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Old December 13, 2011, 11:37 PM   #11
44 AMP
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Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,817
A great many of the European military rifles will shoot high to Americans. Many were "zero'd" for 300 meters. Also it was a common convention in those days that troops were taught to aim at the belt buckle of a standing enemy. That way, the long range zero would still generate a deadly hit if the range estimate was off.

US shooters are used to rifles that put the bullets right where we aim them (and most often at 100yds), so these guns shoot "high".

Our own military rifles from those years also have longer range zeroes than we expect today.

Carcanos are interesting pieces of history, a decent (but not spectacular 6.5mm) in a rather horrid rifle. Not that a good one won't be accurate with the right ammo, but the Carcano design is considered inferior to the Mauser & Springfield both as a sporter and military arm, also well below the British SMLE as a combat arm. Even the Moisin Nagants are better suited to civilian uses, and thats not saying alot.

As a historical collectible, the Italian guns are not the top choices, but they are desirable enough today that I wouldn't make a lamp out of a good one, the way they once did.

If you can find one, get an old Lyman manual. Ones from the 70s still have sections for all those obsolete military rounds. Newer manuals might not.

OK, just checked one of my old manuals, and a newer Hornady one, and there is a drastic difference in max loads. My old Lyman lists a "factory duplication load" with a 160gr RN using IMR 4320 and getting 2267fps from a 21" barrel "Italian service carbine". The newer Hornady manual (7th edition) used a 27" barrel M41 rifle and 6 powders with their .267" 160gr. 4 of the powders maxed out at 2050fps and the other two got to 2200fps! (and IMR 4320 wasn't one of the powders Hornady tested)

Also, Hornady warns only to use the components shown and "absolutely do not reduce charge weights below those shown".

The old Lyman manual also warns you to slug the bore, to determine actual diameter, and if groove diameter is larger than .264 (they used .264 bullets)
and that;
"you could experience gas blow by (gas from the breech due to low pressure) when using the listed starting loads with standard bullet size. We suggest that you wear shooting glasses when working out loads and that you consider the use of cast bullets sized to the exact groove diameter of your particular rifle."

You won't find advice exactly like that in a modern manual!

Note that I'm not putting actual load data in the post, any of it, new or old might not be safe in your rifle, or someone else's. Safely reloading these old warhorse rifles is very specific to the gun you have, due to the wide variations of condition and bore diameter found from one rifle to the next.

We'll be glad to help, as much as we can. Get the rifle checked by a good smith, and the actual bore & groove size determined, and then go from there.
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