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Old July 11, 2000, 11:14 PM   #1
CassandraComplex
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I was wondering if there is any advantage between Winchester and CCI primers?

WESHOOT2, among others, suggested CCI primers for my 10mm/.40 loads (with PowerPistol powder being the most popular powder suggested so far).
I have only ever used Winchester primers.
I could care less what kind I use....whatever is better. So, I was wondering why they suggest CCI primers.
My question is, what is the difference between the two brands? Advantages of one over the other?

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Old July 11, 2000, 11:32 PM   #2
Rocky Road
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Really haven't done any toe-to-toe testing, CCI vs Win primers. One observation, though--If you use a Dillon progressive press, or contemplate acquisition of one, be aware that Dillon recommends AGAINST use of CCI primers in their tools. I disregarded this caution once, when a friend gave me a box of 1,000 old CCI primers. They all worked fine, but the primer feed got hung up numerous times.

Good Luck--
RR

[This message has been edited by Rocky Road (edited July 12, 2000).]
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Old July 12, 2000, 01:52 AM   #3
JackFlash
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A dealer who knows what he's talking about in reloading swears by Federal primers because they're the only one -- according to him -- that has a "base" formula. Evidently this is more reliable than "acid" composition primers.

And in that vein . . . I use magnum primers most of the time. But then I use relatively bulky powders in relatively hot loads. The bulkier, double-base powders are supposed to be more difficult to ignite. Hodgdon suggests using mag primers for these types of powders.

I don't think you can go wrong with the "Big Five" . . . Federal, Peters, Remington, Winchester, CCI.
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Old July 12, 2000, 04:19 AM   #4
sjones
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got hung up on that same question when I bought my dillon. The cci's would hang up or not seat fully every few rounds,so I called dillon and they said that they recomend win because the cci were a lot harder and they were having quality control problems.Some were out of round and would stick in the feeder tube. I switched to win and haven't had any more problems. sj
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Old July 12, 2000, 08:00 AM   #5
Ruben Nasser
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I have never had any problems with any brand/size of primers in my Dillon 550 B, and I could detect only minor variations in velocity (all guns), and group size (only rifle cartridges) by changing primer brands. To me, all primers from a reputable company are about the same (...if you tinker long enough, you may fine tune a load, though).
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Old July 12, 2000, 09:39 AM   #6
Casey
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Although the local dealer has acted as if I were slightly crazy, I too have had a number of problems with the CCI primers in a Dillon SDB.

This dealer did not want to handle the Federal primers (my first choice), and his reasoning made sense. The way that Federal packages their primers wastes his shelf space.

However, I have had numerous problems with CCI primers (fail to feed through the tube, getting stuck in the pickup tube, etc...). I have had NO problems with Federal primers, and only one with the Winchester primers (although I have probably loaded a much smaller percentage of Winchester).

As I don't chrono, I have seen basically no diference in performance.

Casey
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Old July 12, 2000, 12:17 PM   #7
dongun
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Last year, I started having trouble with primers not feeding properly on my RCBS press. It seems that the next primer (the one that is still in the tube) catches the seater cup after loading a new primer. If the primer that was just loaded into the seater cup isn't long enough, the next primer will drop partially down into the cup causing it to catch. (This may not make sense to anyone it hasn't happened to.)

The reason for this long explanation, is that I changed from Winchester primers to CCI primers last year (only because my local dealer was out of stock on the Winchesters). I didn't connect the problem to the change of brand until I read this post, but it seems that it started at about that same time. It may be that the CCI primers are just a bit shorter than the Winchesters. Thanks for jogging my thinking cap.


Follow up: I measured the length of four primers of both brands. Both brands varied over about .004". The Winchester averaged .132", while the CCI averaged .127". This .005" difference could cause the feeding problem with the CCIs, especially on the shortest ones. I reckon I'll go back to Winchester. Thanks again.

[This message has been edited by dongun (edited July 12, 2000).]
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Old July 14, 2000, 08:53 AM   #8
JerryM
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I have a Dillon 650. I use more CCI primers than anything else. I have had no problem with their feeding. I do believe that Federal primers are softer than any others as far as ignition is concerned and I, therefore, use them for my J Frame loads. Jerry

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Old July 14, 2000, 10:26 PM   #9
nwgunman
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My 550B doesn't care. I have never had any problem with either. I haven't spent the time to chrono any load velocity difference due to "primers"...to busy still looking for that "magic" powder. Availablility (remember that big "shortage" a while back?!?), and price determine my purchases lately.
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Old July 14, 2000, 10:42 PM   #10
Grayfox
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Winchester and CCI are the two most avalible brands around here. I've used them interchangably for years without problems. I have more or less settled on CCI for magnum and large case loads (.45 Colt) and Winchester for standard caliber loads. My guns just seem to like it that way. However, if I'm out of one brand it doesn't bother me one bit to use the other.

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Old July 15, 2000, 11:02 AM   #11
Turk
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CCI / Winchester Primers.

I've use and like both brands. Something I've found over the years reloading 5.56 & 7.62 NATO (with sagged primer pockets) is the CCI will not seat as easely and would sometimes crush the primer and also shave off a little brass from the around the primer pocket. This is why I think it's a dia. cause than a lenght cause. Using Winchester primers I've not encounted this problem.

Also if I use commerial or National Match (7.62 NATO) brass I don't run into this problem.

I just mic'd two Lg. Pistol of each. The CCI's dia. is a little under a .001 larger than the Winchester. This could account the seating problems.

Is the Win. under or is the CCI over size? My best bet would be both are within the Min/Max. industry standards.

Both are good and when I buy my next lot of 5,000 I'll go with the best price.

Turk


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Old July 18, 2000, 05:55 AM   #12
Saeed
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CassandraComplex,

We have run a test on primers in rifles only. The results are on our web site, but here is a link directly to that article.
www.accuratereloading.com/primers.html

I hope you find it of interest.

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<A HREF="http://www.accuratreloading.com

saeed@emirates.net.ae" TARGET=_blank>www.accuratreloading.com

saeed@emirates.net.ae</A>

[This message has been edited by Saeed (edited July 18, 2000).]
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Old July 20, 2000, 08:48 PM   #13
Banzai
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CCI primers tend to be on the "colder" and "harder" side of the equation, with Fed's on the other end, and Win's in the middle. One thing, Win's have a "New" finish on them that makes them not slide as well on primer flip trays. They have GREAT consistency as far as uniformity of cups and primer charge, though. CCI ranks as an almost "budget" primer, good for bulk loading with easy to ignite powders (higher nitro content).
For pistol, with good reloading technique, a year of testing same loads with only primer changes has shown that Feds are the most reliable, CCIs least so, but there was no accuracy difference in any of my pistols with any of the 3 primers.
Feds had highest velocity, CCIs lowest, Wins in the middle. Wins clocked the highest velocity spread, CCIs the lowest.
I back off my loads when using Feds, and bump it up when using CCIs to get the same velocities.
For rifle, with more powder and tighter tolerances, primers make more of a difference. For pistol, I've satisfied myself that standardizing on one type/brand will do. Just develop your loads with that one primer, and stick with it.
I tested AA2/5/7, Titegroup, 231, Blue Dot, Red Dot, Bullseye, VN350, VN3N37, HS6 in 9mm, .357, .40, .45, 10mm.

Tom

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[This message has been edited by Banzai (edited July 20, 2000).]
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