The Firing Line Forums - View Single Post - input needed: developing '44 load for a rifle

samoand · January 17, 2006, 03:09 PM

Good time of day, Gentle folks.

I might go on a mission to develop ideal 44 mag load for a rifle from commercially available components, with "ideal" being defined as giving projectile highest momentum. Why momentum? Because it seems to be the best "compromise" metric to balance stopping potential and longer range shooting, taking velocity and weight of projectile equally into consideration.

I have browsed around a bit and realized that even though people tried to develop such loads, the results are still inconclusive. Browsing, however, gave me some ideas about restrictions of the project:

1. Weight of projectile would probably be around 270 gr. In other folks efforts, these numbers seem to produce highest momentum. Although it may be anywhere from 240gr to 300gr.
2. Projectile has to have at least velocity of 1600 fps, otherwise 1:38 rate of twist in most rifles won't let to stabilize it. With length of projectile already being somewhat limited by req. 3, velocity (and therefore rotation speed) is single most important factor to set it stable.
3. Load has to be SAAMI complient, otherwise most rifles won't cycle it.
4. Powder has to be slow burning, possibly slower than traditionally used for heavy projectiles in 44, to take advantage of longer barrel.
5. Because of req. 3 and limited volume of the case, this slow burning powder has to have very high density.

As easily seen, some of these requirements are contradictive in nature; that's why developing such load might be a dead end proposition. Therefore, before I even get to the reloading bench, I'd like to solicit input from more experienced folks. That might save both time and $$$. Another reason is, I would probably attempt to look at powders that are not traditionally used for '44, with limited reloading data for this caliber, yet would like to come out of this project unhurt and not having any of my weapons blown up.

In particular, I'd like to look into using AA1680 loaded up to the max. It seems to satisfy the reqs (slow and dense); it's said to have been developed for 7.62x39 which is in many ways very similar to '44 for reloading purposes. Please provide your input if you ever experienced with it.

Or any other powder not traditionally used for '44, or just on the borderline. The reason I ask about "nontraditional" powders is because data for traditional is readily available from most manufacturers; yet they all seem to view pistol caliber rifles as only a subset rather than a new thing, none of them even consider crossing the line in their testing.

Anyway, speak out. All comments are welcome.

Best regards.

January 17, 2006, 03:09 PM	#1
samoand Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2005 Posts: 211	input needed: developing '44 load for a rifle Good time of day, Gentle folks. I might go on a mission to develop ideal 44 mag load for a rifle from commercially available components, with "ideal" being defined as giving projectile highest momentum. Why momentum? Because it seems to be the best "compromise" metric to balance stopping potential and longer range shooting, taking velocity and weight of projectile equally into consideration. I have browsed around a bit and realized that even though people tried to develop such loads, the results are still inconclusive. Browsing, however, gave me some ideas about restrictions of the project: 1. Weight of projectile would probably be around 270 gr. In other folks efforts, these numbers seem to produce highest momentum. Although it may be anywhere from 240gr to 300gr. 2. Projectile has to have at least velocity of 1600 fps, otherwise 1:38 rate of twist in most rifles won't let to stabilize it. With length of projectile already being somewhat limited by req. 3, velocity (and therefore rotation speed) is single most important factor to set it stable. 3. Load has to be SAAMI complient, otherwise most rifles won't cycle it. 4. Powder has to be slow burning, possibly slower than traditionally used for heavy projectiles in 44, to take advantage of longer barrel. 5. Because of req. 3 and limited volume of the case, this slow burning powder has to have very high density. As easily seen, some of these requirements are contradictive in nature; that's why developing such load might be a dead end proposition. Therefore, before I even get to the reloading bench, I'd like to solicit input from more experienced folks. That might save both time and $$$. Another reason is, I would probably attempt to look at powders that are not traditionally used for '44, with limited reloading data for this caliber, yet would like to come out of this project unhurt and not having any of my weapons blown up. In particular, I'd like to look into using AA1680 loaded up to the max. It seems to satisfy the reqs (slow and dense); it's said to have been developed for 7.62x39 which is in many ways very similar to '44 for reloading purposes. Please provide your input if you ever experienced with it. Or any other powder not traditionally used for '44, or just on the borderline. The reason I ask about "nontraditional" powders is because data for traditional is readily available from most manufacturers; yet they all seem to view pistol caliber rifles as only a subset rather than a new thing, none of them even consider crossing the line in their testing. Anyway, speak out. All comments are welcome. Best regards.