LASIK and its "tactical" advantages?

[vandyatc]

I'm considering LASIK.

Has anyone here had it? And more importantly how has it affected your night vision? My vision is terrible without correction, so it's not like it could be a bad thing, but I'm curious how night vision is after LASIK and how it increases confidence in a potential night encounter.

If I get it I'm going all the way with a laser created flap and wavefront technology to hopefully lessen night vision side effects.

I don't want this to be just a "I had LASIK and love it/hate it" thread, but in some ways that's what this is. I'm curious about how well you can focus on longer range targets afterwards as well as just the simplicity of no longer needing contacts or glasses.

Mods- if tactics and training isn't appropriate feel free to move it. It just feels like a preparation tactic/subject to me so might be good here. If not please do with this as you wish.

Thanks in advance for your replies, experiences and opinions.

[tmlynch]

I had LASIK done in 2004. I went from "I can't find my glasses without I glasses" to 20/20 or 20/15 or so.

In sum, it helped my shooting.

I usually wore contacts when shooting before. Now I don't have problems with eyes or lenses drying out and stinging, or with dust.

Mostly I shoot pistol, and I don't have any target focus issues from 7 to 25 yards. I might be a bit more sensitive to the amount of space in the notch of iron sights. That is hard to say, though, because the gun I notice this on was added to the arsenal after surgery. For the most part, it is a non-issue

Regarding nighttime vision, I believe that I still have more "halo" around bright lights at night than I did before surgery. It was worse early on, and has improved, but is still a factor. Not an issue or problem, but a noticeable difference.

Good luck!
Tom

[twhidd]

I had the Lasik procedure done about 7 years ago at age 33 after my first wife left me. Best money I ever spent on myself. My eyes were terrible with astigmatism. Now I'm 20/20 with both eyes open. Focus, long range, and short range are great. I had some problems with halos for a brief time after the procedure, but they almost completely went away after a short time. They're still barely there, but it doesn't really bother me

From a shooting perspective, I can't really give you a before and after comparison because I wasn't much of a shooter before I had the procedure. For years I didn't own but one gun and I didn't shoot it often (thanks again to my first wife).

Tactically speaking, it's a reassuring feeling to know that if you here something go bump in the night, you don't have to reach for your glasses before you reach for your gun. Or worry about them falling off your face during a struggle.

[egor20]

I considered LASIK until I read this, I'm color blind and I've found I have a better night vision than most, so the surgery is not for me.

http://www.usaeyes.org/lasik/faq/lasik-pupil-size.htm

Hope this is what you were looking for.

[Ronbo1]

Depends on how old you are when thinking about lasik. I never had it done but used to be very near sighted and had cataract surgery, new silicon lens in both eyes, the natural lens is ground out, where the lasik work would be, surgery takes about 15 minutes. The correction is built in the new lens now 20-20, can have a bifocal in the lens if wanted for close up, no problems with night vision and the new replacement lens never yellow.

[vandyatc]

Egor, that is stellar information in that article and very helpful!

Thanks!

[atlctyslkr]

I had it about 8 years ago. I can't say it improved my shooting but it sure has improved my quality of life.

[nc eyedoc]

Ronbo 1, thanks for that post. A lot of people don't realize that cataract surgery is a great way to also improve vision. It is easy to correct a very highly nearsighted person to 20/20 or close to 20/20 vision. A cataract occurs when the natural lenses inside your eye becomes cloudy. Everybody eventually gets cataracts. Typical ages for cataract surgery range from 50-70 years old. Of course, if a person gets great distance vision after cataract surgery, they still need bifocals to read. (same thing with Lasik after age 40). I am an optometrist and I tell my cataract surgeon to try for a slight nearsightedness after cataract surgery to get people fairly good all-around vision. And yes, there are new mulifocal implants that do give fairly good vision everywhere, although most designs create halos around lights at night.

