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schmellba99 · April 11, 2013, 01:40 PM

My comment on the Sinclair gauge is that the shouldered portion of the gauge is too thick (not the radius - it measures what it should).

Without a drawing, basically I had to turn down so much of the neck on my .223 that the gauge would have almost no neck tension to hold it in place because the plug portion that bottoms out on the end of the chamber was too thick - I had to turn it down so that there was enough neck on the test cartridge to provide some tension to hold the plug in place, but still allow me to turn the brass neck down enough that the purpose of the plug could be utilized.

I hope that makes sense anyway.

Concerning the neck, we can nit pick everything here to death. There are a great many of you that get way more into minute details that I don't view as being really important concerning reloading rounds. I'm of the opinion that there is such a thing as diminishing returns and that spending countless hours on miniscule details on ammo for something like a milspec AR chamber or even a factory bolt action rifle chamber from any one of the production manufacturers just is not worth the time. Some folks derive great enjoyment out of that, and that is perfectly fine, but we can all agree that for the most part much of what we do as reloaders really goes well above and beyond what is necessary in the vast majority of firearms we own.

Case in point is this discussion about neck length when discussing a mass produced milspec chamber that is designed to be forgiving. A neck that is marginally out of spec is not going to cause problems any more than a chamber that has not been cleaned in 6 weeks and has had a few thousand rounds put through it during the course of battle in some God forsaken environment like Afghanistan or Iraq.

On the neck length discussion for bolt rifles, I can tell you (although I am at work and don't have my data with me) that on my Winchester Model 70 .243 run of the mill production rifle, the neck length is such that I don't have to trim brass very often because of the length from the bolt face to end of the chamber (in fact, I have some brass I purchased new that has 3 or 4 firings on that I still don't have to trim yet). On my Winchester Model 70 .223, I have to trim more frequently, but certainly not every firing. While that may not sit well with the anal retentive group, it suits my needs perfectly as it eliminates/reduces the frequency of an additional step in the reloading process (and one that I don't particularly enjoy doing), so whether or not it makes any difference at all in the overall results of the round's performance (highly doubtful), I like it. Both rifles shoot 1/2" groups at 100 yards and will hold MOA out to 400 (furthest I've shot either for measurement) with my handloaded rounds, which for my hunting purposes is far more than adequate.

Concerning my AR, I don't shoot it for precision. I FL resize every round with my factory run of the mill Hornady dies and load away, trimming every 3rd reload or so back to book spec. I will never spend the time measuring the chamber for a rifle that I never expect match performance out of. Additionally, I like the idea of slightly relaxed tolerances in that rifle so that it functions in less than stellar environments (great when you are hog hunting in the gumbo mud on the Texas gulf coast or are out in the desert in AZ and covered in sand).

In my bolt hunting rifles, I'm more interested in the brass lasting longer than my AR, but I'm not overly concerned about brass life either. In my AR, 4 or 5 reloadings on brass and odds are I'm not going to spend all that much time worrying about it as I don't have the time or desire to start annealing mass quantities of brass (were I to have a Giraud annealer and trimmer, that mentality would likely change).

April 11, 2013, 01:40 PM	#32
schmellba99 Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2008 Posts: 803	My comment on the Sinclair gauge is that the shouldered portion of the gauge is too thick (not the radius - it measures what it should). Without a drawing, basically I had to turn down so much of the neck on my .223 that the gauge would have almost no neck tension to hold it in place because the plug portion that bottoms out on the end of the chamber was too thick - I had to turn it down so that there was enough neck on the test cartridge to provide some tension to hold the plug in place, but still allow me to turn the brass neck down enough that the purpose of the plug could be utilized. I hope that makes sense anyway. Concerning the neck, we can nit pick everything here to death. There are a great many of you that get way more into minute details that I don't view as being really important concerning reloading rounds. I'm of the opinion that there is such a thing as diminishing returns and that spending countless hours on miniscule details on ammo for something like a milspec AR chamber or even a factory bolt action rifle chamber from any one of the production manufacturers just is not worth the time. Some folks derive great enjoyment out of that, and that is perfectly fine, but we can all agree that for the most part much of what we do as reloaders really goes well above and beyond what is necessary in the vast majority of firearms we own. Case in point is this discussion about neck length when discussing a mass produced milspec chamber that is designed to be forgiving. A neck that is marginally out of spec is not going to cause problems any more than a chamber that has not been cleaned in 6 weeks and has had a few thousand rounds put through it during the course of battle in some God forsaken environment like Afghanistan or Iraq. On the neck length discussion for bolt rifles, I can tell you (although I am at work and don't have my data with me) that on my Winchester Model 70 .243 run of the mill production rifle, the neck length is such that I don't have to trim brass very often because of the length from the bolt face to end of the chamber (in fact, I have some brass I purchased new that has 3 or 4 firings on that I still don't have to trim yet). On my Winchester Model 70 .223, I have to trim more frequently, but certainly not every firing. While that may not sit well with the anal retentive group, it suits my needs perfectly as it eliminates/reduces the frequency of an additional step in the reloading process (and one that I don't particularly enjoy doing), so whether or not it makes any difference at all in the overall results of the round's performance (highly doubtful), I like it. Both rifles shoot 1/2" groups at 100 yards and will hold MOA out to 400 (furthest I've shot either for measurement) with my handloaded rounds, which for my hunting purposes is far more than adequate. Concerning my AR, I don't shoot it for precision. I FL resize every round with my factory run of the mill Hornady dies and load away, trimming every 3rd reload or so back to book spec. I will never spend the time measuring the chamber for a rifle that I never expect match performance out of. Additionally, I like the idea of slightly relaxed tolerances in that rifle so that it functions in less than stellar environments (great when you are hog hunting in the gumbo mud on the Texas gulf coast or are out in the desert in AZ and covered in sand). In my bolt hunting rifles, I'm more interested in the brass lasting longer than my AR, but I'm not overly concerned about brass life either. In my AR, 4 or 5 reloadings on brass and odds are I'm not going to spend all that much time worrying about it as I don't have the time or desire to start annealing mass quantities of brass (were I to have a Giraud annealer and trimmer, that mentality would likely change).