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Old August 29, 2001, 07:28 AM   #64
Matt Wallis
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2001
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 176
Well let's see... There's lots of stuff been said.

First off, just for the record, gotta agree that many TKD bigwigs totally exaggerate (and sometimes downright lie) about the history and origins of the art. Too bad because it really detracts from what is a fun (and yes, still effective for what it aims to do) art. However, it seems that some of you have swung the pendulum to the completely opposite (and just as extreme) side and are claiming that TKD is basically a fabricated art from Japanese styles with no native Korean arts influence at all. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

Danger Dave said, "there is no verifiable link between any modern Korean art and any ancient Korean martial art."

To which I say, define "verifiable"! I mean, there are Korean TKD masters that can demonstrate skill and competency in their art who can provide the names of instructors they claim to have learned a traditional Korean art from. Choi is a good example. He claims to have learned a traditional Korean art called Taekyon. Is that verifiable? Well seems to me it would be pretty tough to verify (or disprove for that matter). But how is that any different from when Law Dog says, "Once his training was over with sensei Funakoshi, for whatever reason, Mas Oyama studied gojo-ryu under a man named Sodeiju." Correct me if I'm wrong, but this information was probably told to someone at some point by the people involved. Can it be verified? Well I'm sure one could verify whether or not Oyama ever claimed that, but could we verify whether he actually learned that style from the person he claimed to? It would be tough.

[BTW, on a side note, I did read an article in one of the Karate rags years ago about people that claim to still be practicing Taekyon. Doesn't make it so, but it does provide some evidence that it is a real art. In addition, no Asian MA that I know of have extensive "ancient" written records. Lot's of period texts in the West though, but then they lack much of a living tradition. Go figure.]

Dave also said, "In WWII, the practice of martial arts in Japanese occupied territories was strictly controlled. As a result, a lot of the native martial arts died out, or were at least modified/blended with Japanese arts so as to become unrecognizable as separate martial arts."

I agree. This is known history. Kind of embarassing when Koreans deny this, I'll admit. However it would be unlikely (given other historical examples) that native arts would have _completely_ died out. And it is also likely that native arts influenced and changed some of the Japanese arts. So this would still leave a Korean "flavor" to the arts as well as a connection to Korean arts of the past.

"General Choi was not the "father of TKD" - he just suggested the name."

Woa! Here again is the pendulum being swung too far in the other direction. Yes, I know all about the Kwans. And yes I know that modern TKD was "put together" by many of the kwans joining together. In fact, I've heard that each of the leaders of the kwans contributed a form to the style. These are now the "chon-ji" group of forms used by the ITF. (The [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] made new forms after ousting Choi.) But the style developed by Choi is the one that provided the basis for modern TKD. And this is born out by the style itself!

What does Choi claim? He claims that he developed his style from Taekyon and Shotokan. What does TKD look like today? in your own words, "While the kicks are unique, the stances, hand techniques, blocks, the original forms, etc. all come from Shotokan Karate." Hmmmm. Seems to fit the story to me!

Listen, it is always fun to debunk history. I love doing it myself. And the history taught about TKD is ripe for "debunking"! Heh, heh. But I seem to be sensing an "all things Japanese are superior" attitude here. It's just not true, fellas. And I don't see any evidence that would convince me that there is no Korean roots in TKD at all. There's less than what is often claimed, but that's not the same as "none".

Regards,
Matt Wallis
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