On the other hand, if a younger person is considering Lasik, I'd recommend doing a little research on PRK. The military is doing large amounts of refractive surgery on some branches. For example, many Marines have had
refractive surgery. They all get PRK. The recovery is more painful and there is a week of blur, but no flap is created. Many problems with Lasik stem from the cutting and/or healing of the flap. I personally would not consider Lasik, but would PRK if I was a low-to-moderate myope (i.e. -1.00 to -5.00).

And for those that are considering Lasik, be aware that presbyopia (the need for bifocals) will still happen. This happens usually from 40-45 and there go the front sights

[Sport45]

If you want to try Lasik, go for it. But don't do it for any "tactical advantage".

Think about it. You carry a gun so you'll be prepared for the one in a million chance you need it. Should you have your eyes operated on when there's a one in a million chance they'll wind up worse?

I've considered the procedure as well, but my eye Dr. says I'd probably still need glasses after (but with a much weaker prescription). I figure if I have to wear glasses anyway I'll just wear the ones I have.

[billfrombyron]

I didn't have lasik, but I did have PRK which was the only option for 160th SOAR crew chiefs.

Prk is a similar procedure, but no flap cut in the eye. I will never go back!

My night vision is dramatically enhanced, and my vision is 20/15 now.

It hurts like all get out if you forget to be proactivew with your pain meds, but is worth every second of hurt. I had it done in 2005 and have had only one complaint.... I am rather light sensitive and after years of cheap sun glasses I now know the value of a good pair! You will see after your surgery.

My long range shooting has improved greatly as a result.

Don't rule out PRK as a viable option.

Pm me if you want more info on prk.

i Can honestly say after my vascotmy its the best investment in my future I have made........

-Bill

Ps sorry if post is a bit brief, I'm testing out my blackberry torch and had to keep it short.

[vandyatc]

I need to find out more on PRK. It seems to yield superior results but has more pain and side effect issues.

I'm not considering LASIK (or PRK) purely for tactical reasons. Really I'm just curious about the happy side effects on my shooting and how it may differ from just wearing contacts besides the obvious of not having to apply them.

[Tom Gresham]

I've had LASIK and cataract surgery.

The LASIK did not go well. The percentage of bad outcomes is quite a bit higher than the people who do them tell you, in my opinion. It eventually got corrected (think stitched in the eyeball -- wheeeee!), but I still wear glasses.

Cataract surgery can do a lot of correction, and it will greatly improve night vision. Most doctors seem to want to wait until you can barely see before doing cataract surgery. I asked mine, "If we do it now, will I need to redo it later?" No. "Will I see better now if we do it?" Yes.

NOTE: Because you are a shooter, do NOT go with the monovision option where one eye is set up for near vision and one for distance. How are you going to use your near-vision eye for wingshooting, where you need to focus on the target? I have many shooters asking me about this AFTER they get the surgery. Get distance vision correction. When you need cheaters, use cheaters for closeup. (Stick-on bifocals work great for shooting glasses -- 20 bucks -- and make pistol shooting really pleasant.)

[Wag]

I had RK surgery 20 years ago and have never regretted it. Very old school, though!

Nevertheless, the correction to my vision was well worth it. I had night time halos for about a year and they cleared up without further ado. From what I've heard, that effect is far less with the new technologies.

Now that I'm in my mid-40's, age is starting to catch up to me. I've also developed Type II diabetes and between the two of them, I need something to help me focus up close. I use those cheap little readers from the local grocery store counter top and they work just fine. My distance vision is still as sharp as it was when I first had the surgery.

I say go for it. Weigh all of the risks and you'll give yourself the best possible chance.

--Wag--

[Catfishman]

I had LASIK surgery about a year ago. My vision is perfect now, (20/20 and20/15) but I have a little more trouble with glare, day and night. The glare issue has lessened greatly over the past year. I was near sighted, I could read without glasses. After the surgery it is a little harder for me to use rifles with iron sights. My eyes seems to focus a little more slowly. This has improved a lot and may still be improving.

