[Jermtheory]

Not really. I respect what your trying to achieve in regards to penetration. But against the types of cover that could be encountered in a urban environment, I am more than satisfied with what the 223 brings to the fight..or, if you like, I am willing to deal with its limitations and adapt.

Unless you are defending against a comparably armed and well-coordinated mob (or even a smaller sized "gang"), the fire-power offered by the 223 is up to the task. I don't expect to reach through cars or cinder block walls to stop a threat on a regular basis. But if I am forced to do so, based on my own observations, I am more than confident that the 223 will be able to do it in a couple or three well placed shots.

For me, the M4-style carbine has proven itself as the best compromise between terminal ballistics and ease of employment. The carbine is as big as I want to get in terms a fighting rifle in the close quarters of a urban environment. The M1A/M-14 is a superb battle rifle, but it is just too big and heavy and wears me out. I dont want to unessasrily fatigue myself when I need to be shootin' and scootin' against a fast moving and street-savvy opponent. (Maybe I should work out some more?)

But like I said, that's me. Certainly, if penetration is king for you, the 7.62x51 will punch that ticket. I wouldn't mind if you showed up at my house to offer a hand in turning back the hordes.

^^^^ agreed.

Still if another caliber could offer me even the smallest of advantage in even the rarest of occassions while still great for the majority of occassions.....why not?

its a trade off.

your "smallest of advantage" comes with other disadvantages.

a trade that i personally wouldnt make...but to each his own.