Optimum pocket pistol caliber: 380? 9mm? 357 Sig? 40? 45?

kcub · June 20, 2013, 02:59 PM

Assumptions: single stack and you actually have to carry it in a pocket.

For me it has been the nine but the xds 45 is tempting; not sure if the height is acceptable.

Nathan · June 20, 2013, 03:24 PM

357 mag. It is the biggest I can put in my pocket and shoot well. Ideally, I would love to have the scandium one. I've shot it fast and it is not bad for 125 gr JHP's.

TailGator · June 20, 2013, 03:39 PM

Presuming that you intend to limit the discussion to semis, since you placed this in the semi-automatic forum, used the word "pistol," and only mentioned pistol calibers:

I find only a few of the 9s that are advertised as pocket pistols to be actually comfortable in the pocket, so I would say .380 and 9 mm. Other folks pocket bigger pistols that I am comfortable with, and I am sure we will hear from some of them, but I can carry IWB anywhere I am fully clothed, so I use pocket carry pretty seldom.

TunnelRat · June 20, 2013, 03:57 PM

Quote:

For me it has been the nine but the xds 45 is tempting

I would be interested in the ballistics of a 45 out of that short of a barrel. If I was limited to 5 shots, I'd take a J frame revolver tbh.

ScotchMan · June 20, 2013, 05:07 PM

I get the feeling the OP is referring to a hypothetical balance between stopping power and capacity. Is 5 .45s "more" than 7 9mms, or the opposite, etc.

There are many metrics you could use to do this, total bullet weight in the gun, total kinetic energy of all the rounds combined, total mass*velocity*numberRounds, etc etc. All of them would lead to different, and probably useless, conclusions.

Ultimately this is a caliber question, and they all stop the same above .380. So the answer is 9mm.

If you bring concealment into it, then it becomes a personal question. If you can conceal a CM9, 9mm. If you can't, .380.

BigJimP · June 20, 2013, 05:13 PM

The smallest I would go ....would be a Sig 239 ...in 9mm ( but its available in .357 Sig or .40S&W )....and I have the 239 in both a 9mm and .40S&W...nice small guns.

It depends ultimately on what fits your hands.../ most all of the .380's are too small for me to shoot --- they just don't fit big hands too well.

http://sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p239.aspx

8 + 1 in 9mm .....and 7 + 1 in .40S&W...( so I'd probably go with the .40S&W ).
( I don't pocket carry mine ...I carry it in a Kramer Horsehide Leather rig / Inside Waist band )...

Old Stony · June 20, 2013, 05:37 PM

They are making a lot of smaller 9's nowdays, so I think a guy could do a lot better than the .380's. I have a passel of .380's, but they just sit in the safe anymore and I carry a Shield instead. Using the mag with the smaller pad on it makes it pretty concealable and not any bigger than some of the .380's

Dirty Dan · June 20, 2013, 09:23 PM

Hmm, My wife and I both have CHL, here in Texas. When my wife qualified, versus renting or buying a pistol to qualify with, she opted to use my full size SR 1911. Shot 50 holes through the target the size of a softball, with about three flyers. Mighty fine shooting for a man or woman. Once she qualified and received her CHL, "we" had to choose a pistol she was comfortable with. We looked at everything from .22WMR, up to and including the .45ACP. Maggie asked Santa to bring her a XDS single stack for X-Mas, along with 165 Gr Hydro Shocks. She was listening when I regaled her with war stories about the legendary man stopping .45 ACP, even if she only has 5 shots..Carries it often, and like she says, it only takes one to take a man off his feet..We Both now carry the Springfield XDS..I like the SR 1911, but in Texas during the heat of the Summer, in a short sleeve shirt, you look as though you a a tumor, and the law in Texas is "Concealed!" Good luck with that one...DD

TunnelRat · June 20, 2013, 09:34 PM

Quote:

She was listening when I regaled her with war stories about the legendary man stopping .45 ACP, even if she only has 5 shots..Carries it often, and like she says, it only takes one to take a man off his feet

Ahh, the power of myth.

Bluestarlizzard · June 20, 2013, 09:40 PM

Whatever dad can fit in his pocket.

No really, you would belive some of the stuff he pocket carries.
It's pretty funny, actually.
He goes to church and the other guys are all talking about there mouse guns they've conceled, discussing how difficult it is and dad laughs at them and calls them over to display whatever fullsize he's got that day.

Theohazard · June 20, 2013, 10:28 PM

Quote:

She was listening when I regaled her with war stories about the legendary man stopping .45 ACP, even if she only has 5 shots..Carries it often, and like she says, it only takes one to take a man off his feet

Ahh, the power of myth.

I'm always amazed at the "stopping power" myths that still exist even though we supposedly have access to better information in the Internet age. I guess we also have easier access to all the myths that persist about the legendary "knockdown power" of rounds like the .45 ACP.