LASIK isn't as smooth as everyone says. I use a laptop all day for my job and it was very difficult to focus on the screen quickly for the first couple of months. Also your eyes have to heal after the surgery. They just don't feel right for a while. One more thing, nobody told me that you lose vision briefly during the surgery. That was a pretty disturbing few seconds for me. There is a some pain and discomfort, nothing you can't handle though. Everyone I spoke to about their LASIK described it as "great" and "painless". When I was laying there experiencing pain and discomfort I was affraid something was wrong. I believe my experience was perfectly normal.

All in all LASIK has helped my deer hunting and day to day quality of life.


BTW - If you enjoy shooting you should see an eye doctor regularly. I hadn't seen one for years before my surgery. My LASIK surgeon discovered that I had Pigmetary Glaucoma. It is debatable whether or not I should have had LASIK with my condition. What's not debatable is that if the Glaucoma hadn't been found I would have irreversably lost some or all of my vision. I was 33 when I was diagnosed.

[nc eyedoc]

Catfishman,

Yes, you do get periods of severe blur during Lasik. You almost lose all vison when they push the microkeratone on your cornea to push it flat, before they cut the flap. Then it gets very blurred when the flap is removed and the laser is being performed.

You must be 34 years old now. You should not yet be experiencing any difficulties with reading vision unless you were overcorrected and are now somewhat farsighted. If this happened, you might be experiencing eye strain when reading or headaches in the evening. People who are overcorrected have more problems later with close vision when they hit 40.

[theinvisibleheart]

There seems to be slight confusion in this thread.

There are at least 3 DIFFERENT KINDS of eye surgery: RK, LASIK, and PRK.

These are 3 different surgical process, sort of like the difference b/w arthroscopy and normal invasive surgery.

RK is still used for astigmatism but you can correct for limited degree of astigmatism with both LASIK and PRK.

Structural weakening is least in PRK and then, LASIK, and then RK. With LASIK, there is a risk of corneal flap dislocation not present in PRK.

The reason for minimal degree of structural weakening in PRK and LASIK is that much of ablation(cutting) involving optical correction is done via computer controlled laser(machine process can be much, much finer than human process).

With or w/o RK/LASIK/PRK, old age hyperopia is relatively common occurrence.

I believe the success rate for LASIK/PRK is >90%. Part of the difficulty lies in controlling the healing process.

[theinvisibleheart]

http://www.lasiksurgerynews.com/blog...-but-possible/

[theinvisibleheart]

by the tools available to them. If all you have is a hammer, then everything looks like a nail to them, LOL.

In real life, unique Pareto optimal solution is not always the case.

What it means, is that there are very, very large no. of people who have had successful results with RK, LASIK and PRK.

HOWEVER, out of those numbers, the number of people who are shooters and read/post on this forum, is probably not even 1/100th of 1%.

So the info you get on this forum is very incomplete, to say the least.

Also, research shows that when people get good results, after a while, they tend to take it for granted and forget all about it. But if they get slightly poor or bad results, they are VERY VOCAL ABOUT IT so if you go only by anecdotal evidences, statistically, unless the process is 100%(most medical process aren't), you tend to get distorted perception of actual cost/benefit ratio.

[69MachOne]

Is Lasik surgery something that has to be redone every so many years? My cousin had PRK 7 years ago & did say recovery was painfull but worth it & a 1 time operation. My situation is that I'm 48, right handed but left eye dominant. My left eye is 20/20 & my right eye is almosy legally blind. I wear 1 contact lens in my right eye. I wonder if I had the surgery if I would be able to become right eye dominant?

[kymarkh]

I have had bad eyesight since I was a child, and I could barely see the numbers on the clock sitting on the nightstand a foot away.

The tactical advantage of Lasik for me is this: if my glasses were ever knocked off, for any reason, I was out of the fight/gunfight unless it was at contact distance. Period. I could not shoot anything past a few yards with any type of face or hand recognition, etc. Now that I have had Lasik, that is not an issue for me.

And my night vision is basically the same as before.

My 2 cents.

