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Old September 4, 2002, 06:40 PM   #1
nandoaqui
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How To Reset a Scope to "Factory Zero"

I want to use my Simmons Aetec 3.8-12x44 scope on my Rem 700P, but first I would like to reset the W&E adjustments to where they were when the scope was new; i.e., at the from-the-factory setting.

I did not keep track of how much I had to adjust these when the scope was on its previous rifle, but I know I did adjust it some. Resetting the adjustments to the factory setting, I believe, will result in having equal adjustment Up as Down, and Left as Right.

I was going to turn each adjustment all the way in one direction, and then in the opposite direction, count the turns between the limits, divide by two, and I would know where the middle would be. I tried this and found that I can easily detect the all-the-way-turned-in limit, but such is not the case when turning them out, and I am afraid I may screw them out too far - I just don't know.

I have e-mailed Simmons (twice) but after a week have not received a response.

Does anyone know what I am talking about? (I may have made the issue more confusing than it really is.)

Any suggestions on how to reset the adjustments?

Thanx!

Alex
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Old September 4, 2002, 07:21 PM   #2
Redlg155
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I would just stick the scope on the new rifle, boresight it and not worry about it after that, well..except for live firing to get your zero.

You won't gain any advantage by trying to return a scope back to the "factory setting". A good quality scope will retain repeatability no matter what the previous settings were. If I go 10 clicks up and 5 clicks right for a shot I should be able to go down 10 and left 5 to get back to my standard zero.

You may or may not have equal adjustment even if you started out with a factory new scope depending on whether or not you have it mounted correctly, distance above the bore, and other factors.

Good Shooting
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Old September 4, 2002, 07:23 PM   #3
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Alex, Don't worry about the original adjustments and don't dial them around way out at their limits. Mount the scope on the rifle and do what you need to bore sight it by the traditional means or a collaminator or lazer device. That is all you need to do to get it on paper. Then go on to make the final adjustments by shooting your rig.
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Old September 4, 2002, 08:28 PM   #4
Archie
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The Loyal Opposition mouths off.

You DO want to return the scope to "Factory" or mechanical zero. Here's why:

When you mounted the scope the first time, you adjusted the final adjustment by moving the knobs, right? And you don't remember how far left, right or up you moved the settings.
So what if you have to adjust the settings again in the same direction? You may get close to your final setting but not quite make it. Or not have enought left for a serious left wind.

1. So, do like you planned. Crank all the way to one side, count to other side and come halfway back. Just be gentle at the ends and you shouldn't have any problems.
2. Then, when you mount your scope, bore-sight it first. That is, look from the rear of the rifle through the bore at a suitable mark. Look through the scope to see how close the crosshairs are to the mark. (The mark can be as close as 25 yards and will still work pretty well.)
If you have to move the settings more than about 10 clicks, stop right there. Pull the scope out and RE-ALIGN the rings and mounts. Ideally, you want to mount the scope perfectly lined up with the bore by the rings.
This gives you the most usable adjustment from your scope.

Now... if this is a quick and dirty brush gun, just getting it on and adjusted will probably work.
Your gun, your choice.
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Old September 4, 2002, 11:31 PM   #5
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well how about this method:

1) set your little 'ol scope in a set of V's made of wood, what you want is the ability to rotate it while it is in a secure base

2) look through the scope whilst rotating, paying attention to
the intesecting scope hairs "aim point"

3) if the "aim point" stays stationary, Yippee!! your scope is
"zeroed" to itself, reset your "click" thingys to zero and your done. Huh? you dont have resettable to zero click thingys??
go get a real scope eh?

4) if the "aim point" seems to go in a kind of elliipse shape,
adjust your click thingys and check again. keep at it till you reach step three the stationary point of nirvana.

sure it was luck, but i did this to my leupold Vari-XIII 4.5x14x40
before i put it on my .50 cal and hey whadda ya know, first two shots @ 100 yds were 5 inches out, couple clicks and i was in there!!

thats all i know and it ain't much. good luck
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Old September 4, 2002, 11:56 PM   #6
Art Eatman
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Archie, I don't disagree with anything you say, if the moving of the scope from rifle to rifle is on some sort of regular basis.