9mm, .40, or .45; with good hollow points they're all the same and they're all vastly underpowered compared to a shotgun or a rifle. So pick the one you shoot best and make sure to practice often.

skoro · June 20, 2013, 10:44 PM

In my personal experience, 9mm works best for a truly pocket concealable pistol.

Kreyzhorse · June 21, 2013, 07:25 AM

I my experience the only guns that I really consider pocket guns are chambered in .380. 9mm and even snub nose revolvers are are just a bit too big for comfort and concealability when jammed in a front pocket.

CDW4ME · June 21, 2013, 09:25 AM

The biggest pistol I can pocket carry (in the right pants) is a Beretta Nano 9mm.
I can pocket carry a P3AT 380 in any pants I wear.

Rifleman1776 · June 22, 2013, 09:59 AM

In my opinion the first requirment for a concealed carry pistol is that it must be concealable. I know there are some tiny .380 and 9mm jobs out there but none are comfortable in my hand or have other drawbacks. Also, I believe for a pistol to be effective one must practice with it and shoot it occasionally. The price of cf ammo is a discouragement to that. Also, my wife would not like the sharp recoil of a cf pistol that weighs only a few ounces and would not practice with it. For that reason, I am about to get two Beretta mod. 21s in .22lr. The .22lr has save my hide three times in the past and I am confident in it for cc.

Dragline45 · June 22, 2013, 11:45 AM

To me there are pocket guns, and then there are true pocket guns. Just because a gun fits in a pocket to me does not make it a pocket gun, otherwise I feel like I am walking around all day with a potato in my pocket. I even found J frames too bulky for pocket carry. So optimum for me would be something like a BG380 or LCP in .380. Anything bigger, even the shield or LC9 will get carried IWB, not only is it more comfortable but about twice as fast on the draw.

FMJ1911 · June 22, 2013, 12:37 PM

A gun in the pocket loaded up with any caliber bullets is a LOT better than a gun at home sitting in a gun safe loaded with the biggest, baddest bullets in the land.

peacefulgary · June 22, 2013, 05:31 PM

For a tiny pocket pistol, I have to go with the .380

Tomac · June 23, 2013, 11:45 AM

.380 is the largest I can pocket carry, I haven't found a 9mm yet that qualifies for true 'pocket carry' by me (YMMV) but the Kahr CM9 w/Covert Carrier combo grip/clip is close enough for my needs:

Tomac

Fishbed77 · June 24, 2013, 02:21 PM

I too have pocket-carried my 9mm Kahr CM9 on occasion. With a DeSantis Nemesis holster and the right pants, it will disappear.

Skans · June 25, 2013, 01:37 PM

self-deleted.

Justice06RR · June 25, 2013, 09:16 PM

I have pocket-carried 3 pistols, two 9mm and a 40S&W. Personally I would never go below 9mm so a 380 like the LCP is out of the question for me.

So for balance of power and capacity, usually the 9mm is the best option IMO

Noreaster · June 25, 2013, 09:45 PM

9mm

Tad_T · June 26, 2013, 12:14 AM

For me, in pants I actually wear and find comfortable, it is my AMT .380 Backup II that I pocket carry.

Anything bigger I carry differently.

I am not going to wear clown pants to have big pockets, but that is just me.

dean1818 · June 26, 2013, 08:28 AM

I used to have a P226 that I could fit into one pair of cargo pants.......

...... Not a reasonable choice

If you pocket carry, IMHO a 38 +p is a great choice in small revolvers

I see people every day jam a too big pistol in their pocket and say...

Look at me..... IT FITS!

The truth is, the semi auto doesnt draw as fast as a small, hammerless revolver

Put a semi auto nose down on a table.

Put an small revolver nose down on a table

The "hump" or back of the slide of the semi auto is at a sharp angle and is the significantly higher point...... This hump causes a slower pocket draw.

Not impossible...... Just slower.......

I have tried every almost every iteration on carry and went away from pocket carry to IWB carry

I thought about situations where I might be sitting and need access to the pistol...... VERY tough to draw from a pocket.

For an example, put your car keys in your pocket, sit down, now quickly get your keys out.......... Its not fast

A pistol would be harder

Imagine a situation where someone jumps on you and the fight is on the ground............ Can you effectively dig in your pocket at that moment?

I would also challenge everyone to try the tueller drill from pocket carry.......

Its doable, but very, very hard from a pocket (i used to have a kahr CM9 that I practiced with)

In some cases it may be the only option, and to answer the OP, 38+P out of an LCR.........but for my 2 cents worth, ( not even worth that)...... There are better carry options

Good luck

June 20, 2013, 02:59 PM	#1
kcub Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2010 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 3,332	Optimum pocket pistol caliber: 380? 9mm? 357 Sig? 40? 45? Assumptions: single stack and you actually have to carry it in a pocket. For me it has been the nine but the xds 45 is tempting; not sure if the height is acceptable.