[jmortimer]

I am near sighted and in my 50's and just decided to continue with glasses. I use polycarbonate lens and I would need safety glasses to shoot anyway so I'll just keep the glasses. So I don't "see" any tactical advaqntage except in the instance that I lose or misplace my glasses. My close-up vision is excellent and most people my age need reading glasses so I wear mine when I need to see distance. The whole "flap" thing worries me.

[nc eyedoc]

69machone,

, you say your right eye is "almost legally blind". I am assuming you mean that you are very blurred without the contact lenses, but are you correctable to 20/20 with the contact lens? If a person only has good vision possible in one eye, and the other eye can't see well, even with correction, they are a very poor candidate for any refractive surgery.

You also asked about dominancy changing. The visual effect of Lasik would be the same as wearing a contact lens. If you sight with your left eye with the contact, I am sure you would also post-lasik.

You also asked if it has to be repeated years later. That is rarely done with Lasik. The surgeon can lift the flap and do an "enhancement" in the months after surgery, but years later that would be difficult and more risky. Enhancements years later would be more feasible with PRK. Usually refractive surgery is considered to eliminate, or largely eliminate a large prescription. The eyes can certainly drift a little over the years and develop a little myopia or farsightedness, but most of the time no further surgeries are done years later.

And the best all-around situation past the age of 40, is to have good distance vision in one eye and a small amount of nearsightedness in the other.

[doofus47]

The difference is that instead of slicing through the cornea of the eye, flipping back a flap and drilling "under the hood" as with LASIK, PRK slices around the external sides of the cornea. Therefore, there is no flap to pull off (and that flap never heals completely through).

The pros:
++if you're active--I do jiu jitsu and road/mountain biking/cyclo-cross/hunting, then you never have to worry about ripping the flap off your eye and waiting for a corneal transplant.
+You end up with 20/15 or 20/20 vision just as with LASIK.
+If you fly for the Navy, you can get PRK and still fly. Not so with LASIK. (Not that that was a show stopper for this land-lubber).

The cons:
-it hurts like there's sand in your eye for a week after surgery and your vision in the fixed eye is weak. If you've ever scratched your eye, you know what I mean. I got one eye cut at a time and waited 3 weeks between surgeries.
-some people (not me) complain about "dry eyes
-at the end of the day your prescription changes slightly and things get a little fuzzy. You're HD in the AM, but eh-ok in the late PM. Reading tiny street signs at 40 mph can be a challenge while driving. Some days are better than others. I think this explains the "night blindness" I hear about.
-my ability to distinguish green-on-green/green-on-grey/grey-on-grey forms has diminished. I CAN stay out until dark hunting, but my ability to distinguish antlers from tree branches in the murk just before total darkness is not what it used to be. Maybe this can be a plus, if you feel like getting back to camp before 8 pm to grab that first beer after the day is over... :-)

I don't regret my choice. My shooting hasn't suffered. In either case, you will be very happy as you can live a normal 21st century life (home, car, TV, movies) perfectly normally w/out lenses of any stripe.

[Slotback]

Do your homework first. And IF lasik is a viable option for you, then make sure that you follow the post op to the letter.

Best of luck to you. I had it 10 years ago and it was money well spent.

[handgunchick]

I had LASIK way back in 2001, and I also worked as an ophthalmic technician in an ophthalmogist's office for 7 years. Like you, my vision was so lousy that I couldn't see my alarm clock without my glasses. My vision started out as 20/400, then the afternoon of my surgery was 20/20 and has been 20/20 ever since. I had a little bit of halos around light at night short term, but that went away. I haven't had any trouble with glare at all. I had the surgery when it was still new, before the wavefront technology and all of that high tech stuff, and still got a perfect result.

I definitely recommend it because having better vision (even if it's not 20/20) can improve your chances of grabbing your gun and shooting it if an intruder happens upon you in bed, plus it's useful out at the range. However, whatever you do, don't go to cut rate LASIK places. LASIK is definitely something you don't want to do on the cheap, and those cut rate places (I used to work at one) have high, high volume, cheap prices, and little concern for the patient's results or ocular health after the procedure. Bad infections and even blindness can happen without good aftercare.