So, I dutifully write down the number of clicks in the X and Y axes, and file it away.

Five or ten years later, just where in the world did I put that piece of paper? Duh.

It's just so much easier to install, boresight, sight in and forget it.

, Art
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Old September 5, 2002, 05:32 AM   #7
demarpaint
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factory zero

I went through this about a year ago with a Sightron Scope. I called them about counting clicks in both directions and dividing by 2. Their answer was this, it won't work, send the scope back and they will adjust it to factory Zero. (BTW- Sightron is a great company to deal with.) I would suggest doing the same thing, but call the company. The reason you can't do it yourself is there is some "free space" at the end of the travel, and it is not useable, or an exact amount. They have an instrument for calibrating them to factory zero.
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Old September 5, 2002, 05:57 AM   #8
nandoaqui
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all good remarks

psssniper -
That sounds as if it would be the best method to achieve concentricity of the crosshairs with the scope tube, which may be 'the' critical factor.

demarpaint -
That's what I was afraid of; i.e., end-play of the knobs, or dead-band, etc. which would render the turn counting inaccurate.

Then again, maybe I'm making too much of a mountain out of a mole hill, as others might have very wisely suggested.

Thank you all, and I'll keep reading your messages (and learning, which is the best part!)

Alex
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Old September 5, 2002, 09:11 AM   #9
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Art, are you another version of me in a former life? Man, I lose important stuff like that too!
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Old September 5, 2002, 09:36 AM   #10
Art Eatman
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There wuz a time when I was dutiful to the point of being anal-retentive about keeping notes. Then I realized that I spent more time hunting for the notes than if I just went on and "did it from scratch". Life got a lot better, with much less stress from not having to worry about some fershlugginer scrap of paper. Paper is for IRS to worry over, not me.

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Old September 5, 2002, 10:00 AM   #11
Handy
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I just read this thread and was unable to find a logical reason for resetting a scope to zero. One gentleman even said "here's why:" and then didn't say.

I know that a target scope I own says specifically NOT to go to the limits.
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Old September 5, 2002, 10:52 AM   #12
Art Eatman
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Well, look. You have a scope on rifle "A". You move it to rifle "B". All you gotta do is keep track of the number of clicks to get a proper zero.

Then, if you move it back from B to A, you reset the number of clicks you moved, the first time around.

That assumes sho-nuff reliability in the scope's internal workings.

I personally think it's just as easy to boresight the sucker, fire maybe three rounds at 25 yards, and then move to 100 yards and figure two three-shot groups and you're done. Since this method has been working for me since Hector wuz a pup, it's hard to worry about paperwork.

Art
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Old September 5, 2002, 11:14 AM   #13
Mute
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This article should be of some help:

http://www.snipercountry.com/Article...anicalZero.htm
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Old September 5, 2002, 11:15 AM   #14
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What Art said...

it's been working for me for nigh on forever, and seems SO much easier...

I also once heard that it's a BAD thing to run a scope all the way to the end of it's adjustment!
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Old September 5, 2002, 12:56 PM   #15
nandoaqui
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Why Reset To Factory Zero?

Handy,

The reason I asked the question in the first place is that I know that while in the previous rifle, the scope required quite a bit of windage adjustment in one direction, but I can't remember which direction (at 56 I also have some of the 'Art' syndrome).

I don't know what the total available range of adjustment is, but if it is two turns in each direction from 'factory zero', for example, and I already used one turn with the previous rifle, and don't reset it, it will not have as much adjustment for the new rifle. And this may be a problem.

On the other hand, since the scope base itself has some degree of windage adjustment, (via the screws that capture the rear scope ring) I would prefer to bore-sight it first (as I always do, by the way) with the scope at the factory-zero, do a coarse windage adjustment with the scope base screws, and use the scope adjustment knobs for the final, finer tuning. Then again, whatever adjustment is left PROBABLY would be sufficient, but I thought I would pose the question anyway...

