Here we go again Mayor of Kirkwood, MO shot, 2 officers killed

[MyGunsJammed]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080208/...souri_shooting


Doesnt look good at all...

I wonder what kinda pistol he used? Here is another case of someone "nutty" who should not have had the clearance to buy a firearm.

[Unregistered]

Here is another case of someone "nutty" who should not have had the clearance to buy a firearm.

What had he done in the past that should have kept him from getting "clearance" to buy a firearm?

[MarkoPo]

If the counselmen were properly armed they wouldn't have to resort to throwing chairs to fend off a a shooter with a gun. I bet the gunman wasn't a legal carrier either. This should strengthen the fact that CCW carriers are a valuable part of our society. Like the saying, "When seconds count police are only minutes away." Good think other LEO's were close by or on the scene already. Imagine if he would of had a large capacity magazine. He might not of had to take 3 extra seconds to reload. (Of course I am being scarcastic here).

[MyGunsJammed]

unregistered,

i think they nicknamed him "cookie" or something.....i dont remember....

[ornithoid]

Friday is a bad day for gun news, it seems.

There's the LA shooting with the SWAT officer killed.
There's this one at the council meeting.
Recently there was the five women in the Lane Bryant store killed.
I could swear I remember a few others all in the last few days, plus some more in the last few weeks... Much of it has to do with people who were obviously not prepped to defend themselves.

At least in Florida, government meetings are off limits to CCWers. If you were at a council meeting and used a gun to stop an attacker, chances are you'd be answering for having carried at that venue.

[ornithoid]

Originally Posted by mygunsjammed

i think they nicknamed him "cookie" or something.....i dont remember....

Then what are you basing calling him nutty and firearm-ineligible on?

I mean, we can all look at what he did just now and say, in hindsight, that he must clearly have been someone who we wish had not had access to guns... But what "should" people have seen or known about him that would have kept him from getting "clearance" to buy guns? And does anyone know that he even obtained the guns legally, yet?

It just seems to me that you might have jumped the gun on your assessment of him, and of the system by which he got the guns. For all we know, he stole them in a burglary; and that he might have seemed relatively normal and harmless up until this day.

[Martyn4802]

The guy is a mental case who had harassed the city council for years, and finally, when he didn't get his way in a Court case against the city council, resorted to shooting them. He should have been locked up long ago.

Martyn

[95P38RR]

I bet the Dems will use this in their campaigns.

[chris in va]

More information is coming out, plus a picture.

http://www6.comcast.net/news/article...ouri.Shooting/

[stevelyn]

From what I've read on other forums, it looks like the city govt created another Carl Drega and are getting dirt shoveled on them for their troubles.

[Yellowfin]

Judging by the portrait, I wonder if a certain infamous duo and their affliated organizations will come to defend him and demand apology for the police shooting him. They usually do.

[ornithoid]

Is it forbidden here to talk about who they are and what they're about? I don't want to cross any lines or something, but I am not real fond of political correctness, either.

[Baba Louie]

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/new...A?OpenDocument
Don't know if he was a Carl Drega type or not (I'm sure comparisons will be made), but the shooter sounds like he was more than a little off kilter from his earlier actions in front of the Council.

Revolver and then a police weapon he took from his first victim, Sgt William Biggs (RIP) were used. Biggs somehow managed to 'alert' LEO during his ordeal via radio allowing the Police to respond sooner.

[MyGunsJammed]

Yeah, I would think that his past record of him being disruptive and disrespectful at the town meetings should have "raised a red flag" on him...

I would question a persons sanity if they frequently come into a town hall meeting and embarass themselves by making a scene

[hammer4nc]

From one article...http://www.kansascity.com/116/story/481269.html

Gerald Thornton said his brother’s problems with the city stemmed from disagreements over building permits. Charles Thornton owned a construction company, Cook Co., that was frequently cited for performing work without the proper permits.

Charles Thornton was cited for more than 126 violations totaling around $64,000, Gerald Thornton said.

The city’s arguments were wrong, his brother said, but when Thornton challenged them in court, his arguments were overruled. It was those failures to find justice in the courts that led him to act last night.

Some mention has been made that Kirkwood code enforcement was way over the top, used as a vehicle for other purposes. Combine this with a judicial system designed to be inaccessible for the common man, and to rubber-stamp bureaucrat decisions...well, as Chris Rock put it: "I'm not saying he should have killed them...but I understand."

One possible response could be to re-examine the need for such intrusive regulations on every aspect of society. Naw, in reality, all that will result from this is more heavily fortified public buildings, and new, creative renditions of the sedition act; which will impose penalties (no guns for you), for continuing to express disagreement with public policies.

[homefires]

If I was the Cookie, They would have slapped a court restraining order on my butt based on being a public nuisance.

It seems he has disrupted public meetings more then a few times in the past. As he had a past , he was known to be a squirrel!

[homefires]

Hammer: That's how they are becoming here in New Mexico. They take houses, Properties and if that don't work they Condemn it following some code and you can not occupy it!

He still had other options!

[Baba Louie]

From today's STL Post-Dispatch

Charles Thornton: The legal battles
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
02/09/2008

A look back at some of the civil and criminal cases involving Charles Lee "Cookie" Thornton, 52.

Dec. 17, 1999: Thornton files for bankruptcy, showing debts of $488,430.80. Parties making claims include the state Department of Revenue, Caterpillar Financial Services Corp. and the IRS, as well as $10,425 from state child support services.

May 2001: Thornton is convicted of 19 city violations in Kirkwood. He is fined $12,250.

June 23, 2001: Thornton is charged with assaulting Ken Yost, Kirkwood's public works director.

May 13, 2002: Thornton is convicted of the assault charge against Yost. He is also convicted of 26 ordinance violations, which include parking violations and improper storage of equipment. He is fined a total of $6,200.

Sept. 25, 2003: Thornton sues Kirkwood for malicious prosecution, arguing the city should pay him $12 million. A judge dismisses the case. He appeals to the state Supreme Court, which refuses to take the case and sends it to an appeals court.

Jan. 5, 2004: Thornton files a federal lawsuit against the Missouri Supreme Court for not taking his case. It is dismissed.

April 26, 2005: Missouri appeals court dismisses Thornton's lawsuit against Kirkwood.

May 18, 2006: Thornton interrupts a Kirkwood City Council meeting. He is arrested for disorderly conduct when he refuses to leave.

June 15, 2006: Thornton sets up a poster on an easel with a drawing of a donkey. He leads off with the words "jackass, jackass, jackass." He is arrested for disorderly conducted and is later fined $2,000 for the disorderly conduct citations.

Jan. 16, 2007: Thornton sues Kirkwood in St. Louis County court, accusing the city of "willfully and wrongfully" denying his right to speak at a public meeting. He seeks $15 million and asks the city not be notified before a court decision. He calls it, "Preliminary Injunction Without Notice." Two days later, he files a similar suit in federal court.

June 24, 2007: Thornton pickets outside PJ's Restaurant in Kirkwood. He struggles with owner Paul Cartier. Cartier falls and Thornton stamps on Cartier's leg until bystanders subdue him. Thornton is charged with misdemeanor assault. The criminal case was pending.

Oct. 10, 2007: A St. Louis County judge dismisses Thornton's free speech lawsuit.

Jan. 28, 2008: Thornton's federal lawsuit is dismissed.

Compiled by William C. Lhotka, Joe Mahr, David Hunn and Robert Patrick of the Post-Dispatch

This was an angry violent man who lost all control (Hope had left him years ago)