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Dave McC · March 20, 2000, 06:40 PM

Folks, I appreciate the,uh, diversity of opinions here on this BB. And, I'm not trying to roil the waters or start any fights, BUT...

There seems to be a mindset that bothers the heckouta me.We've spent many an hour debating the merits of 870s and 500s,590, 1300s et al. We've discussed extension mags,ghost ring sights,ammo and so on until we're blue in the monitors.

But,there's been very little on tactics, and folks here seem to think that an unmodifed, just like from the factory, shotgun is little better than bare hands.
That's far from the truth...

The riot guns we use in our prison systems are what I'm trained on, no bells,no whistles, and no addons at all. They still work rather well.

Back when I was training, I'd give demos. A standard one was a 5 shot exercise, loaded 4+1, weapon shouldered, safety on. At a signal, I'd traverse 5 tombstone targets at 25 yards, getting 90% of the pellets on target or better. Timed, I could do it in 5 seconds,and some said I did it in four occasionally.

A variation,based on our qualifier had me with 4 in the weapon, start on a signal and traverse again, with a combat load for the fifth. Time, around 7 seconds.Again, 90% hits or better.

This isn't bragging. While I'm good, there's no red S on my chest,and other instructors did it also. Anyone think these times and hits are extraordinary? This was done with a stock 870, bead sight, no accessories except sling swivels.

Good form and practice are the keys, not addons and gizmos.

And maybe some of us should shift the focus to more practice and expertise and a little less on the neat toys and contraptions we can buy.

Again, not trying to fight here, but y'all seem to be good folks, but a trifle misguided.

Thanks, and looking forward to some debate here...

March 20, 2000, 06:40 PM	#1
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Folks, I appreciate the,uh, diversity of opinions here on this BB. And, I'm not trying to roil the waters or start any fights, BUT... There seems to be a mindset that bothers the heckouta me.We've spent many an hour debating the merits of 870s and 500s,590, 1300s et al. We've discussed extension mags,ghost ring sights,ammo and so on until we're blue in the monitors. But,there's been very little on tactics, and folks here seem to think that an unmodifed, just like from the factory, shotgun is little better than bare hands. That's far from the truth... The riot guns we use in our prison systems are what I'm trained on, no bells,no whistles, and no addons at all. They still work rather well. Back when I was training, I'd give demos. A standard one was a 5 shot exercise, loaded 4+1, weapon shouldered, safety on. At a signal, I'd traverse 5 tombstone targets at 25 yards, getting 90% of the pellets on target or better. Timed, I could do it in 5 seconds,and some said I did it in four occasionally. A variation,based on our qualifier had me with 4 in the weapon, start on a signal and traverse again, with a combat load for the fifth. Time, around 7 seconds.Again, 90% hits or better. This isn't bragging. While I'm good, there's no red S on my chest,and other instructors did it also. Anyone think these times and hits are extraordinary? This was done with a stock 870, bead sight, no accessories except sling swivels. Good form and practice are the keys, not addons and gizmos. And maybe some of us should shift the focus to more practice and expertise and a little less on the neat toys and contraptions we can buy. Again, not trying to fight here, but y'all seem to be good folks, but a trifle misguided. Thanks, and looking forward to some debate here...