinda makes me glad that I never have the time for another hobby like CAS or SASS for the fact of the whiners that are out there in competition, bad enough I hear it in the ASA in the Archery tournaments.

Most of my shooting is informal & with just a few buddies & we have a ball with shooting what ever we want & most times at full power.
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Old February 22, 2008, 07:29 PM   #9
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You don't hear it at a match, don't see many mouse pharts at a match either but the SASS Wire is full of it.
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Old February 23, 2008, 12:38 AM   #10
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There are a couple of guys, Gamers as you put it, at the local CAS club shoots, who shoot what I believe are Rugers firing .38 squibb loads. They "thumb" the hammers so fast with their off hands I catch myself looking for a magazine change! A Daisy airrifle has more recoil and muzzle blast!

What I'd like to see is a no notice lottery.......everyone puts a number in the hat and everyone pulls one out......you shoot some other guys guns!!!!!! Lets see how the gamer does with 7.5 in .45 with full bore loads and no notice! Kinda like the "old days" when you picked one up off the ground and used it - battlefield expedient.
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Old February 23, 2008, 06:59 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by berkmberk1
What I'd like to see is a no notice lottery.......everyone puts a number in the hat and everyone pulls one out......you shoot some other guys guns!!!!!! Lets see how the gamer does with 7.5 in .45 with full bore loads and no notice! Kinda like the "old days" when you picked one up off the ground and used it - battlefield expedient.
That'd be interesting especially if I had my Grandfathers Dubble barrel 10Ga 1875-80's W. W. Greener with 12" barrels & a pistol grip...
My Uncle has it now in a case, but I remember as a kid when it was fired it would rock even a 250lb man!!
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Old February 23, 2008, 08:55 AM   #12
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As usual, the gamers have done all they can to reduce the sport to simple competition. They should've amended the rules before it got out of hand. Now you see grown men shooting .38's out of big and heavy Vaqueros with loads that barely dribble the bullets past the muzzle. Same for their short stroke `73's. The good news is you can play any way you want. Let the gamers plink with their pop guns. You don't have to win for it to be fun.
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Old February 23, 2008, 11:51 AM   #13
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Is this a New moniker for "gamers"

How's this for a new term.....anyone use it before? "Plinkerton Men" Has sort of a catchy ring to it.....:barf:
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Old February 23, 2008, 12:08 PM   #14
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Too many recoil sensitive wimps and whiners that can't even handle .38 special service loads
My first revolver was a S&W 28-2 Highway Patrolman, 4 in. barrel. I was just 21 which at that point rhymed with dumb and full of _____ fill in the blank. .38s were fun but TAME until I shot off a whole box of Remington .357 JSPs!!! That was before I put on the Pachmayer rubber grips too! That was recoil! Not unmanageable but a right smart whack thru the forearm. Am I correct???? eh?... eh?... eh?..... Did I mention that my hearing protection was chewed up wads of Kleenex??? My ears rang for a WEEK!

Best fun I ever had.....
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Old February 26, 2008, 10:16 AM   #15
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Come to think of it, I see the same thing for the IPSC competitions where they're all shotting 1911's, like Todd Jarrett and Travis Tomasie. But the recoil again seems much too light for even a standard 45ACP load. I just thought it was their technique, but maybe not.
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Old February 26, 2008, 10:41 AM   #16
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Can't speak for all but I know some clubs like the CAS shooters to use "mild" loads for a variety of reasons including a little less wear n' tear on the "steel" downrange.

I've been teased about shooting .38 Special before but hey, I could barely afford to play the game in the first place so I went with a round I thought I could support

I've shot with some serious "speed freak" gamers, and shot with a group that would pause to deliver old-time cowboy lines like "Black Bart, ya shot my paw, I'm a comin' ta get ya" before finishing a run.

Personally I like the guys with the sense of humor. I'll go for style points LONG before timed score.
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Old February 26, 2008, 10:50 AM   #17
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Since the rules are written so that you just have to "ring" some steel, pop a balloon, etc., it makes no sense to use anything more powerful than the absolute minimum, since it would just slow you down. Because of that, probably the most common claibres used are light-loaded .38s and .357s, but you also see light-loaded .44s and .45s in use. It's a game, and everyone who participates realizes that.
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Old February 26, 2008, 12:42 PM   #18
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At one local match, one of the shooters uses Rugers in .32 mag (I think they are Single Sixes). The most common calibers I have seen in use are .38/.357 and .45 Colt. I believe SASS has now enacted a "minimum" of 600 fps, but that still allows most all of the "gamer" loads.
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Old February 26, 2008, 01:25 PM   #19
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Don't get me wrong

I'm not diss'n anyone who shoots a gun for fun (could be a line from a CW song). If somone wanted to shoot a .22 with some sort of contraption like they sell for auto rifles, the hand crank job, (right?) I wouldn't really give a hoot, but it seems to me the sport was concocted to relive/experience shooting from an old fashioned perspective.......at least in part.

Now it seems the defacto center of attention is the guy who has a gun so slicked up it almost shoots itself. It has to have a diet of "sugar free" cartridges so it doesn't disassemble itself during a match. Where I think (what do I know?) the attention should be more directed is the lower end of the scale as it now stands......the BP CB shooter who is adept at managing his weapons should be the King.......next in line would be the BP cartridge guy......then the smokless and then the Plinkerton Man who wants to be able to shoot like a mini-gun with no appreciable recoil to disrupt his run. I am very sure this sort of shooting requires great skill and practice. Personally, I wouldn't take it up because I want appreciate what it really took. I want to compete against others who try to excel at the art of slinging lead as fast and accurately as they can with hand cannons loaded just like they were.

Just my two cent piece...........everyone just have fun
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Old February 26, 2008, 03:30 PM   #20
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...it makes no sense to use anything more powerful than the absolute minimum, since it would just slow you down.
It makes all the sense in the world to the guy that wants to adhere to the spirit of the game rather than taking every advantage just to win a match. To me, what matters most in CAS is not whether you win or lose, but how you play the game. Gunfighters, cowpokes, outlaws and lawmen in the late 1800's did NOT look for the lightest calibers to throw the most shots downrange in the shortest time, completely disregarding their effectiveness. Neither should we.
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Old February 26, 2008, 03:40 PM   #21
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I`ve never seen any loading data from the 1800`s that required 10 grs of black powder and 20grs of breakfast cereal to take up the air space ...LOL
I more enjoy loading to as close as to what they might have had to shoot with back in the day , and dealing with the problems caused by the same .
Maybe the only prize for this is huge grins and style points ...but ain`t it fun .
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