June 20, 2013, 09:23 PM	#8
Dirty Dan Member Join Date: May 11, 2013 Location: Central Texas Posts: 39	optimum Pocket pistol Hmm, My wife and I both have CHL, here in Texas. When my wife qualified, versus renting or buying a pistol to qualify with, she opted to use my full size SR 1911. Shot 50 holes through the target the size of a softball, with about three flyers. Mighty fine shooting for a man or woman. Once she qualified and received her CHL, "we" had to choose a pistol she was comfortable with. We looked at everything from .22WMR, up to and including the .45ACP. Maggie asked Santa to bring her a XDS single stack for X-Mas, along with 165 Gr Hydro Shocks. She was listening when I regaled her with war stories about the legendary man stopping .45 ACP, even if she only has 5 shots..Carries it often, and like she says, it only takes one to take a man off his feet..We Both now carry the Springfield XDS..I like the SR 1911, but in Texas during the heat of the Summer, in a short sleeve shirt, you look as though you a a tumor, and the law in Texas is "Concealed!" Good luck with that one...DD

June 20, 2013, 10:44 PM	#12
skoro Senior Member Join Date: April 30, 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 1,971	Optimum pocket pistol caliber: 380? 9mm? 357 Sig? 40? 45? In my personal experience, 9mm works best for a truly pocket concealable pistol.

June 21, 2013, 07:25 AM	#13
Kreyzhorse Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2006 Location: NKY Posts: 12,464	I my experience the only guns that I really consider pocket guns are chambered in .380. 9mm and even snub nose revolvers are are just a bit too big for comfort and concealability when jammed in a front pocket. __________________ "He who laughs last, laughs dead." Homer Simpson

June 21, 2013, 09:25 AM	#14
CDW4ME Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2009 Posts: 1,321	The biggest pistol I can pocket carry (in the right pants) is a Beretta Nano 9mm. I can pocket carry a P3AT 380 in any pants I wear. __________________ Strive to carry the handgun you would want anywhere, everywhere; forget that good area bullcrap. "Wouldn't want to / Nobody volunteer to" get shot by _____ is not indicative of quickly incapacitating.

June 20, 2013, 03:24 PM	#2
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,823	357 mag. It is the biggest I can put in my pocket and shoot well. Ideally, I would love to have the scandium one. I've shot it fast and it is not bad for 125 gr JHP's.

June 20, 2013, 03:39 PM	#3
TailGator Senior Member Join Date: May 8, 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 3,809	Presuming that you intend to limit the discussion to semis, since you placed this in the semi-automatic forum, used the word "pistol," and only mentioned pistol calibers: I find only a few of the 9s that are advertised as pocket pistols to be actually comfortable in the pocket, so I would say .380 and 9 mm. Other folks pocket bigger pistols that I am comfortable with, and I am sure we will hear from some of them, but I can carry IWB anywhere I am fully clothed, so I use pocket carry pretty seldom.

June 20, 2013, 05:07 PM	#5
ScotchMan Senior Member Join Date: July 3, 2011 Posts: 1,368	I get the feeling the OP is referring to a hypothetical balance between stopping power and capacity. Is 5 .45s "more" than 7 9mms, or the opposite, etc. There are many metrics you could use to do this, total bullet weight in the gun, total kinetic energy of all the rounds combined, total massvelocitynumberRounds, etc etc. All of them would lead to different, and probably useless, conclusions. Ultimately this is a caliber question, and they all stop the same above .380. So the answer is 9mm. If you bring concealment into it, then it becomes a personal question. If you can conceal a CM9, 9mm. If you can't, .380.

June 20, 2013, 05:13 PM	#6
BigJimP Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2005 Posts: 13,195	The smallest I would go ....would be a Sig 239 ...in 9mm ( but its available in .357 Sig or .40S&W )....and I have the 239 in both a 9mm and .40S&W...nice small guns. It depends ultimately on what fits your hands.../ most all of the .380's are too small for me to shoot --- they just don't fit big hands too well. http://sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/p239.aspx 8 + 1 in 9mm .....and 7 + 1 in .40S&W...( so I'd probably go with the .40S&W ). ( I don't pocket carry mine ...I carry it in a Kramer Horsehide Leather rig / Inside Waist band )...

