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Odd Job · June 14, 2008, 06:10 AM

There seems to be a bit of conflict in this thread, and I am going to give you all my 2 South African cents on the matter.

Some time ago, I posted a thread here about a Johannesburg mall/shopping centre incident in which I discharged a firearm during a sequence of events that resulted in the capture of a thief who had also beaten up one security guard and (as far as I could tell at the time) mortally stabbed another one.

The thread is here if you want to read it:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...d.php?t=222887

There are some similarities between what happened there and what happened with divemedic:

1) I never asked to be in that position, but I felt compelled to do something. Unfortunately, because I had not been in that situation before, I had to do things according to my best perception of the situation and the circumstances at hand.
2) That perception and those circumstances can never be fully replicated or described, to the point where you as the reader can confidently say what you would have done in those circumstances. It just isn't going to happen, because you weren't there.

However, when discussing the legalities and tactics of the situation objectively and taking into account only the facts, it is possible for us to have a debate here and arrive at a reasonable conclusion with regards to whether the person (divemedic or me) made any mistakes or put himself or another at greater risk because of his actions. This is all done retrospectively, in the comfort of our armchairs of course.

Nonetheless, as regards my situation in the shop, I accept that I could have handled that better, based on suggestions by TFL members who posted in that thread. There is a chance (not a certainty) that if I am in a similar situation sometime in the future, I will heed that advice and modify my response appropriately. Much will depend on the new circumstances, obviously.

As far as divemedic is concerned, I don't think he should have waited outside the house. I think he did it because that was the best approach he could think of at the time. That was the solution that looked the most viable in those circumstances.

However, in my opinion it will be better (should a similar situation occur again) if divemedic does not come out of the house. There have been clear and rational reasons why it is better not to come out of the house.

Similarly, in my situation, there have been clear and rational reasons why I shouldn't have fired a warning shot and chased an armed thief down a few city blocks. After the stabbing I should have closed the distance and fired COM.
And that's what I should do if it happens again. But it all depends whether I recognise the similarities of the situation and decide to apply the lessons I have learned to minimise risk to myself and others.

June 14, 2008, 06:10 AM	#57
Odd Job Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2006 Location: London (ex SA) Posts: 476	There seems to be a bit of conflict in this thread, and I am going to give you all my 2 South African cents on the matter. Some time ago, I posted a thread here about a Johannesburg mall/shopping centre incident in which I discharged a firearm during a sequence of events that resulted in the capture of a thief who had also beaten up one security guard and (as far as I could tell at the time) mortally stabbed another one. The thread is here if you want to read it: http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...d.php?t=222887 There are some similarities between what happened there and what happened with divemedic: 1) I never asked to be in that position, but I felt compelled to do something. Unfortunately, because I had not been in that situation before, I had to do things according to my best perception of the situation and the circumstances at hand. 2) That perception and those circumstances can never be fully replicated or described, to the point where you as the reader can confidently say what you would have done in those circumstances. It just isn't going to happen, because you weren't there. However, when discussing the legalities and tactics of the situation objectively and taking into account only the facts, it is possible for us to have a debate here and arrive at a reasonable conclusion with regards to whether the person (divemedic or me) made any mistakes or put himself or another at greater risk because of his actions. This is all done retrospectively, in the comfort of our armchairs of course. Nonetheless, as regards my situation in the shop, I accept that I could have handled that better, based on suggestions by TFL members who posted in that thread. There is a chance (not a certainty) that if I am in a similar situation sometime in the future, I will heed that advice and modify my response appropriately. Much will depend on the new circumstances, obviously. As far as divemedic is concerned, I don't think he should have waited outside the house. I think he did it because that was the best approach he could think of at the time. That was the solution that looked the most viable in those circumstances. However, in my opinion it will be better (should a similar situation occur again) if divemedic does not come out of the house. There have been clear and rational reasons why it is better not to come out of the house. Similarly, in my situation, there have been clear and rational reasons why I shouldn't have fired a warning shot and chased an armed thief down a few city blocks. After the stabbing I should have closed the distance and fired COM. And that's what I should do if it happens again. But it all depends whether I recognise the similarities of the situation and decide to apply the lessons I have learned to minimise risk to myself and others.