I really don't plan to move this particular scope to another rifle, but I wouldn't want this bit of information to get in the way of this lively interchange of creative, experienced and interesting ideas.

Alex
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Old September 5, 2002, 02:02 PM   #16
Art Eatman
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I've checked out total travel on scopes. Had an oddball angle on the axis of a scope/mounting setup, one time. Anyhow, the key is to be sorta gentle when you get toward the end of travel.

After you find the halfway point, you're right, adust with the mount as much as possible when you boresight.

Some manufacturers give the total number of clicks of travel. Weaver's new stuff has this info. Haven't bought any other new stuff, lately. (I know that piece of paper is around here, somewhere. )

Art
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Old September 10, 2002, 01:03 PM   #17
nandoaqui
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Just A Quick Update

I backed-up the W&E knobs about two to three turns from the slowly and carefully approached 'all-the-way-in' limit.

I bore sighted the 700P, shot at 25 yds and it was within 1/2" of center. Moved to 50 yds and shot several rounds. Then I moved up to 100 yd and after some tweaking shot several 1-1/2" and 1-1/4" four-shot groups with Portuguese .308 147-gr. (Not bad!)

Then I loaded Black Hills 168-gr, tweaked it up a bit, shot two 3/4" four-shot groups, and time ran out - darn! (The range was full and there were people waiting.) Yes, I am very pleased with the rifle, scope, etc.

Shooting position: Sitting, with a Versa-Pod bipod with rubber feet at the front end resting on a bench, and no other rest or support -- The rifle probably can do better if it were to be fully supported.

By the way, the variation with the Black Hills was primarily in the horizontal axis (windage). The four-shot groups were about 3/8" high and just under 3/4" in width; they looked like horizontal strings of beads. (Doesn't such a small variation in elevation indicate very consistent powder charge and bullet weight?)

Alex
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Old September 10, 2002, 01:17 PM   #18
Art Eatman
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Black Hills ammo has always been lauded, here at TFL...

I'd venture that a group which is a bit wider than it is in height comes from a wee tad of canting, maybe. Shooter, not ammo. The main reason for a good benchrest is to take the shooter out of the equation as much as possible.

The benchrest tests the rifle. Off the benchrest tests the shooter.

Art
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Old September 10, 2002, 09:01 PM   #19
moredes
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Whenever you have to keep track of some come-up setting (i. e., favorite load's zero at 100yd, OEM zero, whatever), just write it down and stick it in your scope's W&E dust cover caps. I just cut out circles big enough to press-fit into the bottom of the cap.
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Old September 11, 2002, 08:16 AM   #20
nandoaqui
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Alex T.
Somehow I missed your thread when you first posted it. I just read that article and it provides the information for which I was looking. Thanx!

Art
Indeed, I am testing myself. A day or so ago someone else posted a target with four or five shots very close together in a vertical string. Mine look the same except rotated 90°.

Speaking of canting, do you now if the cant-indicators (simple levels or other means) are practical in actual use? I have read about them, seen some advertisments, and while they make sense, I wonder if they would be practical as for hunting or any sort of combat application.

Alex M.
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Old September 11, 2002, 10:13 AM   #21
Art Eatman
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I always use a grid target, when checking out stuff from my benchrest. I used a level to make a reference line on the backstop, so the targets are exactly vertical/horizontal. I just align the crosshairs with the grid.

The key is "always the same", so canting, as such, doesn't really matter. That is, if you always cant exactly the same, it won't affect the group.

Were I shooting benchrest competition, I'd probably use some anti-cant device.

Art
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Old September 11, 2002, 08:29 PM   #22
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Put a mirror on your bench, flat.s tand the scope atop it, objective down. peer thru ocular. you'll see two sets of crosshairs.
fiddle with the adjustments until they blend together, or appear to. This was told tom e as the way Leupold does it at the factory It seems to work for me.

om
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