June 20, 2013, 05:37 PM	#7
Old Stony Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2013 Location: East Texas Posts: 1,705	They are making a lot of smaller 9's nowdays, so I think a guy could do a lot better than the .380's. I have a passel of .380's, but they just sit in the safe anymore and I carry a Shield instead. Using the mag with the smaller pad on it makes it pretty concealable and not any bigger than some of the .380's

June 20, 2013, 09:40 PM	#10
Bluestarlizzard Senior Member Join Date: May 23, 2013 Location: Virginia Posts: 347	Whatever dad can fit in his pocket. No really, you would belive some of the stuff he pocket carries. It's pretty funny, actually. He goes to church and the other guys are all talking about there mouse guns they've conceled, discussing how difficult it is and dad laughs at them and calls them over to display whatever fullsize he's got that day.

June 22, 2013, 09:59 AM	#15
Rifleman1776 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,309	In my opinion the first requirment for a concealed carry pistol is that it must be concealable. I know there are some tiny .380 and 9mm jobs out there but none are comfortable in my hand or have other drawbacks. Also, I believe for a pistol to be effective one must practice with it and shoot it occasionally. The price of cf ammo is a discouragement to that. Also, my wife would not like the sharp recoil of a cf pistol that weighs only a few ounces and would not practice with it. For that reason, I am about to get two Beretta mod. 21s in .22lr. The .22lr has save my hide three times in the past and I am confident in it for cc.

June 22, 2013, 11:45 AM	#16
Dragline45 Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2010 Posts: 3,513	To me there are pocket guns, and then there are true pocket guns. Just because a gun fits in a pocket to me does not make it a pocket gun, otherwise I feel like I am walking around all day with a potato in my pocket. I even found J frames too bulky for pocket carry. So optimum for me would be something like a BG380 or LCP in .380. Anything bigger, even the shield or LC9 will get carried IWB, not only is it more comfortable but about twice as fast on the draw.

June 22, 2013, 12:37 PM	#17
FMJ1911 Junior member Join Date: April 13, 2013 Posts: 46	A gun in the pocket loaded up with any caliber bullets is a LOT better than a gun at home sitting in a gun safe loaded with the biggest, baddest bullets in the land.

June 22, 2013, 05:31 PM	#18
peacefulgary Senior Member Join Date: January 26, 2011 Location: USA Posts: 714	For a tiny pocket pistol, I have to go with the .380

June 23, 2013, 11:45 AM	#19
Tomac Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2001 Location: Caldwell, Idaho Posts: 511	.380 is the largest I can pocket carry, I haven't found a 9mm yet that qualifies for true 'pocket carry' by me (YMMV) but the Kahr CM9 w/Covert Carrier combo grip/clip is close enough for my needs: Tomac __________________ "His Universe, His rules." - Tomac

June 24, 2013, 02:21 PM	#20
Fishbed77 Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2010 Posts: 4,862	I too have pocket-carried my 9mm Kahr CM9 on occasion. With a DeSantis Nemesis holster and the right pants, it will disappear.

June 25, 2013, 01:37 PM	#21
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,331	self-deleted.

June 25, 2013, 09:16 PM	#22
Justice06RR Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2010 Location: Central FL Posts: 1,360	I have pocket-carried 3 pistols, two 9mm and a 40S&W. Personally I would never go below 9mm so a 380 like the LCP is out of the question for me. So for balance of power and capacity, usually the 9mm is the best option IMO

June 25, 2013, 09:45 PM	#23
Noreaster Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2011 Location: New England Posts: 1,449	9mm

June 26, 2013, 12:14 AM	#24
Tad_T Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2012 Location: Idaho Posts: 231	For me, in pants I actually wear and find comfortable, it is my AMT .380 Backup II that I pocket carry. Anything bigger I carry differently. I am not going to wear clown pants to have big pockets, but that is just me.

June 26, 2013, 08:28 AM	#25
dean1818 Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Location: Frisco Texas Posts: 844	I used to have a P226 that I could fit into one pair of cargo pants....... ...... Not a reasonable choice If you pocket carry, IMHO a 38 +p is a great choice in small revolvers I see people every day jam a too big pistol in their pocket and say... Look at me..... IT FITS! The truth is, the semi auto doesnt draw as fast as a small, hammerless revolver Put a semi auto nose down on a table. Put an small revolver nose down on a table The "hump" or back of the slide of the semi auto is at a sharp angle and is the significantly higher point...... This hump causes a slower pocket draw. Not impossible...... Just slower....... I have tried every almost every iteration on carry and went away from pocket carry to IWB carry I thought about situations where I might be sitting and need access to the pistol...... VERY tough to draw from a pocket. For an example, put your car keys in your pocket, sit down, now quickly get your keys out.......... Its not fast A pistol would be harder Imagine a situation where someone jumps on you and the fight is on the ground............ Can you effectively dig in your pocket at that moment? I would also challenge everyone to try the tueller drill from pocket carry....... Its doable, but very, very hard from a pocket (i used to have a kahr CM9 that I practiced with) In some cases it may be the only option, and to answer the OP, 38+P out of an LCR.........but for my 2 cents worth, ( not even worth that)...... There are better carry options Good luck