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Old October 2, 2002, 05:48 PM   #1
Fatelvis
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4064 in Garand

I just bought a Garand in 30-06, and loaded up new Remington cases with IMR 4895 over 168 Sierras and had pretty good accuracy (from a reg. GI barrel). I was told by a couple guys that IMR4064 would be a little better choice , with that bullet. What is a good, safe, accurate charge of 4064 to use, with the 168 bullet? And IS 4064 a better powder for the Garand? Thanks guys-
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Old October 2, 2002, 06:24 PM   #2
Art Eatman
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Well, 4895 is the old GI standard. 3031 and 4064 also work quite well. 4064 is the slowest burning of the three.

The slower the burn rate, the longer the burn time, and the slower the rate of decay of pressure in the barrel. So, 4895 will spike sooner and decay sooner than will 4064.

The Garand was designed to function with a port pressure of (SFAIK) 2,000 psi. If you go to a max-pressure load with a slower powder, you'll exceed this limit. This will eventually bend the operating rod, from being "hammered".

So: The deal with 4064 is that you can get excellent accuracy with the 168- or 180-grain bullets, but you can't load to maximum velocities. Since the idea is to get best target accuracy, maximum velocity is not all that important...Purely guessing, I'd venture that 5% by weight under max would be a safe upper limit. Say, 47 grains of 4064, roughly. I've loaded 50 grains of 4064 behind a 165-grain bullet in my bolt action, without any over-pressure signs.

Back in the mid-1980s, an article in the "Rifleman" on reloading for the Garand mentioned this in some detail. The article also mentioned that one should be consistent between shots as to handling of the rifle when shooting for score. Best uniformity is gotten from raising the muzzle, letting the powder settle toward the rear, and then sighting and shooting. If you sometimes start from muzzle-up and sometimes from muzzle-down, velocities and groups will become erratic! Not badly, but enough to lose points. Weird.

, Art
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Old October 2, 2002, 06:42 PM   #3
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47.5 grains or so was NRA-OK in the Garand using a Sierra 168-gr bullet and LAKE CITY brass.

Guess what I used?

Worked great.

Use CCI primers to avoid the legendary slam-fire. It takes only "once"...
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Old October 2, 2002, 07:06 PM   #4
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I thought that only the CCI #34 milspec primers are the ones that are supposed to help with slamfires?

Did CCI finally change all of their primers to harder primer cups?
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Old October 2, 2002, 07:09 PM   #5
Fatelvis
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Thanks guys, and very informative Art. One more question: Is there the load differences, (due to case capacity), between military/commercial brass, like in 308 brass? If so, what % reduction for military? Frohickey, I think Ive heard that CCI primers in general, are harder. They do still offer the #34 Mil primers, so I doubt they combined the two.
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Old October 3, 2002, 02:16 AM   #6
Cheapo
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CCI primers have always been harder than Rem or Federal. I've seen "combat" tuned revolvers with way-too-light hammer springs misfire with CCI-primed ammo (reloads AND factory) while they always go boom with Winchesters.

The newer "milspec" CCI primer just might be different only by being tested. Dunno, but I DO remember that not a single M1 slamfire I heard of in the '80s involved CCI primers. And that was before they came out with the #34.
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Old October 3, 2002, 06:08 AM   #7
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GI brass

in '06 may have slight volume difference, but not enough to affect safety. Accuracy, that's another thing, but in my M1 I see no difference between GI and WW brass in accuracy or pressure signs.

In .308/7.62 NATO, GI brass and commercial are significantly different in case capacity and should be loaded differently, according to what I've read.
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Old October 3, 2002, 07:48 AM   #8
Dave P
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Fatelvis

Accurate XMR4064 on sale at Natchez for 2 more weeks: $80 / keg. I like it for 308 bolts and M1A.
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Old October 3, 2002, 07:50 PM   #9
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Is XMR4064 close to IMR4064, in performance/burn speed?
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Old October 3, 2002, 11:01 PM   #10
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"Back in the mid-1980s, an article in the "Rifleman" on reloading for the Garand mentioned this in some detail. The article also mentioned that one should be consistent between shots as to handling of the rifle when shooting for score. "


I think I have a copy of those aritcles...............I KNOW I have one of the reccomended loading tables for the M-1. One day after i get all this hurricane mess straight I will see if I can scan it and put it here.
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Old October 4, 2002, 03:58 PM   #11
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I would love to see it SouthLA!
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Old October 4, 2002, 09:10 PM   #12
Southla1
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Ok fatelvis as soon as I get regular electricity back after this hurricane..............still on my generator. No problem wiht that but cant run too many things, and the A/C is #1 Scanner is #10
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Old October 6, 2002, 09:06 AM   #13
Dave P
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Is XMR4064 close to IMR4064, in performance/burn speed?


Accurate says they are similar.
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